Tuesday, March 2nd, 2010...11:22 am

Notes from Wayne Winston, part 3

Jump to Comments

Over the last two games, the Spurs floored more traditional lineups, eschewing small-ball combinations for the better part of each contest. This has something to do with Gregg Popovich’s efforts to keep Richard Jefferson at small forward rather than power forward, where he languishes. Coach Popovich has not shown a complete aversion to small-ball, nor should he. But the last two games find the Spurs trending back toward two-big lineups.

After the Spurs’ recent victory in Indiana, Coach Popovich told me he elected to run small for the majority of the final three quarters because Jim O’Brian had done so first. Popovich simply adjusted his lineups to the opposition. But against Phoenix (who play small and fast) and New Orleans, the Spurs’ stayed true to more traditional 5-man units. The Spurs didn’t adjust so much as they forced the match-up issues. So far as this season goes, it’s a moment to mark.

It’s hard to quibble with Popovich. He’s won four championship and has one of the highest winning percentages in NBA history. If he wants to match lineups, he’s earned the right.

A philosophical debate between basketball enthusiasts is framed by the question of whether one should force the opponent to match your 5-man unit, or whether a coach is justified in matching the other coach’s personnel shuffles. Wayne Winston firmly believes that head coaches everywhere would “revolutionize the game” if they always preferred their best lineups, allowing for the need to shuffle through 5-man sets of varying favorability to provide the players with proper rest.

Wayne Winston sent me a list of suggested lineups (not including the data from Sunday or Monday’s games) for the Spurs-lineups he thinks the Spurs should stick with to improve their overall play, and a few the Spurs should avoid.

Here are a few high minute lineups that are, nevertheless, below average:

San Antonio’s Least Effective High Minute Lineups

Points Worse Than Average Per 48
Hill-Ginobili-Jefferson-McDyess-Duncan -5.85
Mason-Hill-Ginobili-Jefferson-Blair -4.54
Parker-Hill-Ginobili-Jefferson-Duncan -0.68
Parker-Ginobili-Bogans-Blair-Duncan -0.54

I start here to make a simple point. The question of whether the Spurs should play small or tall is not cut and dry, and combinations of each can be successful. There really isn’t a seat in this debate for any form of lineup fundamentalism. There are too many variables at play to form a priori assumptions. This is why Popovich has spent the majority of the season experimenting with lineups, and this why people like Wayne Winston are called upon by teams to amass data that helps sort through these questions.

Having said that, the season that lies behind us seems to indicate that San Antonio’s personnel is not equipped for long forays into small-ball. This team is clearly better when defaulting to more traditional 5-man combinations.

Numbers sometimes differ between advanced statisticians, but there is typically more consistency than discrepancy. And when the statistical smoke ascends from more than one camp, there is typically fire. For example, Winston’s list of should-play lineups includes only one relatively high minute small-ball set: Parker-Mason-Ginobili-Jefferson-Duncan (+24.73). Other than that, his recommendations feature two-big combos. Although, as pointed out above, it’s not simply enough to place two bigs on the floor. Some of those lineups fail too.

Aaron Barzilai, who is on the Grizzlies payroll and an important reason for their resurgence this season, provides numbers which support Winston’s lineup suggestions, although they are not filtered in terms of minutes played. Of all of San Antonio floor combinations this season, Barzilai finds that only seventeen of those combinations tend to outproduce the opponent. Of those seventeen winning combinations, Barzilai’s math finds that the Spurs have four effective small-ball lineups.

Effective Small-Ball (Barzilai)

Hill-Mason-Ginobili-Jefferson-Duncan +27.29
Parker-Bogans-Mason-Ginobili-Duncan +26.98
Parker-Ginobili-Bogans-Jefferson-Duncan +12.20
Parker-Mason-Ginobili-Jefferson-Duncan +10.83

As I mentioned in the space above, Barzilai’s numbers say the Spurs field seventeen positive APM lineups-seventeen lineups that outproduce their competition. But when one filters his information in terms of the seventeen most featured lineups (minutes played rather than most productive), the Spurs routinely play eight losing lineups. Eight out of their seventeen most frequently played units have a negative APM.

