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	<title>Comments on: Offseason Breakdown: Should the Spurs Trade Manu Ginobili?</title>
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	<link>http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/05/15/offseason-breakdown-should-the-spurs-trade-manu-ginobili/</link>
	<description>A San Antonio Spurs Blog</description>
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		<title>By: Timothy Varner</title>
		<link>http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/05/15/offseason-breakdown-should-the-spurs-trade-manu-ginobili/comment-page-1/#comment-4361</link>
		<dc:creator>Timothy Varner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Jun 2009 14:11:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=2797#comment-4361</guid>
		<description>Ruben,

Two things. 1) You can&#039;t restructure under the CBA and 2) Timmy took a huge pay cut on his contract extension that kicks in next summer.  He&#039;s been there, done that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ruben,</p>
<p>Two things. 1) You can&#8217;t restructure under the CBA and 2) Timmy took a huge pay cut on his contract extension that kicks in next summer.  He&#8217;s been there, done that.</p>
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		<title>By: ruben</title>
		<link>http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/05/15/offseason-breakdown-should-the-spurs-trade-manu-ginobili/comment-page-1/#comment-4349</link>
		<dc:creator>ruben</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Jun 2009 07:36:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=2797#comment-4349</guid>
		<description>I keep hearing everyone say Manu will sign for less, but how about Timmy restructuring his contract???? I think if he were to do something like that it would help the spurs. I know he is the best power-forward to ever play the game, but what has he sacrificed? I think Manu has at least 3 to 4 more great years ahead of him and no one will deny he is a special player. He has already showed he is dedicated to this team at a discount price. Everytime Timmy shows up they throw cash his way. It time for him to step up and show he is dedicated to this team and restructure his contract for the better of the team. Just like Troy Aikman did for the Cowboys back in the day......</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I keep hearing everyone say Manu will sign for less, but how about Timmy restructuring his contract???? I think if he were to do something like that it would help the spurs. I know he is the best power-forward to ever play the game, but what has he sacrificed? I think Manu has at least 3 to 4 more great years ahead of him and no one will deny he is a special player. He has already showed he is dedicated to this team at a discount price. Everytime Timmy shows up they throw cash his way. It time for him to step up and show he is dedicated to this team and restructure his contract for the better of the team. Just like Troy Aikman did for the Cowboys back in the day&#8230;&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: 48 Minutes of Hell &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Late Night Bullets</title>
		<link>http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/05/15/offseason-breakdown-should-the-spurs-trade-manu-ginobili/comment-page-1/#comment-4344</link>
		<dc:creator>48 Minutes of Hell &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Late Night Bullets</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Jun 2009 04:18:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=2797#comment-4344</guid>
		<description>[...] Kyle, author of an excellent Wizards blog called Truth About It, responds to the Manu to D.C. talk with a three-way trade suggestion. He sees a deal that would bring Gerald Wallace, Andray Blatche and the 5th pick to San Antonio. I appreciate his effort, but I see a trade that would bring a player three times as injury prone&#8211;and owed more money&#8211;back to San Antonio.  No thanks.  In terms of trade suggestions, Kyle has done a good job here. But I&#8217;m increasingly of the position that trading Ginobili doesn&#8217;t make sense.  [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Kyle, author of an excellent Wizards blog called Truth About It, responds to the Manu to D.C. talk with a three-way trade suggestion. He sees a deal that would bring Gerald Wallace, Andray Blatche and the 5th pick to San Antonio. I appreciate his effort, but I see a trade that would bring a player three times as injury prone&#8211;and owed more money&#8211;back to San Antonio.  No thanks.  In terms of trade suggestions, Kyle has done a good job here. But I&#8217;m increasingly of the position that trading Ginobili doesn&#8217;t make sense.  [...]</p>
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		<title>By: 48 Minutes of Hell &#187; Blog Archive &#187; And So It Begins</title>
		<link>http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/05/15/offseason-breakdown-should-the-spurs-trade-manu-ginobili/comment-page-1/#comment-4089</link>
		<dc:creator>48 Minutes of Hell &#187; Blog Archive &#187; And So It Begins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Jun 2009 15:17:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=2797#comment-4089</guid>
		<description>[...] few weeks ago I tackled the subject of whether or not the Spurs should consider trading Manu Ginobili. In that post I said that there was no reason to suspect that they would, and that they [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] few weeks ago I tackled the subject of whether or not the Spurs should consider trading Manu Ginobili. In that post I said that there was no reason to suspect that they would, and that they [...]</p>
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		<title>By: EO</title>
		<link>http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/05/15/offseason-breakdown-should-the-spurs-trade-manu-ginobili/comment-page-1/#comment-3959</link>
		<dc:creator>EO</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 27 May 2009 19:40:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=2797#comment-3959</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s crazy to think Ginobli is done.  As long as he&#039;s given time to heal and his minutes during the regular season are severely limited, Ginobli will be great in the playoffs.  Maybe increase his minutes the last 10 games of the season, but that&#039;s all he needs.  So if he&#039;s going to be traded, it can&#039;t be for chump change.

