Comments on: Falling Down an Elevator Shaft and Landing in a Pool of Mermaids http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/08/12/falling-down-an-elevator-shaft-and-landing-in-a-pool-of-mermaids/ A San Antonio Spurs Blog Thu, 11 Mar 2010 20:07:27 -0800 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4 hourly 1 By: Andrew Bynum is a Game-Changer | 48 Minutes of Hell http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/08/12/falling-down-an-elevator-shaft-and-landing-in-a-pool-of-mermaids/comment-page-1/#comment-10014 Andrew Bynum is a Game-Changer | 48 Minutes of Hell Mon, 16 Nov 2009 04:13:40 +0000 http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=3816#comment-10014 [...] the offseason, I suggested that the Lakers had begun a movement of super-contenders by changing the model for winning an NBA championship from 3 stars and a bunch of role players to a [...] [...] the offseason, I suggested that the Lakers had begun a movement of super-contenders by changing the model for winning an NBA championship from 3 stars and a bunch of role players to a [...]

]]> By: NBA: The Arms Race to the Top … « Spurs Basketball http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/08/12/falling-down-an-elevator-shaft-and-landing-in-a-pool-of-mermaids/comment-page-1/#comment-9136 NBA: The Arms Race to the Top … « Spurs Basketball Sun, 18 Oct 2009 13:29:54 +0000 http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=3816#comment-9136 [...] me try to give you guys a closer look at what I think (or most people think?) are the top teams (or the ‘Super contenders’ as Tim Varner of 48MoH puts it) that will compete for the NBA crown this coming [...] [...] me try to give you guys a closer look at what I think (or most people think?) are the top teams (or the ‘Super contenders’ as Tim Varner of 48MoH puts it) that will compete for the NBA crown this coming [...]

]]> By: alamobro http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/08/12/falling-down-an-elevator-shaft-and-landing-in-a-pool-of-mermaids/comment-page-1/#comment-6907 alamobro Mon, 17 Aug 2009 03:43:56 +0000 http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=3816#comment-6907 Timothy, I was the first person on this post to disagree that Andrew Bynum is a star. While i stand by that, I admit i wouldnt exactly mind if Andrew was the starting center for the Spurs.... If hes healthy next season, the scaling of Mount Los Angeles will be significantly more difficult. Timothy, I was the first person on this post to disagree that Andrew Bynum is a star.

While i stand by that, I admit i wouldnt exactly mind if Andrew was the starting center for the Spurs….

If hes healthy next season, the scaling of Mount Los Angeles will be significantly more difficult.

]]> By: Cory Clay http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/08/12/falling-down-an-elevator-shaft-and-landing-in-a-pool-of-mermaids/comment-page-1/#comment-6841 Cory Clay Sat, 15 Aug 2009 02:22:36 +0000 http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=3816#comment-6841 No problem Robby. No problem Robby.

]]> By: 48 Minutes of Hell » Blog Archive » Love for Combo Guards http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/08/12/falling-down-an-elevator-shaft-and-landing-in-a-pool-of-mermaids/comment-page-1/#comment-6811 48 Minutes of Hell » Blog Archive » Love for Combo Guards Fri, 14 Aug 2009 15:31:22 +0000 http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=3816#comment-6811 [...] a recent post, I made a couple suggestions that are regarded with suspicion by some of our readers.  First, some [...] [...] a recent post, I made a couple suggestions that are regarded with suspicion by some of our readers.  First, some [...]

]]> By: Tim in Surrey http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/08/12/falling-down-an-elevator-shaft-and-landing-in-a-pool-of-mermaids/comment-page-1/#comment-6809 Tim in Surrey Fri, 14 Aug 2009 14:36:10 +0000 http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=3816#comment-6809 About Bynum: I think he can be a star and showed that he was on the verge of it for some long stretches last season, before breaking down. But although he's a first-rate talent and LA is well known for developing players, it still remains to be seen whether he can convert those flashes into consistent stellar production over a period of years. And for a young player he has had a lot of injury problems already. But the real point is that LA essentially won the title without him. Technically he was on the roster but he certainly wasn't playing at a star level. So LA in 2009 still fits the 3-star model, from my point of view. If you'd like a good example of champions that didn't follow that model, I think you either have to look at Houston in the 90s (Olajuwon, Drexler, and co.) and possibly Detroit's back-to-back teams (Dumars, Thomas, and co.), or go all the way back to the West Coast champs of the 70s (GS, Portland, and Seattle). Portland fans will argue that Lucas was a true star but he certainly wasn't a big one. It was really just Walton & Luke plus a bunch of future coaches and GMs, all led by Dr. Jack. Seattle had a great pair of guards (Johnson and Williams) plus another bunch of future coaches and GMs, all led by Lenny Wilkens. Golden State? Well, there were guys on the roster other than Rick Barry who were stars--but not really during that year. (Jamaal Wilkes is a good example. He was not yet at that star level.) The interesting point about all of this is that the only teams that I can think of that didn't follow the 3-star model, going back more than 45 years, either had a truly dominant defensive center (Russell, Walton, Olajuwon) or did it with a legendary backcourt duo. And those backcourt-dominated champions each had two guys who could pass AND score AND defend either position, at elite levels. As rare as those guys are, though, it's probably easier to get two of them than a great defensive center. Everybody likes to scorn the "combo guard" but just think about how many great teams have been built around them! It would be interesting to see how a team with Dwyane Wade and Chris Paul, surrounded by a deep roster of quality role-players and an excellent coach, would fare today (just to take one example). The Spurs might want to try it in a couple of years by pairing Parker with someone like Derrick Rose or John Wall... About Bynum: I think he can be a star and showed that he was on the verge of it for some long stretches last season, before breaking down. But although he’s a first-rate talent and LA is well known for developing players, it still remains to be seen whether he can convert those flashes into consistent stellar production over a period of years. And for a young player he has had a lot of injury problems already. But the real point is that LA essentially won the title without him. Technically he was on the roster but he certainly wasn’t playing at a star level. So LA in 2009 still fits the 3-star model, from my point of view.