San Antonio’s third most frequent lineup-Hill, Ginobili, Jefferson, McDyess, Duncan-has a Barzilai APM of -16.39. That number looks quite a bit different than Winston’s, but don’t let the difference distract you. My point is that Barzilai and Winston, two professional statisticians who have been employed by Southwest division teams, both think that San Antonio is wise to avoid Hill-Ginobili-Jefferson-McDyess-Duncan, which is, for those keeping score, a traditional two-big lineup. This isn’t simply about small vs. tall. And it shows a consistency between the experts.

What has happened in the last two games is encouraging. The Spurs are finding their way, in part, by featuring lineups that better suit their personnel. It’s a subtle shift significant enough to fuel a late season push by the Spurs.

16 Comments

  • Hope Pop and other coaches have seen this already and are adjusting accordingly.

  • I’m pretty sure Pop would have access to internal numbers that would say the same thing.

    He just tinkers, and fiddles constantly, always has.

  • Does anyone know who the Spur’s number guy is, or if they even have one?

  • I don’t know if some of the visitors to this site will like seeing that Small Ball is not the sole reason to the Spurs problems.

  • Or that (!gasp!) Bogans is in two of those favorable small ball lineups…..blasphemy!

  • Tyler,

    A lot of the visitors to this site never let advanced statistical metrics, fiscal reality, or actual facts come between them and a good hard whinge.

  • Thanks for the analysis. It surprises me that the line up of Hill-Ginobili-Jefferson-McDyess-Duncan is so ineffective. It seems like that would be a very solid lineup, yet it isn’t. Any ideas as to why?

  • Because Tony Parker is good, and when we don’t have him we suck.

    When healthy Tony Parker spends almost all his time on the court with Tim Duncan. No other player is paired with Tim more often or more completely than TP.

    Statistically this duo has been a secret formula and just by watching you can tell they complement each other well, and have for years. It’s mostly this year where the starters are dropping to an average NBA level and the bench is doing the heavy lifting.

    Back to Hill/Manu/RJ/Dice/Duncan - boy, doesn’t look like we’re resting our starters there. Don’t think this lineup was going up against many NBA benches or getting used in any near-trash time. Looks like a starting 1st starting 3rd or crunch time lineup to me, but if Tony were hurt:

    from 82 games

    Hill-Ginobili-Jefferson-McDyess-Duncan
    Offensive eff. 0.97, Defensive eff. 1.14 = -.17

    Parker-Ginobili-Jefferson-McDyess-Duncan
    Offensive eff. 1.12 Defensive eff. 1.10 = +.02

    So Hill plays better against inferior competition (obviously) and we’re a better team when Tony plays, even if we’re not a better defensive team.

  • These numbers are cool too:

    Parker-Ginobili-Jefferson-McDyess-Duncan
    Shoots .541 eFG%, allows .475% ; attempts 35% of shots from close range

    Hill-Ginobili-Jefferson-McDyess-Duncan
    Shoots .444 eFG%, allows .506%; attempts 28% at close range

    We also attempt considerably more FTs when Tony is on the court.

  • @Greyberger, good stuff.

  • Amen

  • I’d be willing to bet Hill-Ginobili-Jefferson-McDyess-Duncan is pretty effective when George brings the ball up and hands it to Manu. Pop’s been going that route more often lately, especially in crunch time. Most of the minutes for this particular combo this season have had George running the offense, though, which has not worked.

  • LOL at Whinge Bushka

  • I think the effectiveness of “Hill-Ginobili-Jefferson-McDyess-Duncan” is flawed because RJ and McDyess have been very inconsistent all season. However, if you were to trend this over the past 1.5 week until the end of the season, I’m sure this lineup would be considered more effective than it currently is.

  • Right, and these guys are out there in the worst situation, usually against the other team’s best lineup.

  • It’s easy to see Bogans as the key to effective small ball if you see his opposition PER numbers when he is the 3 or 4.

    http://www.82games.com/0910/09SAS6.HTM

    He has played 19% of the Spurs SG minutes and 19% of the Spurs 200% forward minutes.

Leave a Reply