How about... Ginobli and the Red Rocket to Bulls for Hinrich, Tyrus Thomas (if they really have given up on the kid) and picks #16 and #26.  Maybe give them a second rounder to even things out.

Hinrich would be great as a backup point PG/starting SG and Thomas would fit in smoothly as a starting SF/backup PF.

Look I don&#039;t think the window has closed for another championship (despite previous post for change).  So if Ginobli is traded, we need return value.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s crazy to think Ginobli is done.  As long as he&#8217;s given time to heal and his minutes during the regular season are severely limited, Ginobli will be great in the playoffs.  Maybe increase his minutes the last 10 games of the season, but that&#8217;s all he needs.  So if he&#8217;s going to be traded, it can&#8217;t be for chump change.</p>
<p>How about&#8230; Ginobli and the Red Rocket to Bulls for Hinrich, Tyrus Thomas (if they really have given up on the kid) and picks #16 and #26.  Maybe give them a second rounder to even things out.</p>
<p>Hinrich would be great as a backup point PG/starting SG and Thomas would fit in smoothly as a starting SF/backup PF.</p>
<p>Look I don&#8217;t think the window has closed for another championship (despite previous post for change).  So if Ginobli is traded, we need return value.</p>
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		<title>By: mark</title>
		<link>http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/05/15/offseason-breakdown-should-the-spurs-trade-manu-ginobili/comment-page-1/#comment-3948</link>
		<dc:creator>mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 27 May 2009 02:46:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=2797#comment-3948</guid>
		<description>let the big three play until they are done- 2yrs, then with parker left--go get AMARE or some other high price talent to be parker&#039;s new sidekick.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>let the big three play until they are done- 2yrs, then with parker left&#8211;go get AMARE or some other high price talent to be parker&#8217;s new sidekick.</p>
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		<title>By: EO</title>
		<link>http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/05/15/offseason-breakdown-should-the-spurs-trade-manu-ginobili/comment-page-1/#comment-3906</link>
		<dc:creator>EO</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 May 2009 15:46:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=2797#comment-3906</guid>
		<description>Trade Parker.  Keep Ginobli.

Look Parker doesn&#039;t play D.  Yes he&#039;s great on offense, but he&#039;s not a traditional point guard which the spurs of the future need.

Trade Parker and Bowen to the Griz for Mike Conley, D. Milicic and picks #2 and #27.

Then trade pick #2 (if Griffin is picked first) to Kings for picks #4 and #23.

Draft Harden for Sg, Daye or Casspi for SF, and Lawal for toughness at PF.  With second round picks draft foreigners who will develop overseas.

