Thursday, March 25th, 2010...12:14 pm
No rest for the weary at the AT&T Center
The minutes and miles of March are mounting, and they are taking a toll on Tim Duncan. Heading into the month, Spurs head coach Gregg Popovich stressed the need to find rest for his star big man amid this hellish time.
It was only a few weeks ago that Popovich reiterated his stance on resting Duncan to Mike Monroe and the Express-News.
“This is a month where, if we can find him some rest, we’ll do it,” Popovich said before tipoff against the Hornets.
Duncan has missed only three of the Spurs’ 58 games, one of those when Popovich opted to sit him in the second game of a Lakers-Thunder back-to-back set. The 33-year-old Spurs captain has declared himself fresh and fit and said he expects to play when he feels good.
Popovich agrees that Duncan is fresher this March than he has been this late in previous seasons, but sticks to his belief that he wants his star big man as fresh as possible for the playoffs.
Of course, the very day this article was published, point guard Tony Parker broke his hand, leaving the Spurs short-handed offensively and laying to waste the San Antonio Spurs be laid plans, as detailed by Jeff McDonald on March 18:
The tightening Western Conference playoff race, combined with the injury to Tony Parker, have made it virtually impossible for Popovich to sit Duncan and Manu Ginobili, his 30-something stars, as much as he’d prefer.
“Our schedule and the situation we’re in now have made it so he and Manu have to play a little bit more than I really wanted,” Popovich said.
Duncan has played in every game since Parker went out, and every minute of his increased workload appeared to weigh on his legs in last night’s 2-11, six-point performance, a loss to the Los Angeles Lakers.
After a dreadful five point, 1-10 performance against the Orlando Magic, Duncan was able to rebound with a string of solid performances while running 41 and 35 minutes in a string of back to backs against the Hawks and Thunder.
The toll of those games were apparent in watching Duncan yesterday. People generally think of dwindling athleticism in terms of lift, leaping ability and speed, something Duncan never prided himself on anyways. But it also appears in movement and fluidity, something that has defined Duncan’s post game for years.
Offensively, Duncan’s movements appeared rigid and predetermined, something that helped play into Gasol’s two blocks in the fourth quarter. Of his 11 shots, the only fluid move Duncan made at any point was a tight spin that netted Duncan his only two free throws of the night.
“(Gasol) length really bothered Tim tonight. I don’t know if it’s always that way. He got a couple of blocks,” Lakers head coach Phil Jackson said. “I thought they nullified each other. I think Pau out scored him by four points, which isn’t a whole lot”
Without Tony Parker, and given the state of the season, perhaps the outcome of the game shouldn’t have been a surprise. Frustratingly, the Spurs continue to show just enough to make losses like last night disappointing.
Rebounding aside, the Spurs competed and their defense was, at times, great. Just 92 points for the Lakers, and the 45% shooting is a number skewed by the number of transition looks the Lakers got off steals and long rebounds from missed, wide open three-pointers.
But if the Spurs are going to get anywhere, it begins and ends with Tim Duncan and in all probability, how many miles and minutes he can continue to put on at this pace.
142 Comments
March 25th, 2010 at 12:36 pm
I agree the spurs need to rest tim duncan. But, please put mahimi in. Again down the stretch last night, Bonner hurt the spurs. He is unathletic and just sits on the three point line all game long. When he was in there, with hill and ginobli it was almost like watching 5-4, because the lakers were leaving him alone figuring at worse he hits a three and then theyd give it to odom or gasol, who oever he was gaurding and get 2 point right back…and it worked
March 25th, 2010 at 12:50 pm
It’s a lose-lose situation. With Parker out, there just isn’t enough to sustain a game as much without another star. Imagine Parker + Hill’s 1st half performance and Manu. That probably would have been enough to cover for Duncan.
March 25th, 2010 at 12:53 pm
The aging of Duncan and the missing of Tony Parker is a killer combination for this team against elite teams. Plus, the Lakers haven’t played this good in weeks. They usually bring their “A” game against the Spurs, and last night was no exception. The Lakers are at their best when Bryant is an “efficient” scorer, Odom is aggressively running the floor, and Artest is in lock-down “D” mode. And that’s what occurred last night. Their team defense was stifling in the 2nd half. That makes them difficult to beat, even when we’re healthy.
On our side, a similar refrain: No McDyess, No RJ, RJM shot has disappeared for a “long” time, Bonner inconsistent with shot, Hill absent in the 2nd half against an elite team, Manu tired at the end from guarding Kobe (no Bowen anymore), Blair 20 years old and hitting the wall, & not enough help for Duncan on the front line: (NEED someone like Dalembert, Sixers) to effectively compete against elite teams.
March 25th, 2010 at 12:56 pm
Jesse -
You hit the nail on the head. As opposed to many of our losses this season, the defense last night wasn’t the problem. I was really pleased with our play on that side of the ball, especially when you consider the versatility and skill of the Lakers.
Last nights game was lost mainly to the fact we missed an awful lot of open jumpers. We left at least a dozen points on the table simply because we missed shots. Bonner and Mason had some very good looks that didn’t go down. We went into the half up 7 when we should have been up 15. We needed that extra cushion, not only because you knew the Lakers were going to play better, but because fatigue was bound to set in late in the game (ex. Manu).
And you’re right about one thing - we probabaly shouldn’t expect this team to beat the Lakers, but they show you enough glimpses that it still kills you when we can’t quite pull it out.
March 25th, 2010 at 1:05 pm
Tough game, but in reality, with the currrent roster and team performance, the season is over. I’ll support the Spurs the rest of the schedule as I’ve done it since before ICE raised the roof at the Hemisfair Arena though.
Go Spurs Go!!
March 25th, 2010 at 1:05 pm
In my opinion, this season and how the offseason shapes up, I think the spurs should see it as a half rebuilding mode. Not in the way of loosing a ton of games, but just bringing in alot of ne players and faces. I think the spurs ought to go into offseason and wait for all the big names to sign, then offer up jefferson for pretty much anything to just get the contract out. With all the big names out there, some good players will be available and I think spurs need to infuse new young talent. The team as it currently stands just cannot win close games. Bring back manu, parker, hill, duncan, blair, and then honestly….anyone after that if they can get anything good, trade or let walk and bring in new guys
March 25th, 2010 at 1:10 pm
Jesse & Tyler,
Definitely agree. Overall, things are coming together for this team. Defense and rebounding were decent last night. The problem was there isn’t enough offensive firepower anymore. Manu is the only one creating any offense on this team with TP out. At this point in his career, I think Tim has shown that he’d rather be a creator out of the post, hitting cutters for easy laups or wide-open shooters. The problem is, he rarely commands double teams anymore, so there are fewer wide-open shooters on the perimeter. Timmy has always struggled with long defenders, but his age is really starting to show.
March 25th, 2010 at 1:17 pm
Had this team played early in the season, according to expectations, Duncan would be doing well, after getting substantial rest. But he carried the team until All-Star break, when Manu returned from hibernation. The problem is that this team can’t and won’t fight for every playoff game to get a win. If they are behind, they pack their bags and call it a day and hope to win the next one. this team just needs to win to at least claim the 6 or 7 seed. First round against the Lakers would be brutal.
March 25th, 2010 at 1:18 pm
@ Rest For Duncan,
Horse droppings! Tim has been laying up and taking it easy like a hi price hooker just wanting to eat, be entertained, have a whole lot of s_x, and of course get paid.
He has been resting all years. If the stat man can verify it, you will find that his minutes played this season are the lowest that they have been for his entire career. Ok fine, it was agreed that both Tim and Gino would not be required to go through their normal off season training routine. Makes sense to do with older veterans who you are counting on.
However, the net result is that towards seasons end, you should be able to see more energy and enthusiasm from the players. While Gino has responded with excellent, focused play, Tim seems to be thinking about his off season vacation. He has no real energy, does not seem very focused or interested.
Seems his only concern is eating alot of mango fruit in the off season, swimming, hitting his bong and chasing pretty women.
This is the money time of year. No time to be concerned about Tim’s rest when he has been resting all year. Tim does not want to do any heavy lifting at this stage of his career. All he wants to do is still out on the perimeter and jack set shots.
If Tim would get in the weight room, he would not fade every year at the end of the season. Also, he would be able to get the spot that he wants down on the blocks. As it stands now, he can not hold his spot anymore down on the blocks. He is easily pushed out to the perimeter.
March 25th, 2010 at 1:20 pm
We should have been up more at the half, but that doesn’t change what happened to our O in the second half. We need another ball handling perimeter player to play alongside Hill when Manu is sitting. Unfortunately, RMJ is inadequate without his shot. I like hairston but he doesn’t solve this problem. The only one on our roster who does is Parker. At this point we just need to hang in there and hope Parker can break back in quickly. I think the emergence of Hill as a playmaking guard will really help this. I feel good about this team right now if Parker can return and produce.
March 25th, 2010 at 1:21 pm
@Jim,
You say we need some help for Duncan. I say we Duncan to help. Last night was a rare game when TD just didn’t have it on either end. That’s actually why I am not all that worried by he result. If you substitute last night’s Duncan with the Duncan I am confident he will be come playoff time (see: every year of his career), we would have had a great game.
GP
March 25th, 2010 at 1:27 pm
@Gregg Popovich
All we want is your very best coaching effort. At present, we are not getting that.