If you’d like a good example of champions that didn’t follow that model, I think you either have to look at Houston in the 90s (Olajuwon, Drexler, and co.) and possibly Detroit’s back-to-back teams (Dumars, Thomas, and co.), or go all the way back to the West Coast champs of the 70s (GS, Portland, and Seattle). Portland fans will argue that Lucas was a true star but he certainly wasn’t a big one. It was really just Walton & Luke plus a bunch of future coaches and GMs, all led by Dr. Jack. Seattle had a great pair of guards (Johnson and Williams) plus another bunch of future coaches and GMs, all led by Lenny Wilkens. Golden State? Well, there were guys on the roster other than Rick Barry who were stars–but not really during that year. (Jamaal Wilkes is a good example. He was not yet at that star level.)

The interesting point about all of this is that the only teams that I can think of that didn’t follow the 3-star model, going back more than 45 years, either had a truly dominant defensive center (Russell, Walton, Olajuwon) or did it with a legendary backcourt duo. And those backcourt-dominated champions each had two guys who could pass AND score AND defend either position, at elite levels. As rare as those guys are, though, it’s probably easier to get two of them than a great defensive center. Everybody likes to scorn the “combo guard” but just think about how many great teams have been built around them! It would be interesting to see how a team with Dwyane Wade and Chris Paul, surrounded by a deep roster of quality role-players and an excellent coach, would fare today (just to take one example). The Spurs might want to try it in a couple of years by pairing Parker with someone like Derrick Rose or John Wall…

]]> By: Robby http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/08/12/falling-down-an-elevator-shaft-and-landing-in-a-pool-of-mermaids/comment-page-1/#comment-6801 Robby Fri, 14 Aug 2009 05:27:30 +0000 http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=3816#comment-6801 My bad Cory... got your point. My bad Cory… got your point.

]]> By: Cory Clay http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/08/12/falling-down-an-elevator-shaft-and-landing-in-a-pool-of-mermaids/comment-page-1/#comment-6796 Cory Clay Fri, 14 Aug 2009 04:20:58 +0000 http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=3816#comment-6796 Robby, I'm aware that Tim didn't compare Bynum and Ian, I was commenting on some of the posters that did, such as Duaneofly and Rikiddo. In fact in my post I stated that I agreed with the inclusion of Bynum in the 4 Star Model. So if you're going to reference a post, make sure you read it fully. Robby,
I’m aware that Tim didn’t compare Bynum and Ian, I was commenting on some of the posters that did, such as Duaneofly and Rikiddo.

In fact in my post I stated that I agreed with the inclusion of Bynum in the 4 Star Model. So if you’re going to reference a post, make sure you read it fully.

]]> By: 48 Minutes of Hell » Blog Archive » The Embrace of Limitation http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/08/12/falling-down-an-elevator-shaft-and-landing-in-a-pool-of-mermaids/comment-page-1/#comment-6763 48 Minutes of Hell » Blog Archive » The Embrace of Limitation Thu, 13 Aug 2009 16:04:29 +0000 http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=3816#comment-6763 [...] about Falling Down an Elevator Shaft and Landing in a Pool of Mermaids [...] [...] about Falling Down an Elevator Shaft and Landing in a Pool of Mermaids [...]