These way we&#039;ll have young players with talent and still have a chance at a big name free agent in 2010.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Trade Parker.  Keep Ginobli.</p>
<p>Look Parker doesn&#8217;t play D.  Yes he&#8217;s great on offense, but he&#8217;s not a traditional point guard which the spurs of the future need.</p>
<p>Trade Parker and Bowen to the Griz for Mike Conley, D. Milicic and picks #2 and #27.</p>
<p>Then trade pick #2 (if Griffin is picked first) to Kings for picks #4 and #23.</p>
<p>Draft Harden for Sg, Daye or Casspi for SF, and Lawal for toughness at PF.  With second round picks draft foreigners who will develop overseas.</p>
<p>These way we&#8217;ll have young players with talent and still have a chance at a big name free agent in 2010.</p>
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		<title>By: FromSouthAmerica</title>
		<link>http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/05/15/offseason-breakdown-should-the-spurs-trade-manu-ginobili/comment-page-1/#comment-3887</link>
		<dc:creator>FromSouthAmerica</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 May 2009 00:56:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=2797#comment-3887</guid>
		<description>BLASPHEMY. The big three&#039;s compatabilty and chemistry is what won championships. You cannot just replace one and expect the same results that took years to build and execute. It would take someone whose pure skill outweighs that chemistry, and if it comes to that we become just like the other teams in the league. By the way the skill required to overcome the chemistry I just mentioned would take no one short of LeBron, Kobe, or Dwayne. Don&#039;t see us making that anytime soon. We must keep the core components to win another championship. And those are Pop, Tony, Tim, and MANU. Break that up, and we are not the Spurs we have become.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>BLASPHEMY. The big three&#8217;s compatabilty and chemistry is what won championships. You cannot just replace one and expect the same results that took years to build and execute. It would take someone whose pure skill outweighs that chemistry, and if it comes to that we become just like the other teams in the league. By the way the skill required to overcome the chemistry I just mentioned would take no one short of LeBron, Kobe, or Dwayne. Don&#8217;t see us making that anytime soon. We must keep the core components to win another championship. And those are Pop, Tony, Tim, and MANU. Break that up, and we are not the Spurs we have become.</p>
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		<title>By: Timothy Varner</title>
		<link>http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/05/15/offseason-breakdown-should-the-spurs-trade-manu-ginobili/comment-page-1/#comment-3872</link>
		<dc:creator>Timothy Varner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 May 2009 16:37:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=2797#comment-3872</guid>
		<description>You make a good point. But winning is most important to fan support. That supersedes all other concerns.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You make a good point. But winning is most important to fan support. That supersedes all other concerns.</p>
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		<title>By: ThatBigGuy</title>
		<link>http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/05/15/offseason-breakdown-should-the-spurs-trade-manu-ginobili/comment-page-1/#comment-3867</link>
		<dc:creator>ThatBigGuy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 May 2009 15:52:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=2797#comment-3867</guid>
		<description>Simmons is my favorite writer. His trades may make sense with regards to financial or position situation, but he&#039;s not a Spurs fan. It&#039;s easy to to make an objective trade from L.A. But there are so many more things involved in trading Manu or Tony other than just money. I promise you that the Front Office knows how important each guy is to the community at large. How many sponsors might you lose if Manu is traded from the latino-rich SA area? Would season ticket sales be affected if Tony is traded for Foye? Could there be an all out riot if either is traded away? All I&#039;m saying is that it&#039;s way too easy to propose a trade without really understanding how much that player means to a community. 

The Spurs have always been known as the team that does the Right Thing. They are the model franchise in all aspects, and for this reason, they will never trade Duncan. He made them into the 3rd greatest franchise of all time and they know he deserves to retire with grace and class as a Spur.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Simmons is my favorite writer. His trades may make sense with regards to financial or position situation, but he&#8217;s not a Spurs fan. It&#8217;s easy to to make an objective trade from L.A. But there are so many more things involved in trading Manu or Tony other than just money. I promise you that the Front Office knows how important each guy is to the community at large. How many sponsors might you lose if Manu is traded from the latino-rich SA area? Would season ticket sales be affected if Tony is traded for Foye? Could there be an all out riot if either is traded away? All I&#8217;m saying is that it&#8217;s way too easy to propose a trade without really understanding how much that player means to a community. </p>
<p>The Spurs have always been known as the team that does the Right Thing. They are the model franchise in all aspects, and for this reason, they will never trade Duncan. He made them into the 3rd greatest franchise of all time and they know he deserves to retire with grace and class as a Spur.</p>
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		<title>By: Timothy Varner</title>
		<link>http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/05/15/offseason-breakdown-should-the-spurs-trade-manu-ginobili/comment-page-1/#comment-3858</link>
		<dc:creator>Timothy Varner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 May 2009 20:28:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=2797#comment-3858</guid>
		<description>Joe,