March 25th, 2010 at 1:33 pm
I grew up on St. Croix, attended middle school with TD and swam on the same swim team as him. Needless to say, like myself, most of St. Croix roots for the Spurs. Due to the amazing success Team Duncan has had in previous years, this season has been a let down. But no game was more depressing than last night, when I had to watch my favorite ball player and hometown-hero get humiliated.
Early in the game, Duncan’s shot was not falling, which is fine. But watching him get repeatedly stuffed, stripped, and shamed by Gasol was painful. Can it all be due to age? Just a couple months ago, TD was carrying the Spurs. And against the Lakers on Jan 12, he drooped 25 points, 13 rebounds and 4 blocks on LA, while shooting 60 percent form the field. Granted, Gasol wasn’t there that day, but Bynum was- and I doubt Gasol is that much better of a defender. In a subsequent loss to the Lakers on February 8, Gasol and Duncan played fairly equal, with Duncan dropping 16 points, 15 rebounds and 4 blocks on LA, while shooting at a much higher percentage than Gasol.
With his overall recent drop in performance, I suspect something worse than a shooting slump is going on with Timmy. I suspect Duncan is injured and not telling anybody about it.
March 25th, 2010 at 1:38 pm
When a team as talented as the Lakers dials up the intensity as they did in the 2nd half, you need to have playmakers that can break down the defense and create when nothing’s there. Unfortunately for us, without TP, we’re almost totally reliant on Manu until he runs out of gas, which he did last night.
March 25th, 2010 at 1:44 pm
This loss wasn’t about Duncan. I don’t care what anybody says: Dwight Howard is an MVP candidate and he’s had multiple single digit scoring nights this year. It’s not about that. As Pop said in the interview, he WAS involved in the game. His shot wasn’t falling, but he WAS involved. How?
He gave Bonner and Mason 12 WIDE OPEN three pointers. I swear they were all WIDE OPEN. They made two (actually, Bonner made two). Those two guys, especially Mason, are a prime example of what’s hurting us right now. If people made more open shots, we would have won yesterday, despite TD’s off night. He’s not the problem. The problem is these other idiots who are there to do ONE THING (make open shots) and can’t even do that.
Pisses me off…
March 25th, 2010 at 1:45 pm
All,
In case anyone hasn’t picked up on it, I am NOT the real Gregg Popovich, head coach of the Spurs. I know I risk being overly obvious here, given the blatant parody of my posts, but I wouldn’t want anyone to conclude that (a) my ideas and comments are his or (b) that the real GP would give a crap about what you post on this board. It just occurred to me that I should make that clear-some of you really seemed overly amped about your fanaticism. My object is to channel what I think he might be thinking, say what he might say, at least assuming he could poke fun at himself.
To that end, I will include the below disclaimer on all future posts, so as to not mislead anyone. With that said, (pulling my open had over my face from top to bottom) back into character…
GP*
*Not the real Gregg Popovich.
March 25th, 2010 at 1:46 pm
Last night really highlighted how worthless our supporting cast is. Last night, no one showed up to the second half except for Ginobili. The box score is embarrassing to look at. We can criticize Pop, Bonner, Bogans, or whomever, but the bottom line is that everyone sucked last night (except Manu).
Sub in Mahinmi, Hairston, or Dwayne Jones, and we’re still getting beat as long as no one shows up to play. To pin it solely on the coach or a couple of rotation players underestimates the weakness of the entire roster.
The team acquired Richard Jefferson specifically to make up for the injuries or off-nights of the big three, and he was the number one no-show last night.
March 25th, 2010 at 1:49 pm
We lost to the lakers? Possibly the best team in the league?
In other news the sky is still blue, and frogs don’t bounce.
Way to get riled up with a late season discovery that we are exactly who we though we were fellas…..
March 25th, 2010 at 1:53 pm
Way to not spell thought correctly bushka….
In other astounding news, Bigballs is actually correct.
This year is Duncans career low in Minutes per game.
He is indeed getting rested more than ever before, though I think the hooker reference may be off base.
Though why for the love of Manus Jockstrap you can’t just go and look up stats yourself kills me.
March 25th, 2010 at 1:57 pm
Gregg Popovich
March 25th, 2010 at 1:21 pm
Am I really talking to the coach here?! Again, all of these opinions are from a lowly fan with no real coaching experience, so take my comments with a grain of salt, if you want, but, number one, Duncan has AGED. Let’s just face that fact at the outset. And while still exceptional, he is NOT dominant anymore game in and game out, and won’t be in the playoffs either (although probably a bit better & more consistent, but not enough considering the strength, or lack thereof, of our role players).
Number two, during any of our championship runs (when he was YOUNGER!) Duncan had a not too old, but TALL veteran that fits the system to a “T” (e.g., Oberto), and/or protected the rim (Robinson, Muhammad, Nesterovic, etc.).
He DOESN’T have that “luxury” now! I know you & the FO were hoping that Dice would help solve that issue, but it hasn’t, and 60+ games should prove to you that it won’t. I know as a coach you have to be optimistic, and we don’t need for our conversations here to leak out to the team, but let’s call a spade a spade here: With the team as currently constructed, we’re not going to challenge for the title this year. Any other outcome would represent a miracle.
JH
March 25th, 2010 at 2:01 pm
I guess my tongue & cheek initial question above has been answered. I think the real “GP” would love the idea of trying to get a Dalembert, if at all possible.
March 25th, 2010 at 2:09 pm
Get Duncan some rest as in games off, not just reduced minutes. Win or lose. He needs to register DNP-CD @ NJN, @SAC, vs MEM & vs MIN. That’s four off games that would take away all back to backs, give him one game in the six days before the post-season and perhaps allow Blair to find a rhythm. It would also leave him fresher for the upcoming must wins against Houston, LA, Phoenix and Dallas. It’s the right thing to do, regarldess of Parker’s injury.
Last night was also an example of how giving away the Atlanta game cost us twice. Instead of winning in regulation, we had five more minutes of game time that led to a loss. That also forced Pop’s hand to play TD & Manu @OKC as much as he did to avoid a losing streak. Which all led to an exhausted team with no legs playing the Lakers. That one loss contributed to a second. This could’ve been a successful week but it opened on a sour note that still stings.
March 25th, 2010 at 2:12 pm
Cheyenne Harty
March 25th, 2010 at 1:33 pm
“With his overall recent drop in performance, I suspect something worse than a shooting slump is going on with Timmy. I suspect Duncan is injured and not telling anybody about it.”
That’s always a possible at least “partial” explanation, and certainly appears to be conceivable in this case. That said, we have to assume he’s healthy until we’re told otherwise.
Bushka
March 25th, 2010 at 1:53 pm
“Though why for the love of Manus Jockstrap you can’t just go and look up stats yourself kills me.”
Well put, Bushka. Are stats meaningless, are they too opaque or mathematical? I don’t get it either.
March 25th, 2010 at 2:23 pm
Well that was the dumbest game of the year.
FIrst of all stop talking about the Lakers like they are GOD all mighty. They looked like crap in the first half. The SPURS shooters just aren’t as good as years past.
TD just had an off night. YOu can’t really blame it on age. He got shots he wanted they just didn’t go down.
Second, even though the SPURS stunk it up,except for MAnu and HIll(1st half) They still should have won the game.
I have been defending POP lately, but I blame this loss on him. It was POP who for whatever reason decided to double KOBE in the second half leaving FARMAR and weak BROWN wide open for the 3. 3 wide open 3’s in the third that gave the LAKERS confidence. They didn’t double KOBE in the first half and guess what? THey were up by 7. THey made 5 wide open 3s in the third and they took the lead.
Granted if the SPURS made their wide open 3s then it would have been closer, ROGER MASON JR.
Fast forward to roughly 5 minutes left in the 4th quarter, POP takes a time out they are down by 3. AND HE SITS MANU???????????????????? Theres 5 minutes left. In the two minutes that MANU wasn’t in the game, the lead was pushed to 11. The sad thing is when the lead was at 6 or 8 you could see MANU waiting to comeback in. But he couldn’t, he had to wait for a dead ball. TOO LATE POP. Then MANU comes in and gets a quick 3 point play. MAYBE that should have been the one to tie the game after the first timeout?? Not cut the lead to 8. Didn’t he notice that when MANU wasn’t in there the LAKERS kept coming back?
He sat MANU in the CAVS game too. They lossed. Don’t give me this thing about rest. There are 5 MINUTES LEFT. Leave him in there.
ANd I don’t know why people are so scared of the lakers?? Just let KOBE go for 45 points and shut down FARMAR and BROWN and FISHER. All they do is hit wide open 3s.
That’s how the PISTONS beat them in the FINALS a few years back. They didn’t let the Shaw’s and the FOx’s get wide open shots.
Stop doubling KOBE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Actually it kind of worked I mean, he only got 24 points. ( I say sarcastically)
I feel bad for MANU he is a one man show right now. I don’t think its about the SPURS needing to resign MANU anymore. I think MANU might bolt to a team with players that can actually hit a wide open shot.
March 25th, 2010 at 2:29 pm
Bonner’s shot was off, but am i the only one who noticed that aside from two times Odom accelerated past him, he played excellent defense. He had a few steals, made all his rotations, and blocked (1) or contested every shot that came around him. He was in position for several rebounds, but ultimately other Spurs grabbed them. I’m not saying dont criticize him for missing his shots, but he does not deserve to be lumped in the same group as Bogans and Mason as total nonfactors. He managed to be effective, even while having an off night.