]]> By: idahospur http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/08/12/falling-down-an-elevator-shaft-and-landing-in-a-pool-of-mermaids/comment-page-1/#comment-6762 idahospur Thu, 13 Aug 2009 15:55:53 +0000 http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=3816#comment-6762 The Spurs have created a championship team but really is attacked due to age and potential injuries. Any player in the NBA can have a season-ending injury at any moment, but the Spurs are on the chopping block because of past events. The Spurs have created a championship team but really is attacked due to age and potential injuries. Any player in the NBA can have a season-ending injury at any moment, but the Spurs are on the chopping block because of past events.

]]> By: NL http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/08/12/falling-down-an-elevator-shaft-and-landing-in-a-pool-of-mermaids/comment-page-1/#comment-6761 NL Thu, 13 Aug 2009 13:07:43 +0000 http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=3816#comment-6761 I think it's been that way for the past two years. I don't think Rondo was a star when the Celtics won, either, but he was a tremendous fourth wheel star that is certainly on his way now. Now, you can probably consider Bynum a 5th wheel star, but I agree with everyone else that the potential is there for much more. I feel bad for those teams who aren't in the supercontenders league because, as you mentioned, not many outside them have a shot at the title. But the fact that the Spurs are in it makes this season that much more exciting; I can't wait for them to take on the Lakers and C's. I think it’s been that way for the past two years. I don’t think Rondo was a star when the Celtics won, either, but he was a tremendous fourth wheel star that is certainly on his way now. Now, you can probably consider Bynum a 5th wheel star, but I agree with everyone else that the potential is there for much more.

I feel bad for those teams who aren’t in the supercontenders league because, as you mentioned, not many outside them have a shot at the title. But the fact that the Spurs are in it makes this season that much more exciting; I can’t wait for them to take on the Lakers and C’s.

]]> By: Robby http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/08/12/falling-down-an-elevator-shaft-and-landing-in-a-pool-of-mermaids/comment-page-1/#comment-6760 Robby Thu, 13 Aug 2009 08:01:43 +0000 http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=3816#comment-6760 Off topic but in case you guys are interested, here is what <a href="http://www.nba.com/spurs/features/090812.html" rel="nofollow">Roger Mason Jr.</A>,<a href="http://www.unicef.org/infobycountry/argentina_50737.html" rel="nofollow">Manu</A>and <a href="http://www.nba.com/spurs/features/090810_jefferson.html" rel="nofollow">Richard Jefferson</A> doing this offseason.... Off topic but in case you guys are interested, here is what Roger Mason Jr.,Manuand Richard Jefferson doing this offseason….

]]> By: BB http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/08/12/falling-down-an-elevator-shaft-and-landing-in-a-pool-of-mermaids/comment-page-1/#comment-6759 BB Thu, 13 Aug 2009 05:11:23 +0000 http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=3816#comment-6759 Good piece, Timothy - you don't usually get any perspective on/coverage of the owners, and if you do it's often bad news. When you have a guy that's committed to the community, to the team, and particularly to his management, you've got to recognize that you're a lucky fan. Good piece, Timothy – you don’t usually get any perspective on/coverage of the owners, and if you do it’s often bad news. When you have a guy that’s committed to the community, to the team, and particularly to his management, you’ve got to recognize that you’re a lucky fan.

]]> By: BB http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/08/12/falling-down-an-elevator-shaft-and-landing-in-a-pool-of-mermaids/comment-page-1/#comment-6758 BB Thu, 13 Aug 2009 04:52:35 +0000 http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=3816#comment-6758 Sorry, one too many finals appearances for the Celtics up there! Sorry, one too many finals appearances for the Celtics up there!

]]> By: BB http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2009/08/12/falling-down-an-elevator-shaft-and-landing-in-a-pool-of-mermaids/comment-page-1/#comment-6757 BB Thu, 13 Aug 2009 04:49:39 +0000 http://www.48minutesofhell.com/?p=3816#comment-6757 Jason - As always, a good roster needs to find a balance between athleticism and experience - of the five guys over 30 on the Spurs, they share 8 championships, and probably as much postseason experience as anyone not named Kobe Bryant or Derek Fisher. Average age of the '08 Celtics Big Three - 31.3 yrs. (3 Championships, 4 Finals appearances) Average age of the '10 Spurs Big Four - 30.25 yrs. (10 Championships, 11 Finals appearances) It could be an issue, we've had injuries before. We'll have to see how it plays out. But geriatric has-beens is a bit of a stretch. Jason – As always, a good roster needs to find a balance between athleticism and experience – of the five guys over 30 on the Spurs, they share 8 championships, and probably as much postseason experience as anyone not named Kobe Bryant or Derek Fisher.

Average age of the ‘08 Celtics Big Three – 31.3 yrs.
(3 Championships, 4 Finals appearances)

Average age of the ‘10 Spurs Big Four – 30.25 yrs.
(10 Championships, 11 Finals appearances)

It could be an issue, we’ve had injuries before. We’ll have to see how it plays out. But geriatric has-beens is a bit of a stretch.

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