Lots of good stuff in your comment. I agree with most of it. But I think young players take time to develop. The Spurs need to strike a balance. There are few players I expect the Spurs to draft this year that will actually help them next season. It just isn&#039;t likely. I hope it happens, but the odds are not in their favor. The players that are in their current range whom I like are a year or two away, and I&#039;m an optimist.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Joe,</p>
<p>Lots of good stuff in your comment. I agree with most of it. But I think young players take time to develop. The Spurs need to strike a balance. There are few players I expect the Spurs to draft this year that will actually help them next season. It just isn&#8217;t likely. I hope it happens, but the odds are not in their favor. The players that are in their current range whom I like are a year or two away, and I&#8217;m an optimist.</p>
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		<title>By: 48 Minutes of Hell &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Draft Scuttlebutt</title>
		<link>http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/05/15/offseason-breakdown-should-the-spurs-trade-manu-ginobili/comment-page-1/#comment-3856</link>
		<dc:creator>48 Minutes of Hell &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Draft Scuttlebutt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 May 2009 19:26:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=2797#comment-3856</guid>
		<description>[...] the Bulls are trying to move Tyrus Thomas. Last week, I suggested the Bulls could make a play for Manu Ginobili by offering Gordon and Thomas. It was pure conjecture, and I didn&#8217;t like the imagined deal, but it seems worth [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] the Bulls are trying to move Tyrus Thomas. Last week, I suggested the Bulls could make a play for Manu Ginobili by offering Gordon and Thomas. It was pure conjecture, and I didn&#8217;t like the imagined deal, but it seems worth [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Joe</title>
		<link>http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/05/15/offseason-breakdown-should-the-spurs-trade-manu-ginobili/comment-page-1/#comment-3854</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 May 2009 19:05:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=2797#comment-3854</guid>
		<description>Tim,

I agree about Simmons &amp; Hollinger -- I love their stuff.  In their own ways, they both bring a very unique and well-informed approach to their analysis, and I always read their stuff when I have a chance.  That said, every writer brings their own perspective and background to each piece they write that leads to some natural strengths and weaknesses.  I don&#039;t think that Simmons&#039; strength is proposing trades, but otherwise, I love his stuff.

About this year&#039;s draft, I think you have to put the criticism of this year&#039;s talent in perspective.  If you&#039;re a franchise that needs another superstar, this year is a terrible draft.  If you just need a decent rotation player, it&#039;s not such a bad year to have a mid- or late-round pick.  How good you think this draft is really depends on your franchise&#039;s need.  Take the much acclaimed 2003 draft, for example.  That was a great year to have a 1 - 9 pick.  However, look at who went between picks 9 &amp; 27 -- only one player has a career scoring average over 10PPG.  Now look at the &#039;terrible&#039; 2001 Kwame Brown draft.  There were almost no superstars in the 1st round, but in picks 9 - 27, you had Joe Johnson, Richard Jefferson, Zach Randolph, Gerald Wallace, and Troy Murphy, not to mention Tony at #28 and Agent Zero at #31.  Those are pretty good rotation players at those picks in the draft.

Obviously, these kinds of things are a judgment call about the relative risk/benefit ratio, but I think the guys that might be available in the mid-round picks I mentioned above are definitely worth the gamble.  An extra ~$1.5 million in guaranteed contracts for 2010 isn&#039;t a big hit to our cap space.  