March 25th, 2010 at 2:34 pm
Junier-
they doubled Kobe off and on all game. He also took Manu out with just under 7 minutes to play, and usually inserts him back into the lineup with between 4 and 5. At some point, Manu does need to rest. I think not having Parker is what is killing the Spurs right now. Manu having to start messes with when he’s on/off the bench and the other unit’s effectiveness without him. With Parker in the game, we at least keep pace with the Lakers, Manu comes back in, and we make a run.
March 25th, 2010 at 2:36 pm
Parker was out, but so was Bynum, so that’s a wash. I’ll face the reality that the Spurs are 9 points worse than the Lakers at this point. Is that bad? Nah, it’s life. We were at the top of the league with no lottery picks since 1997, so I’d say it was a great run.
We can’t win the title this year. Duh. But what team will want to face us in the first or second round of the playoffs? I’ll embrace our new found role of cagey veteran party crashers.
March 25th, 2010 at 2:38 pm
The Spurs need to trade Duncan. The last three seasons there has been major concern about Duncans health at seasons end. A team will never win the championship if they need to rest their number one player. I can only imagine the Cavs resting James the Lakers resting Bryant the Mavs resting Dirk the Majic resting Howard.
How can the Spurs rebuild against an aging center who needs to rest at the end of each season because he can’t perform.
March 25th, 2010 at 2:56 pm
@Gregg Popovich
Pop, what is it baby? We love you! Are you having problems at home with that pretty Lil wife of yours? Because you are having a really off year. Just seems like you are not into it. Really, you could just as easily stay at home every night.
March 25th, 2010 at 3:27 pm
@ThatBigGuy - Parker > Bynum. Not close. He’s also the biggest mismatch the Spurs have over the Lakers, much like the problem Odom is for SA. He’s also a guy that prevents Manu from having to be the primary ball handler.
@Buckets - Duncan is no longer the Spurs’ number one player. He’s the team leader and foundation on both ends but Manu’s is difference maker/closer and Parker is the primary scorer. They need all three healthy and they can beat anyone. Duncan no longer being able to carry the team does not make him a liability. He’s just an older big man and the long regular season wears on him. Happened to Kareem too.
March 25th, 2010 at 3:30 pm
God knows how fans of other teams get through the cadaverous dark nights of sub .500 (or even sub .400) basketball without going for the razor blades.
Maybe they have what top NASA science boffins call “Perspective”.
You know the ability to take an objective viewpoint, and draw reasonable outcomes and conclusions.
When you play the guys that are defending champions from a year ago and actually managed to improve their roster in the off season….
…and you find yourself disgusted, generally depressed, and blaming both staff & players alike for the inexplicable loss of this eminently winnable ball game….
….a loss that would obviously never have occured if someone would just give you a frigging clipboard, or listen to your nonsensical rantings backed up by nothing more than strength of opinion and strong language……
The prescription is I’m afraid a dozen solid uppercuts. Preferably self administered.
So go find a mirror and stop lowering the tone with this absolute drivel that is all about Mondays experts, and nothing about the reality and fluid nature of a franchise in transition.
March 25th, 2010 at 4:08 pm
@Buckets - I hope you are joking. Trade Duncan??? I don’t care if he plays his last year in a wheel chair, he shall retire as a Spur.
@SpurredOn - I agree, the Atlanta loss was tough. Had we won that, combined with the Thunder win, we would all be pretty happy right now. Just think if we would have lost to the Thunder? Ouch!!!! Mass depression throughout the Spurs nation.
March 25th, 2010 at 4:30 pm
Duncan didnt seem to have an off game against the Lakers.
Duncan seemed to take the game off. Seemed sluggish, slow, and unmotivated.
As posted above, I agree that Tim doesnt seem to be strong enough to get his spot on the block any more.
Each year he is catching the ball further out. At this point, most of his catches are 20 feet from the rack. Makes him work even harder to score the ball.
I couldnt leave without this one:
What is this coaching genious? Somebody open my mind, please! Ginnobli was our lifeline in the 2nd half. We take him out in the heat of the 3rd,,, and suddenly…..Bonner, Bogans, and Mason on the floor together in the 3rd? We were down by 10 before I could blink.
I did get a kick out of Fisher. George Hill came in and starting abusing him from all over the floor. It seemed to really tick D Fish off….He immediately started taking shots at Hill.
G. Hill would not be punked. I was impressed with his chivalry.
March 25th, 2010 at 4:36 pm
Spurred on, you are crazy son. Anyone who thinks that Parker is better than Bynum and it is not even close is really out of it.
This message board had the same issue in the offseason. Not giving Bynum enough credit. To the credit of the author of this blog, he was arguing against you that Bynum was indeed all-star level. But i see that it still has not soaked through.
Let’s get this straight, currently Bynum is better than Parker AND yes, BETTER than Duncan. He is an absolute beast. If only he got more possessions, his numbers would be out of this world. He is one of the most efficient players in the ENTIRE league, and all of his numbers are outstanding. I guess the Lakers will have to win ANOTHER ring for you guys to recognize it.
March 25th, 2010 at 5:22 pm
I was going to wait and post after the Cavs game on friday, but after last nights performance I can wait no longer. We have 2.5 championship caliber players(Manu,Parker, and .5 Duncan) on our roster and that is it. I have sat back and watched some of you defend some of the others while I have complained about them constantly. First what we saw last night should not be a big surprise to anyone, as we have been watching this kind of performance against better teams all year.
We play relatively well in the first half and can’t seem to keep from having costly turnovers or make an open jump shot. It is obvious that TD is not the same but can still be effective and nobody should even mention him being traded.
Some of you think that if we had TP on the floor things might have been different, but that would have taken away from Hill’s #’s so a wash as I see it. That being said what happened to Hill last night has also happened to TP on many occasions against the Lakers. He played well in the 1st half and was able to get where he wanted when he wanted too. However in the 2nd half when Phil Jackson always adjusts and shuts down the lane and those drives, his production went way down. So then we are left to rely on Manu who of course wore down after having to work so hard against Kobe and Artest. As someone said TD passed out of the post to wide open shooters and we just don’t have guys that can knock it down anymore. Think about that, we used to have Horry, Barry, and Bowen. Now we have Bonner, Mason, and Bogans. U tell me why we are not an elite team anymore. I will not elaborate on the short comings of each of those players, just say that they are not NBA caliber players at this point, but they get alot of minutes on our team. Something is wrong in that picture. Our window has closed and the worst thing we can do as fans is deny that fact. It is time to retool and make the tough decisions(trade) and rebuild this team. Those of you that do not want to admit that are really “drinking the kool-aid” and need to stop before it makes you sick.
March 25th, 2010 at 5:41 pm
As a long-time Spurs fan, I just hope this season doesn’t end badly. I believe these guys will step up and fight- there is still some really good NBA talent on this team, but they don’t have the big guys to win it all anymore. That’s obvious.
So, having said that, on a lighter note, it’s good the 2010 ene-be-a promotion is over with. “Los Spurs” is pretty stupid. It’s what used to be called “Spanglish”- some p0lyglot of English and Spanish/Mexican.
If the NBA and the Spurs want to really market this way, why don’t the Spurs’ tops read “Los Espuelos”? There is no Spanish word “Spurs”. Since this started, I have never liked the “El Heat”, “Los Suns”, “Los Spurs”, etc.
March 25th, 2010 at 6:12 pm
@Bigballs
Can’t say Tim really withers at the end. The “season’s” end, perhaps. But come playoff time TD usually jacks his game up. Look at the stats.
March 25th, 2010 at 6:34 pm
@ Hoopster
Nice piece…
Cant be summed up more clearly than that.
People are actually tring to justify Bonner and Bogans play. As you stated, they just arent NBA caliber players. I find it painful to watch them operate.
Ive posted previously that the Spurs have put themselves in a difficult situation. Gave away far too many players, too many talented role players.
I read an aritcle at ESPN today inwhich Ginnobli’s market value is being discussed as well as his possible new NBA home.
Ginnobli is 32 years old. The Spurs will not be able to pay him market value next season, unless they can magially make Jefferson’s contract disappear…
As much as I hate to admit it, wouldnt be smart for G to turn down that payday. It is his last opportunity for a max contract at his worth.
In this economy…Id say “Show me the Money”!
If Ginnobli were to bolt, then what? Ducnans game is showing signs of decline. Doesnt mattter, Duncan at 75% is still my choice over 2/3 of the power forwards in the league..
Though he should move to the 5….
But, based on his decline, the front court has got to be addressed. Cant bring in any more wanna be’s here. Need a good center and a solid PF. Dont plan on seeing Splitter in silver and black.
Though he should move to the 5….
The centers in the league are not really dominate players, with the exception of Howard, SHAQ, and Yao….
Moving Duncan to center would extend his career, and afford us the opportunity to bring in a reasonably priced back up 5, instead of a starter. This way, Spurs could afford a quality Power Forward, Tim’s eventual replacement, to shore up the frontcourt….
March 25th, 2010 at 7:23 pm
Kaveh,
I think you need to support your argument that Bynum is better than TD. Simply saying he is a beast doesn’t cut it. Through the half way point of the season TD had a WP48 of .357 compared to Bynum’s .161 (which is good, but not exactly “beastly”). Since then Bynum has maintained his numbers while TD’s have dropped some, but I think it’s safe to say that TD has out produced Bynum. Especially when you consider that at the ripe old age of 33 TD is still playing more minutes. Young Bynum is playing fewer minutes that TD’s career low, and producing less during them. Please don’t compare the two players again.
Hoopster, I don’t think TP takes away from Hill, I think Hill struggles without another playmaker on the floor with him, at least against good D’s. I agree that TP has as well in the past (last year I though he had turned the corner on that, but injuries this year have really hurt his play) and I think he also could benefit from Hill’s presence. Hill is a second year player who didn’t play pg in college, he just can’t get it done this point against elite defenses without help. Saying that adding parker is “a wash” is ridiculous. Having a third playmaking guard on a team does not just detract from the other two.
Last night the Lakers did not play as great D as our numbers suggest. They played good D on Hill when he was in by himself, but didn’t close anyone out well and gave up open 3s. We didn’t make them pay and they won the game.
March 25th, 2010 at 7:54 pm
Bushka
March 25th, 2010 at 3:30 pm
Excellent post, Bushka. Couldn’t of said it better!
kaveh
March 25th, 2010 at 4:36 pm
No offense to you, or to Bynum, but you had to be on drugs before you wrote that post.
Hoopster
March 25th, 2010 at 5:22 pm
Good post. I agree with most of it, and share your frustration and concern about getting on top again.
Honestly, I don’t see us challenging again by keeping the big three together. And that is sad indeed. But we simply don’t have any other high-value trade pieces, and I for one am not interested in putting either Hill or Blair in a deal. Hill is a Pop-type player that still has significant upside, and Blair at only 20 years old, has the potential for a great future with us. He has to learn to be smart & creative out there to overcome his height issues, but I think he could be one of those special PF’s that plays BIG at a short height. He has Boozer-type potential written all over him. And remember Boozer’s only 6′8″. When Timmie’s gone we’ll have to run the offense differently anyway. There’s NO replacing TD.
If I were the Spurs FO, and Manu felt like he needed to leave, for the money or whatever, I say consider a sign & trade deal with him & Bonner, package it with Tony (expiring contract next year) & Dice, and try and get Dalambert, Iguodala, & Williams (their young point) from the Sixers. I think these three guys fit our system real well. Dalembert would be huge next to Duncan, Iguodala is an awesome all-around player that needs a good team to become a real star, and Williams has a scoring point guard mind-set (but pretty well-rounded). Then, at next February’s trade deadline, hopefully unload RJ’s expiring contract for another decent piece. The idea is to get young & more athletic to help TD during his late stage career with us. TD could still be effective for quite awhile if he had a younger & more athletic supporting cast.
I know this type of deal-making is a lot to get our heads around. The idea of losing TP & Manu I’m sure seems preposterous if not sacrilegious to most Spurs fans. And of course, it is a risky proposition. But we need to start thinking BIG to get back on top. The days of resorting to tinkering & picking up late round picks is over.
Any thoughts?
March 25th, 2010 at 7:59 pm
bduran
March 25th, 2010 at 7:23 pm
Kaveh was also talking about TP, which is just as ridiculous.
March 25th, 2010 at 8:05 pm
Hoopster,
You are right. The window has definitely closed for this team as currently constructed. Next year we have Parker, McDyess, Jefferson, Duncan, Hill, Blair, and Hairston under contract. Here is what I think we must do in order of importance:
1. Resign Manu to a 3 year deal worth $6-7 mil/year.
2. Trade Parker and McDyess for a quality big plus a decent backup PG. I’ll defend this argument if someone wants to challenge me.
3. Let Mason and Bonner walk. They are both shit who went a combined 2-12 from distance last night. Typical for these two to disappear in a big game. Mason especially may be out of the league next year at this rate.
4. Sign a couple of decent free agent shooters shooters ex: Anthony Morrow
5. If we are unsuccessful at #2, then be prepared to spend some $$$ on Tiago Splitter.
The championship window can be re-opened if we address the facts that our 3 pt shooting sucks this year and that we need another big to help TD in rebounds and block shots as well as scoring. Duncan just looked too old against Gasol and can’t score and dominate the paint like old times. He needs to take the David Robinson role and train a younger protege.
March 25th, 2010 at 8:18 pm
@Jim,
I LOVE your idea of getting Igoudala. He is an animal who is an elite athlete and great defender. Williams would be an intriguing PG to backup GHill. However, based on last night, (and granted its only a one game sample) I’m not sure Dalembert would be enough to shore up our needs next to Duncan. In all the years I’ve watched the Spurs, I’ve never seen Duncan totally eliminated from the game on the offensive end. Duncan seemed to have no lift in his legs and was totally controlled by Gasol last night. Thats a very disturbing sign.
Dalembert would add rebounding and blocked shots, but we may also need some inside scoring to supplement Duncan’s decline. Perhaps I’m reading too much into one game, but if we get a big guy, I’d like for him to have more scoring punch than Samuel Dalembert.
March 25th, 2010 at 8:42 pm
@bduran
Apparently I was not clear in what i was trying to say. If Parker is healthy and playing then Hill’s numbers will go down. What I mean in essence is simply that we will get the same type of numbers from any combo of Hill, Parker and Manu. Thus it becomes a wash in the grand scheme of things. I was not saying he detracts just that we will get similar production from the three of them.
I do however do agree with you on the rest of your post. Do not even try to compare Bynum to TD. One is the one the best of all time, and the other can’t get through a season healthy. Until he does he is just unrealized potential. IMO!
@ballhog
You are correct about Gino. We will more than likely not be able to pay him. The better he plays the higher his market value will go too. We can think what we want but all should remember this, if we lose him we lose the heart and soul of our Championship core. TD is on the downhill slide, whereas Gino has shown recently he still has what it takes on a nightly basis. Hope we do the right thing this off season, because if not we will be lottery bound real soon. Those of you that think TP can carry this team are in for a rude awakening. Championship teams do not(as a general rule) build around point guards. And before any of you throw out Magic, i argue that he had alot of talent around him including Kareem(arguably the best center of all time). In fact the only team I can think of that won a championship like that is the Pistons with Isiah running the show, but he had alot of valuable role players on those teams too, unlike what we have here in Spursland.
March 25th, 2010 at 8:48 pm
I like the posts it seems that we are all realizing the truth that we have to move in another direction.
@Jim Henderson
Like the trade, if we can bring Splitter or another big to play here as well then I think Dalembert works.
@Hobson
I think you are on the money. Like the list and think if we could pull it off we would be right back where we need to be.
March 25th, 2010 at 10:39 pm
Hoopster is drinking the MD-20/20 and he needs to get off this site!Very weak posts!Glad, your not the GM of my team… we would be bankrupt. Hoopster has flown the coopster do your homework!
March 25th, 2010 at 11:38 pm
@ Hoopster & Hobson13
Good posts guys. I just like Dalembert because he’s one of the best shot-blockers/defenders/rebounders in the paint, one of the youngest proven bigs of his type, and would be a very good fit with Duncan. Can you imagine a team trying to drive down the lane with Duncan & Dalembert?
Hobson, I understand your concern with helping TD score around the paint, but I’m really hoping for additional improvement from Blair over the summer. I think he’s a special guy, and can become a good scorer, rather quickly, hopefully heading the Boozer direction over the next few years. In the meantime, if necessary we could try to get additional scoring down low by trading RJ’s expiring before the trade deadline.
By the way, I don’t think Duncan’s done by a long shot. He has shown more noticeable decline since around the all-star break, but the LA game was also an off night for him. He’s going to have more of them now, and I know this appears to be a big deal because of his awesome consistency over the years. But I think TD will come on a bit more as we get closer to the playoffs. And don’t forget, he’s used to TP; they’ve always worked well together.
Also, Gasol is a tough match-up because of his youth, length, & mobility. But if you noticed, TD gave Gasol some fits as well, scoring just 12 pts., & turning it over 5 times.
March 26th, 2010 at 12:09 am
You numbskulls and your proposterous trade proposals
Almost as dumb and unreasonable as the healthcare bill
Let go of Mason, Bonner, jefferson, and bogans
Bring in young players at the 2, the 3, and the 4 spot.
But who is the ultimate question.
We are at the 7th seed, i dont wanna face the Mavs, come on guys do you really want that matchup again ?
Gimme the Nuggets, i like that matchup over Dallas, not like we expect a championship this year anyway.
March 26th, 2010 at 12:10 am
Anyone notice that in the last 3 games, of the last 5 minutes played in regulation, 15 in total,(Hawks, Thunder, Lakers) that the Spurs have made only 6 shots?? Execution offensively in the clutch has been horrendous.
For Jefferson, Pop should tell him that he hasn’t played a good game unless he’s had one offensive charge in it. His pass on a 3 on 2 (which Van Gundy loudly criticized on ESPN) instead of dunking down the lane and the curl in the 4th qtr wide open for a drive to the basket and jacking up a deep 2 with a foot on the 3 pt line with the Spurs in the penalty was pathetic. Or the leave Kobe open for a 3 in the corner or let Artest take the ball from him on a pass across half court. Can’t Pop coach Jefferson about those plays with video? Yeesh.
Trade Jefferson and the rights to Splitter for Chris Bosh in the offseason please. Convince the big 3 to show up at Bosh’s doorstep @ 12 am on the 1st day of free agency. Sign a free agent 3 point shooter like Raja Bell, Kyle Korver, Anthony Morrow, or JJ Redick. Convince Pop that Hairston should play. Spurs will be set to win a championship next year.
March 26th, 2010 at 12:10 am
And for Christs Sake, Vote Democrat this November.
The GOP is not your friend
March 26th, 2010 at 12:18 am
@kaveh - not sure if you’re just looking for attention or actually believe what you typed. Bynum is only mentioned in a sentence with Duncan when they’re guarding one another. Period.