Another way to look at it:  what veteran that might be available this summer could help us so much more than the draft picks that might be available at the slots I mentioned that they would be a better investment of that money?  The only FA that I see on the list this year who might sign for about the same amount as a mid-1st round pick would cost and who would fit a need for us is Grant Hill -- he&#039;d be a substantial upgrade over Finley at the 3 on the defensive side, he could handle some spot point duty, and he might take a 1-year deal if he thought it would get him a ring.  Other than that, why wouldn&#039;t we take a chance on Ty Lawson, Eric Maynor, or James Johnson and try to develop a second unit that can run to give us another look on offense when the big 3 rest?  Especially if we could get a speedy PG, that might allow us to go very small for stretches when we need a shot in the arm on offense and move Tony over to the 2. We had a lot of success playing a controlled running game in 2003 &amp; 2005 that Avery copied and used to take Dallas to the Finals in 2006; I don&#039;t see why that couldn&#039;t work for us again.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tim,</p>
<p>I agree about Simmons &amp; Hollinger &#8212; I love their stuff.  In their own ways, they both bring a very unique and well-informed approach to their analysis, and I always read their stuff when I have a chance.  That said, every writer brings their own perspective and background to each piece they write that leads to some natural strengths and weaknesses.  I don&#8217;t think that Simmons&#8217; strength is proposing trades, but otherwise, I love his stuff.</p>
<p>About this year&#8217;s draft, I think you have to put the criticism of this year&#8217;s talent in perspective.  If you&#8217;re a franchise that needs another superstar, this year is a terrible draft.  If you just need a decent rotation player, it&#8217;s not such a bad year to have a mid- or late-round pick.  How good you think this draft is really depends on your franchise&#8217;s need.  Take the much acclaimed 2003 draft, for example.  That was a great year to have a 1 &#8211; 9 pick.  However, look at who went between picks 9 &amp; 27 &#8212; only one player has a career scoring average over 10PPG.  Now look at the &#8216;terrible&#8217; 2001 Kwame Brown draft.  There were almost no superstars in the 1st round, but in picks 9 &#8211; 27, you had Joe Johnson, Richard Jefferson, Zach Randolph, Gerald Wallace, and Troy Murphy, not to mention Tony at #28 and Agent Zero at #31.  Those are pretty good rotation players at those picks in the draft.</p>
<p>Obviously, these kinds of things are a judgment call about the relative risk/benefit ratio, but I think the guys that might be available in the mid-round picks I mentioned above are definitely worth the gamble.  An extra ~$1.5 million in guaranteed contracts for 2010 isn&#8217;t a big hit to our cap space.  </p>
<p>Another way to look at it:  what veteran that might be available this summer could help us so much more than the draft picks that might be available at the slots I mentioned that they would be a better investment of that money?  The only FA that I see on the list this year who might sign for about the same amount as a mid-1st round pick would cost and who would fit a need for us is Grant Hill &#8212; he&#8217;d be a substantial upgrade over Finley at the 3 on the defensive side, he could handle some spot point duty, and he might take a 1-year deal if he thought it would get him a ring.  Other than that, why wouldn&#8217;t we take a chance on Ty Lawson, Eric Maynor, or James Johnson and try to develop a second unit that can run to give us another look on offense when the big 3 rest?  Especially if we could get a speedy PG, that might allow us to go very small for stretches when we need a shot in the arm on offense and move Tony over to the 2. We had a lot of success playing a controlled running game in 2003 &amp; 2005 that Avery copied and used to take Dallas to the Finals in 2006; I don&#8217;t see why that couldn&#8217;t work for us again.</p>
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		<title>By: Timothy Varner</title>
		<link>http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/05/15/offseason-breakdown-should-the-spurs-trade-manu-ginobili/comment-page-1/#comment-3853</link>
		<dc:creator>Timothy Varner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 May 2009 18:38:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=2797#comment-3853</guid>
		<description>Rick,

Your question might be the most common complaint amongst Spurs fans.  The Scola thing was a big mistake, but it was mostly cap-related. The short answer is to say that the Spurs needed to move Jackie Butler&#039;s contract and Scola was the sugar coat to his hard pill. In hindsight, they should have found some other way to get under the tax, including letting either Bonner or Oberto walk. Water under the bridge.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rick,</p>
<p>Your question might be the most common complaint amongst Spurs fans.  The Scola thing was a big mistake, but it was mostly cap-related. The short answer is to say that the Spurs needed to move Jackie Butler&#8217;s contract and Scola was the sugar coat to his hard pill. In hindsight, they should have found some other way to get under the tax, including letting either Bonner or Oberto walk. Water under the bridge.</p>
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		<title>By: Rick</title>
		<link>http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/05/15/offseason-breakdown-should-the-spurs-trade-manu-ginobili/comment-page-1/#comment-3852</link>
		<dc:creator>Rick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 May 2009 18:30:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=2797#comment-3852</guid>
		<description>Should have traded Oberto to the Rockets and kept Scolia!  We wouldn&#039;t be talking about Spurs talent getting older!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Should have traded Oberto to the Rockets and kept Scolia!  We wouldn&#8217;t be talking about Spurs talent getting older!</p>
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