As for comparing him to Parker, no again. Bynum, should he ever stay healthy, may very well be an consistent All-Star. Parker is a Finals MVP, three time champ and top five PG in the league. His value to SA by far supersedes Bynum’s to LA. Matter of fact, LA won the title in spite of Bynum, whose playoff contributions were fouls. You can be proud of your Lakers without blind to reality.
March 26th, 2010 at 12:22 am
Also please sign the next Bruce Bowen playing overseas in Bobby Jones.
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Bobby-Jones-351/
March 26th, 2010 at 12:46 am
@jh
honestly, i think that something has to be done as well, though more because as currently constructed we can’t stay healthy. i still think that on paper we have the talent to take a championship if people fill their roles well. obviously, that’s not happening now, and never will if people keep going down.
that said, i’m in favor of a move, but i’m still not wholly sold on moving parker. here’s why: at the end of the day, we all know the road to the championship goes through l.a. other teams may have the potential to dethrone them, but all things being equal, they are the odds on favorites from the west. what gives the lakers the most trouble? i’m pretty sure anyone who’s paid attention will quickly answer lightning quick pgs in the aaron brooks/tony parker mold. now brooks seems to shoot the 3 a bit better at this point, but tony is crafty. we need that shot at their achilles heel. unfortunately for my thread of logic, this means we’d have to trade manu or duncan, my favorite two players on the spurs, and manu would probably the odd man out. sign and trades normally happen to get the player more money than an outright signing by another team would net, so manu would have to do us a big favor there.
sigh…
March 26th, 2010 at 2:28 am
As much as id like to believe that this team can win another championship as currently constructed, I simply feel that the chances are slim to none. I do acknowledge that this team needs some changes but not to the extent that some people think. I’m pretty surprised that I have yet to see anybody mention anything about this years draft. A push at drafting a young big such as Ekpe Udoh or a number of other young talented bigs should be a top priority this offseason.
I’m not saying he can be our savior but rather stating that with a few tinkerings to the line up, such as finding guys that aren’t afraid of making open shots, could potentially squeeze out one last run before completely blowing up this core.
@ BALLHOG, @BIGBALLS
And remember, this is just my opinion, there is no need for any low blows
March 26th, 2010 at 4:21 am
Trivia at the 48……
OK Fellas……..Here we go…..
My D League Team vs current Spurs minus Hairton and Mahinmi…5 game series…
1-Marcus Williams 6′7
2-Malik Hairston 6′6
3-M. Haislip 6′10
4-Duane Jones 6′11
5-Ian Mahinmi 7,0
Lets assume that Avery Johnson is my D League Team coach against the all mighty Popovich.
Finally, my match ups,
Duncan-Jones
Mcdyess-Mahinmi
Hill-Hairston
Jefferson-Haislip
Ginnobli-Williams
OK guys…….Who wins this series? These are players deemed worthless by coach Pop. Unworthy of a place on this roster.
Add your stud standouts, Bonner and Bogans to the Spurs mix if you like. That just gives D League more of an advantage.
Just a closer look at this coach’s personnel decisions.
Of course this is D League only. Didnt include the scrubs that were kicked to the curb in favor of the Red Rocket…K. Thomas, D Gooden, Mensa Bonsu, Ratliff, Scola, or Oberto.
Ball is in your court…..
March 26th, 2010 at 4:36 am
@ Ive man
Ref Jones….
Nice Player…Never heard of this kid….
March 26th, 2010 at 5:30 am
@Ballhogs,
“Moving Duncan to center would extend his career, and afford us the opportunity to bring in a reasonably priced back up 5, instead of a starter. This way, Spurs could afford a quality Power Forward, Tim’s eventual replacement, to shore up the frontcourt….”
BHog, you make an excellent point re Duncan. I also think moving him back to the post, at the C spot would be beneficial for both Duncan and the Team as he does not move around in space well anymore. But what he can do, with his high basketball I.Q. and skill set, is operate down in the post.
Unfortunately, I think Duncan fashions himself as a power forward. With the young, stronger, faster PF’s in the game today - this is a mismatch for the Duncan and the Spurs now to the disadvantage of both Duncan and the Spurs.
March 26th, 2010 at 5:31 am
Hoopster,
I wasn’t clear either, the reason I don’t completely agree with your assertion (I do agree that Hill’s numbers will go down some) is minutes. If Manu could average over 40 minutes then we wouldn’t need another playmaking guard. As it stands, Parker is a better creator than Hill and Hill can produce (hit spot ups 3, open jumpers) as a second option.
Hobson13,
The above is why I don’t like any trade of TP that I can think of. I don’t think a backup pg and shooters get us where we want to go. Of course, I think this idea should be revisited depending on what TP does this summer. Clearly an injured TP doesn’t get the job done.
Jim Henderson,
I agree that TP is better Bynum, but first things first.
March 26th, 2010 at 5:34 am
Spurs vs. Cavs tonight -
Another play day for Lebron and another loss for the Spurs. You see Lebron is not resting, Lebron is not waiting for the playoffs to start before he turns up the intensity and focus - Lebron is about taking care of business.
March 26th, 2010 at 5:50 am
@ Bigballs
Unfortunately you are correct on the Lebron assessment. Also, I like this coach,,,Say what you must about him, but the guy is doing a great job.
He has the hottest player in the league, great pieces around him and a deep bench.
Much More importantly,
He has created an environment for these players that is condusive to success. They are loose and agressive. They are a close knit group, a FAMILY….and they actually enjoy the game. Why, because they are allowed to. This is huge in building a contender.
As for our chances….If the rotations are the the same ones used in Laker game, we get spanked.
At this point, considering the current level of play, Pop should just go ahead and throw the youngsters in the mix. I dont see the risk being any higher than it is with our current role players.
As for Cleveland tonight, Duncan will come to play after being so bad @ LA and shouldnt struggle against Z.
Otherwise, the matchups are tough all around the horn.
Should be entertainng…
March 26th, 2010 at 6:10 am
Ballhog -
Your D-League team loses the series 3-0, 100 times out of 100. I would bet the Spurs if the line was anything less than 20 points. No D-League team can compete with an NBA team.
March 26th, 2010 at 6:29 am
@Ballhog,
The Spurs team would have an easier sweep then they did against the ‘07 Cavs. The fact you think the D-leaguers would put up anything resembling a fight against those 5 is pretty friggen’ hilarious.
March 26th, 2010 at 6:39 am
@Mike
Michael you and many others on this board are missing the whole point about playing the young kids(D-leaguers). Its not so much about what these young kids can do, its more about knowing what the other guys, who having been playing all year, can not do. Bogus should not be in the league; Bonner is a Euro player; Mason is an end of the bench player and Mihinmi, a young, athletic 7 footer, should be playing. If not a player for the Spurs, the Rockets, Lakers, Mavs or Thunder will take him.
So the point is, why continue to waste time with those guys ? they can not get it done.
March 26th, 2010 at 6:45 am
@bigballs,
Perhaps if Mahinmi had skill other then being “tall” and “athletic” he would play. The fact that you downplay Bogans, Bonner, and Mason, while talking up Mahinmi is also pretty friggen’ hilarious.
March 26th, 2010 at 6:46 am
I understand the point you’re trying to make @BALLHOG (after all, you’ve stated it multiple times)…. but the Spurs win your hypothetical series.
I’ll admit that Mahinmi is a huge unknown (but probably not very good), but every other matchup out there is no contest. I’ve been to a couple Toros games, and those guys would get SMOKED!
March 26th, 2010 at 6:53 am
Jim Henderson, you cannot be serious. You want to trade Tony, Manu, Bonner and McDyess for Dalambert, Iggy and Williams? Seriously? Four rotation players and two of the best three players on a 50 win team for three rotation players on a crappy 76ers team? Really?
I’ve said it before, but I believe in loyalty. Tim, Manu and Tony should retire as Spurs. But even if loyalty wasn’t a factor, TP and Manu alone wouldn’t be worth those sixers. The Sixers have been trying to get rid of Dalambert for a few years now and he’s supposed to be our answer?
I can’t believe some of the opinions of so called spurs fans. I’m just grateful none of you are in charge.
March 26th, 2010 at 7:01 am
Now this I like….
Fellas, your responses to my D League challenge are appreciated…
I know you think that my D League team couldnt hang, but I digress….
All players have the same thing in common. They tend to get better when the coach believes in them, plays them, and allows them an opportunity to get consistent minutes.
My take is simple. If these kids were given that type opportunity over just a few games, then we could accurately judge thier talent level. Cant do it in spot minutes. Cant do it while thier confindence is shaky…
My point actually had nothing to do with the D League team winning. It had everything to do with them being able to bring equal or better value than our current role players, on younger legs, at a cheaper cost. It aint Rocket Science….
Our current role players are just not earning thier check.
But, since I put it out there as a series, I say my D League matchup does lose to the Spurs in the series, but only becaue of Ginnobli. Remove G from the mix and my D League team gets hard to beat.
Besides, lets not forget that Avery is thier coach. He would have them playing at thier highest level.
I would love to see it…..
March 26th, 2010 at 7:10 am
@ballhog,
Check out this pic for an answer to your latest writings…
Pic
March 26th, 2010 at 7:32 am
Gotta agree with Krista’s post in ref trades…
The problem isnt just Dalambert…Iggy is sporadic, inconsistent and a little wild in his game…..I wouldnt touch him as a starter.
Bad trade. Lets not under value our big 3.
They are at the level where it would need to be stud for stud…even at thier current ages.
G. TP. TD
for
Garnett, Rondo, Pierce
Anything less than that type of return, (not necessarily those players, but those caliber of players), would be giving the Big 3 away for nothing.
March 26th, 2010 at 7:35 am
@ Mike
Who?
I was forced to ignore your picture post. After speaking with management, I discovered that you are not on the 48’s VIP…
Sorry dude…
March 26th, 2010 at 8:37 am
Ballhog,
Those are guys, who except for Hairston, can’t get on any team in the NBA. Saying things like, without Ginobili they’d be hard to be beat, is based on what exactly? Their vast accomplishments? Or your dreams of their potential? Even if your point isn’t that they would stand a chance, which they wouldn’t, you’re so far off base that it’s hard to give credence to anything else you right.
March 26th, 2010 at 9:26 am
you need to play your younger talent if josh powell can play minutes there is no way ian and malik shouldnt play 10 to 15 mintes a night they get you points on atheletic ability alone. Put them with the starters and i guarantee if you dont pull them after their first mistake and they play well.
March 26th, 2010 at 9:31 am
pop need to play the young talent if josh powell can play 10 to 15 minutes there is no way you can tell me that ian and malik couldnt. Put them with the starters and i guarantee they play well if he let them play and dont pull them after their first mistake. They we get you loose balls and hustle points on athletic ability alone and thats what this teams needs.
March 26th, 2010 at 9:32 am
@BALLHOG Did I make the VIP? I need this.
March 26th, 2010 at 10:03 am
@ kevin
All day long mannnnnn.
@ dduran
Again,
Players play. Everybody has to start somewhere. As for what I base it on, since it is apparently not obvious to you…
Simple, they are just more athletic and much longer. From a stand point of youth, athleticism and length along with the fire of The Little General, they would be formiddable..
Many talented players dont make it in the league. Most often, its not because they arent good players. It is mostly timing and injuries. These opportunities to crack an NBA rotation are few and far between for young hopefuls….
But since you are talking smack about it…
Jones strong enough to cause TD problems…He is averaging over 20 pts and 18 boards in the D….
Marcus Williams would be in no mans land with Ginnobli…Only team defense could save his azz…Its our weakest matchup.
Haislip and Jefferson would probably come out even..Wow and Haislip wouldnt make 15 mil to be average..
Mahinmi would be able to score on McDyess in the paint, and only needs to get a hand in his face defensively.
Hairston would give Hill all he could handle…and do a devent job on him defensively.
Need I say any more….
March 26th, 2010 at 10:22 am
Does anyone think the Spurs will win the needed 8 a games to get a 50 in season. I doubt it very much. I see them going in best case scenario 6-6 on the remaining 12 games. What do you guys think?
March 26th, 2010 at 10:23 am
*Fixed Errors
Does anyone think the Spurs will win the needed 8 games to get a 50 win season. I doubt it very much. I see them going in best case scenario 6-6 on the remaining 12 games. What do you guys think?
March 26th, 2010 at 10:47 am
Ballhog -
Just for arguments sake and b/c it’s a slow Friday afternoon: that D-League team would get eatin’ alive. I’d love to see the line on that game. Spurs -22? At worst, -18. The team you describe wouldn’t be able to break into the Euroleague, much less compete with a veteran NBA team.
March 26th, 2010 at 10:48 am
Ballhog
What’s your obsession with Avery Johnson? Did you watch his teams in the ‘06 and ‘07 finals and playoffs? Pop would have coached both of those teams to titles.
March 26th, 2010 at 11:37 am
@Ballhog, not sure why I’m addressing this BUT because I won’t have anything new written until after the Cavs game I will mention that your DLeague vs. Spurs dream literally did happen.
The Spurs held an open practice at the beginning of the season that featured a scrimmage which had many of the matchups you listed. In each case, the DLeague players were in way over their heads.
I get that there is a big case of backup quarterback syndrome going on here, what with the season falling below expectations so far, but realistically many of the things being proposed in these comments are neither plausible (trading for Bosh) or the answer (starting Mahinmi, trading TP or Ginobili for anything less than an All-NBA player).
The only case where you can begin to make an argument with merit is for Hairston, who is closer to being an NBA rotation player than anyone we’ve had in Austin.
March 26th, 2010 at 12:02 pm
TheRealBarackObama
March 26th, 2010 at 12:09 am
“You numbskulls and your proposterous trade proposals.”
I hope your backward thinking, and stay the course mentality does not represent the Spurs FO. Otherwise we’re doomed to several years of mediocrity.
lvmainman
March 26th, 2010 at 12:10 am
“Trade Jefferson and the rights to Splitter for Chris Bosh in the offseason please.”
You guys make me laugh with your trade proposals that give up essentially nothing for something great. Who in their right mind is going to take a reject (RJ) & and a European unproven in the NBA for one of the most sought after PF’s on the market?
“I’m not saying he can be our savior but rather stating that with a few tinkerings to the line up, such as finding guys that aren’t afraid of making open shots, could potentially squeeze out one last run before completely blowing up this core.”
eeg30
March 26th, 2010 at 2:28 am
The time for “wishful thinking” is over.
“Jim Henderson, you cannot be serious. You want to trade Tony, Manu, Bonner and McDyess for Dalambert, Iggy and Williams? Seriously? Four rotation players and two of the best three players on a 50 win team for three rotation players on a crappy 76ers team? Really?”
krista
March 26th, 2010 at 6:53 am
No offense, but I was tempted to stop reading your post once you declared Dalembert, Iggy, & Williams rotation players. You obviously don’t understand the game at all. But then this………
“I’ve said it before, but I believe in loyalty.”
Why don’t you talk to Sandra Bullock about that, Krista. This is a business, not a religion.
JT
March 26th, 2010 at 10:23 am
I think you’re right.
March 26th, 2010 at 12:07 pm
On my trade proposal:
Dalembert: Vital Facts
6′11″, 250 pds., 28 years old, CENTER, solid citizen - from Haiti, foreign born - perfect compliment for Spurs front line w/TDuncan
Doesn’t need the ball on offense, but can finish strong near the rim. Very good defender in the post.
6th in NBA in BLOCKS per game - 2.0
13th in NBA in rpg. - 9.6
Andre Iguodala: Vital Facts
6′6″, 210 pds., 26 yrs. old
-has to have character to not cause trouble after being stuck with the Sixers his first 5 yrs. in the league!
A tremendously athletic finisher, and versatile player that can play equally well at SG & SF
Averages: 17.0 ppg., 6.6 rpg., 5.7 apg., 1.7 spg.
The ONLY guy in the league who averages 17+ ppg, 6+rpg, 5+apg, 1.7+spg. is, guess who……?
That’s right, LeBRON JAMES
Lou Williams: Vital Facts
6′1″, 175 pds., 23 yrs. old, PG
Averages: 14.4 ppg., 4.0 apg., 3.1 rpg., 1.3 spg., assist to turnover ratio a solid 2.5 (e.g., Parker’s is 2.2), 3o minutes per game. - 3rd year in the league.
Very quick, solid all-around player, with a scoring instinct. Tremendous upside, still at age 23.
THIS TRADE GETS US MUCH MORE ATHLETIC & YOUNGER, with solid to exceptional players with significant UPSIDE, and who are all great fits that fill GAPING holes in our ability to truly compete against our ELITE competitors.
Now, for those of you that characterize the proposal as preposterous, with either nonchalance, or “big-three obsession”, get back to me when you can upgrade your response from silly to reasonable.
I’d rather fix the holes and upgrade the ship with newer parts rather than keep having another drink while the TITANIC sinks. Wouldn’t you?
P.S. We may very well lose Manu anyway. Do you want to lose him for nothing? Ditto for Bonner & Mason. TP’s contract expires next year. Don’t be lulled into the false sense of security that TP’s going to be re-signed in 2011-2012. That’s certainly not a given.
March 26th, 2010 at 12:15 pm
@Jim
The problem with your Sixers trade proposal is that each of the players you mention would fit best around stars as opposed to being your stars-something you would have if you get rid of Manu and Tony. I think in this instance, you are overvaluing the Sixers pieces (and not looking at their contracts) and undervaluing the Spurs. Not to mention the assumption that Parker is gone just because he has an actress for a wife.
I’m all for Iggy too, but the Sixers are looking to dump salary and if it were a move the Spurs would consider, I think a salary dump of RJ’s expiring, with McDyess and Blair would be the most I’d consider parting with.
March 26th, 2010 at 12:17 pm
@Mike
“Perhaps if Mahinmi had skill other then being “tall” and “athletic” he would play. The fact that you downplay Bogans, Bonner, and Mason, while talking up Mahinmi is also pretty friggen’ hilarious.”
Mikee, I can tell you are a rook. Since you don’t know, let me educate you. There is always a premium on young, athletic, 7 footers. This is why Mahinmi is not clumped in with Bogus, Forest Gump Bonner and Peg leg Mason.
If the Spurs Nations does not want Mahinmi, then the Mavs, Rockets, Lakers and Thunder stand ready to take the Spurs droppings just as they took Luis Scola. Scola never got a chance to suit up for the Spurs - They thought he did not fit and they had no room for him.
Kinda reminds me of the Little babe that they had no place for in the INN - so they cast him out to the barn. The same eventually became the head of the corner.
March 26th, 2010 at 12:21 pm
Re Igudola of the 76er’s,
Don’t touch him. He is fools gold. All he can do is dunk and occassionally hit a jump shot. While athletic, he is not a great ball handling, not a great shooter, no a great scorer.
This kid will get paid by someone, just better not be the Spurs — Iggy is a pickup that only a fool would me.
March 26th, 2010 at 12:40 pm
Jesse Blanchard
March 26th, 2010 at 11:37 am
“……..but realistically many of the things being proposed in these comments are neither plausible (trading for Bosh) or the answer (starting Mahinmi, trading TP or Ginobili for anything less than an All-NBA player). ”
I respectfully disagree. See my post above. We need to begin to deal with the realities at hand, and for heavens sake, let’s start thinking outside the box! And as Spurs fans, we can not afford to think of Parker & Manu as icons — that’s just going a bit far. The fact is we probably can’t afford Manu at his market value and still upgrade our team to the extent that the word “titles” could even enter our vocabulary. Same with TP. And the fact is, there’s a paucity of “big men” out there that are either available, or worth anything in terms of getting a playoff team (us) into true contention. That’s a reality we have to face. Now, I understand that my proposal is a “mind-blower”, but it’s the type of thing we have to look at to put ourselves into position to challenge into the foreseeable future. Now, don’t get me wrong, I love these players (Manu, TP), and thoroughly understand their value, but do we really want to hold onto the Spur culture that the glory days of these two represent, or do we want to move FORWARD and make a sincere effort to reclaim the glory with some new and appealing pieces?
Look, if we don’t want to mess with rearranging the pillars, what are our options to try to get back on top in the next 2-3 years?
I may be blind, but I only see one viable option, in the tinkering way of doing things: pray that we can sign Marcus Camby in the off-season to a 2-3 year deal, AND resign Manu in the off season, as well as Parker the following year. That could get us at least in the realm of contention. Anything less could very well leave us as at best as a 1st round playoff team, and at worst an also-ran for years to come.
If anyone wants to point out problems to what I’m proposing, by all means do so. I’m quite open to hearing what you have to say. But can I ask you all to be specific, factual, and at least give the pretense of being a businessman, as well as a fan in your response? Thanks.
March 26th, 2010 at 12:53 pm
Jim -
I think most agree with your thesis/logic behind the trade, just not the particular deal you proposed. You’re right - we need to make to tough decisions, even if that means parting with a core player if the right deal presents itself.
Philly is trying to cut salary. They’re looking for young, inexpensive players, not older guys like TP or Manu. That’s also a lot of guaranteed salary for SA to take back, especially when you consider the looming CBA fight and shrinking salary cap. I’m also not too high on Iggy, especially at his price.
March 26th, 2010 at 1:17 pm
Jesse Blanchard
March 26th, 2010 at 12:15 pm
“The problem with your Sixers trade proposal is that each of the players you mention would fit best around stars as opposed to being your stars.”
“Stars” are made by as much by being part of an elite “team” (which is partly luck). There’s little question Iggy would become a “star” when paired with Duncan, Hill, Blair, RJ, & Dalembert. You saw his production line in my previous post. And he’s the type of player that would likely be even more productive on a good team. By the way, most championship teams win with two “stars”, not three.
“I think in this instance, you are overvaluing the Sixers pieces (and not looking at their contracts) and undervaluing the Spurs.”
No, I looked at the contracts. Did you? Dalembert, 12 mil./2 yrs. - good shot at re-signing for a bit less; Iggy - 12.2 mil. - long-term, Williams - 5 mil.; Manu - 10.7 mil., TP - 12.6 mil., Bonner - 3.2 mil., Dice 4.5 mil. For both teams, about 30 mil. On the contrary, I think you’re overvaluing the Spur players, and undervaluing the Sixers players, in terms of what they would mean to our franchise over the long-term.
“Not to mention the assumption that Parker is gone just because he has an actress for a wife. ”
Who made that assumption? Certainly not me.
“I’m all for Iggy too, but the Sixers are looking to dump salary and if it were a move the Spurs would consider, I think a salary dump of RJ’s expiring, with McDyess and Blair would be the most I’d consider parting with.”
The Sixer’s are dumping a lot of salary in my deal, and nobody’s going to give up a reject (RJ) for Iggy. That’s just NOT going to happen. You’ve just signaled you just don’t want to deal with that offer. Also, why would you be willing to trade our youngest PF with great, Boozer like-potential. He’s only 20 years old and has the height issues to work through, but the guy is special. He’ll develop his shot and get it done in due time.
March 26th, 2010 at 1:18 pm
@BigBalls,
How’s Thabeet working out for the Grizz? Just because there is a market out there for 7 foot athletic big men, doesn’t mean said big men are good NBA players.
March 26th, 2010 at 1:23 pm
@ JimJim
Dalambert is marketable. He is a top 10 center in the league because most centers in the league are average.
It is the reason that I suggested moving Duncan to the 5. Then, instead of spending Daleambert money on a center, we could sign a back up for Duncan, or play Mahinmi, or pray on getting Splitter.
At that point, we could spend a little mid level money on a good PF.
As for Ginnobli, Cant see how we could keep him unless Jeff is gone. I agree with you about Parker. None of us can speculate on whether or not he will remian a Spur.
Trading him would suck, but my gut is that Holt would rather keep Manu. It just makes more dollars and sense.
During the last 3 games I attended at the AT&T center, I saw 2 Duncan jerseys. The remainder were GINNOBLI….Risky indeed.
Fianlly,
@ Jesese Blanchard
I would put big dollars on that D League game, if the Spurs were without Ginnobli.
Regrdless of how many folks there are that think this game is not about athleticism, it is. This is why we dont get easy vcistoies the way we did in the past. The competition level has increased in the league. Why? Athletes!
For all the +/- guys, stats are usually what we use to justify marginal scrubs.
I dont need stats on Wade, Lebron, and Kobe to know that they are stud athletes. They are complete players. Cant hurt you one way, kill you another.
This is why I would put the bucks on my D League game.,
My athletes would prevail.
As for Avery, and Avery losing in Dallas as a rookie head coach. Allow me to take you to school.
Avery came in and gave the Mavs an identity. They were a bunch of run and gun wild boys that played zero defense and had no team unity….
You know what, I will stop right there and just say…Bring on the General….
Pop has so many blinded. Comes in here and rides on the coat tails of the best PF in the NBA, David Robinson, Parker, Kerr, Elliott, my main man Mario Ellie, and others.
Now that he doesnt have the pieces, I can understand the losses, but not the lack of adjustments or the personnel moves.
Are we claiming that Phil Jackson would play these same scrubs? Give them 25 minutes a game to score 3 points and have a half a rebound? I dont think so….
Help me out…Prove me wrong mannnnn….
Changing gears….
Tonight,,,,WOW
Lebron, Jamison, Hickson, West, Parker, and havent mentioned Mo Williams or the bench yet……
Tough night indeed…..
March 26th, 2010 at 1:30 pm
Ugh. I think I might stop reading comments after these.
March 26th, 2010 at 1:31 pm
Tyler
March 26th, 2010 at 12:53 pm
Thanks reasoned response.
That said, I have a few of questions for you.
“Philly is trying to cut salary. They’re looking for young, inexpensive players, not older guys like TP or Manu.”
Why are you so sure that this is the case? For one, theSixers are dumping salary, Dalembert & Iggy make 12 mil/yr. And Philly already has too many young players, many unproven. This is in fact a main reason that’s preventing them from becoming a playoff team. And of course, TP is not old, and is of course an experienced veteran that, between him and Manu, could effectively run that keystone cop of a team they have as currently constructed. By the way, the young center they have, Speights, has tremendous talent that I’m sure TP & Manu would love to exploit.
“That’s also a lot of guaranteed salary for SA to take back…..”
Valid point. That is true. But I think he could be stellar building block for our future, if we can pull it off financially.
“I’m also not too high on Iggy…..”
Why, may I ask?
March 26th, 2010 at 1:32 pm
Seriously Ballhog.
A dozen uppercuts. Immediately.
March 26th, 2010 at 1:36 pm
Jordan
March 26th, 2010 at 1:30 pm
“Ugh. I think I might stop reading comments after these.”
Why, may I ask?
March 26th, 2010 at 1:42 pm
@Ballhog
“It is the reason that I suggested moving Duncan to the 5. Then, instead of spending Daleambert money on a center, we could sign a back up for Duncan, or play Mahinmi, or pray on getting Splitter.”
I’m not opposed to playing Duncan at center if we had a viable plan to make that work. Unfortunately, I don’t see that we have one, and I’m not too high on Mahinmi making a real difference, or in the chances of signing Splitter.
If we can’t resist tinkering, why not make a serious move for Camby, as I mentioned in a previous post? That guy can ball, even at age 36.
March 26th, 2010 at 1:46 pm
@Jim….
Though I think Tony and Manu are Spurs icons, it’s not this line of reasoning that has me questioning your trade.
With a summer off (and I think Tony gets it, he has an expiring deal next year and a new CBA to contend with, he’s going to want next season to be his best yet), I think it’s reasonable to expect Parker’s game to be somewhere between an All-Star and an All-NBA point guard.
Ginobili, as he is today, is an elite shooting guard and playmaker. Diminished? He’s Jason Kidd at worst.
Williams will never be Parker. Iggy is a great complementary player, perhaps one of the best in the league. But you’re not winning a title with him as your second best player. And Dalembert? He’s overpaid but he does have a niche. Remember, the Sixers did everything to move both or Brand this season. No one bit. The Suns could have.
The Sixers are looking to dump salaries because their roster is a failed one. If you’re bringing in Iggy, it’d have to be to fit around Parker, Ginobili and Duncan. Taking back Dalembert (or Brand) would be the sweetener, because it allows the Sixers to clear massive salary.
RJ’s contract and Blair (his skill set is the most easily replaced, even if the player replacing him is not as good) are our best trade chips.
March 26th, 2010 at 1:47 pm
@ everyone…..Duncan isn’t listed as a center, but trust me, he’s been moved to center for quite some time.
March 26th, 2010 at 1:57 pm
@Jesse
Is there any truth to the rumor I heard about Real Madrid willing to pay MANU 14 mill a year??
That’s a lot of cheese.
March 26th, 2010 at 2:05 pm
-Ballhog
“As for Avery, and Avery losing in Dallas as a rookie head coach. Allow me to take you to school. Avery came in and gave the Mavs an identity. They were a bunch of run and gun wild boys that played zero defense and had no team unity….”
“Prove me wrong mannnnn….”
First, you actually have to be right to be proven wrong. You can have your own opinion but not entitled to your own facts……and Phil Jackson had some pretty lean years in between Shaquille and Gasol with 1st rd exits, 7th seeds, etc. Your logic isn’t very sound.
March 26th, 2010 at 2:10 pm
……..Smush Parker ring a bell?
March 26th, 2010 at 2:29 pm
Jesse Blanchard
March 26th, 2010 at 1:46 pm
“Iggy is a great complementary player, perhaps one of the best in the league. But you’re not winning a title with him as your second best player.”
I know of NO merely “complimentary” player that has the stat line of Iggy (see the previous post again for stats to refresh memory). Thus, I respectfully disagree. Please expound on your point, if you wish.
“With a summer off (and I think Tony gets it, he has an expiring deal next year and a new CBA to contend with, he’s going to want next season to be his best yet), I think it’s reasonable to expect Parker’s game to be somewhere between an All-Star and an All-NBA point guard. ”
You can inflate Parker’s value, and fantasize about this all you want. That doesn’t mean it’s going to happen. In fact, I’d say the odds are against it (i.e., “all-NBA point guard” - although maybe 3rd team, does that count!).
“Ginobili, as he is today, is an elite shooting guard and playmaker. Diminished? He’s Jason Kidd at worst.”
This is kind of silly. They’ve always been very different players. That, and Jason Kidd’s having an exceptional year at age THIRTY-SEVEN, and has a history of being one of the most DURABLE (as in, injury free!) players in NBA history.
“Williams will never be Parker.”
He doesn’t need to be. The deal isn’t Parker for Williams. That said, he is a solid player right now, at age 23, without the benefit of a HOF coach, and has substantial upside.
“Dalembert? He’s overpaid but he does have a niche. Remember, the Sixers did everything to move both or Brand this season. No one bit. The Suns could have.”
And the Suns should have. They could “really” be contending right now with Dalembert next to Amare. What a mistake!
“The Sixers are looking to dump salaries because their roster is a failed one. If you’re bringing in Iggy, it’d have to be to fit around Parker, Ginobili and Duncan. Taking back Dalembert (or Brand) would be the sweetener, because it allows the Sixers to clear massive salary.”
For one thing, I don’t think their roster is a failed one. They need savy, veteran leadership to become a playoff team in the East. TP & Manu would give them that. Teams would very much like to avoid being in “rebuild” mode interminably. It’s not good for the team, or for ticket revenue.
And explain to me, in numbers, how the Spurs keep Duncan under contract, re-sign Manu, and TP the following year, and absorb the contracts of of Iggy & Dalembert? By dumping the RJ (who nobody in their right mind would take before next years trade deadline) contract, and trading away our best front court draft prospect we’ve had since TD?!
“RJ’s contract and Blair (his skill set is the most easily replaced, even if the player replacing him is not as good) are our best trade chips.”
Blair’s “current” skill-set, at age 20, I remind you, is replaceable. Blair & his potential long-term are NOT replaceable. He’s going to be truly special in due time. And RJ’s is worth NOTHING until “hopefully” next years trade deadline.
Aren’t you creating scenarios in your mind to allow the big three to stay together? Truthfully?
March 26th, 2010 at 2:35 pm
@ Colin
Touche my man….Phil did struggle a bit. However, he is still The Man. Besides, my question was, Would Phil play Bonner and Bogans 25 minutes a game?
@ Busha
Im no easy out….
@ JimJim
Camby would be an awsome addition here. He could have been here already. But you and I know that story. He and Duncan together on the block could be nasty…
As for that rumor on Ginnobli that junierizzle mentioned in a previous post, It is true.
A Europeon team is, in fact, offering him 5 years at 14 mil a year, according to ESPN… Looks like Manu will be shopping for luggage. Me, at 32 years old, I’d be on the plane now.
March 26th, 2010 at 2:47 pm
Ballhog
I’m not arguing that Jackson isn’t possibly the greatest, he IS in the discussion. I just think, with Pop, peaks and valleys come and go with great players. Jackson had his, Pat Riley had his, Auerbach had his, Tomjanovich had his, and Poppovich as well.
Right now it wouldn’t matter who is coaching, I think the Spurs would be about where they are now because of the supporting cast level of performance…..irregardless if Mahinmi or Hairston (who I believe needs to get some burn) got their minutes.
Phil Jackson DID start Smush Parker for a season. So if he would make that kind of personnel decision, I COULD see him playing Bonner in extended minutes given a certain roster.
March 26th, 2010 at 3:02 pm
Why is getting Chris Bosh not plausible?
Was the Cavs trade for Antawn Jamison for a 1st round draft pick plausible?
Was the Lakers trade for Pau Gasol for Kwame Brown plausible?
It is quite plausible that Chris Bosh will want to leave the Raptors as a free agent and it is quite plausible that the Raptors will want to do a sign and trade, so that Bosh doesn’t leave for nothing, the way Carlos Boozer left the Cavs.
Maybe our offer for Bosh might not be the most enticing, but a trade to acquire Bosh is plausible. Jefferson’s contract matches Bosh’s new contract $ for $. Throw in Splitter’s rights and who knows.
I’ll predict now that Bosh will go somewhere else via a sign and trade, the way Rashard Lewis went to the Magic for a 2nd round draft pick.
So, people who say trading for Bosh is not plausible, haven’t acknowledged trades of the past.
March 26th, 2010 at 3:08 pm
Pop signed Jerells today?
Today,
Not three weeks ago while Parker was down, not before signing Garrett Temple, and without considering front court help?
Need a crystal ball to realize the thought process, unless of course we have thrown in the towel on the season.
If so, Inquiring minds want to know….
@ Colin, Jim
Who guards the King tonight? Who guards Hickson?
I cant wait to see……
March 26th, 2010 at 3:49 pm
Jim-
When Philly signed Brand, they tied up a ton of their cap on guys that aren’t going to take them to the playoffs. As a result, they’ve been caught in no man’s land - an overpaid roster chuck full with a bunch of guaranteed $ through next year that isn’t getting results. As a result, all their moves over the last year and a half have been geared toward slashing payroll to get under the luxury tax and getting younger. They’re essentially trying to hit reset. If you look a the deals that have been thrown around with them involved, all of them include cap space (the most important) and inexpensive, short contracts. That’s why I don’t think older players, such as TP or Manu, appeal to them. And while TP might not be too old, his contract isn’t cheap, which doesn’t help them get under the tax.
Also, as Jesse touched on, I don’t look at Iggy and see that guy as the 2nd best player on a championship team, which is what he’s getting paid like. Good player? Yes, but worthy of that price tag? I don’t think so. His contract also runs thru 2013/14. Also, he’s putting up those numbers on a bad team. Even though they’re good numbers, they don’t hold as much weight in that circumstance in my opinion.
March 26th, 2010 at 4:00 pm
I hear TP may be back on the court tonight? Any truth?
One more comment on Ginnobli,
To go and play in Spain, where teams play once per week, for 14 mil a year…Add endorsements,,,at a minimum, another 20 million….Sipping pina colada’s on a spanish beach…Can you go out any bigger? G has literally busted his azz here in San Antonio…He deserves it all…..
Oh by the way, after this offer, Ginnobli can no longer be coached….My, My, My…No more leveragfe Pop…G is in the drivers seat…
Go G…………….
March 26th, 2010 at 4:01 pm
Ballhog-
Another team was interested in Jerells, so we signed him and sent him back to the Toros so we kept his rights. This actually happened a few days ago.
March 26th, 2010 at 4:20 pm
Blah blah blah.
Jim Henderson, can you quote me?
March 26th, 2010 at 4:59 pm
Keith Bogans misses a open 15 ft jumper so badly it ignites a Lebron dunk because the miss went to the top of the key.
Why is Malik Hairston behind this bum?
March 26th, 2010 at 5:18 pm
Bogans is locking my jaws… This is a funny dude…
March 26th, 2010 at 5:39 pm
I cant stand delonte west…
March 26th, 2010 at 5:41 pm
mason is about as terrible as one poor sum’bitch can be. GET WITH IT ROGER!
March 26th, 2010 at 6:14 pm
Malik Hairston comes in the game early in the 2nd quarter. BALLHOG & bigballs cheer wildly. 2 minutes later his man has 8 points and Malik has 3 fouls. I honestly think Pop *wants* to play this guy but, between his fouls and mental lapses, he just can’t stay on the floor. Athleticism isn’t always all it’s cracked up to be. For a case in point, see the 76′ers.
While I disagreed with his views, I at least respected bigballs as rational until this D League business. Athleticism is not everything. It isn’t even half of what makes a player great. Oh, and you made an argument for how your squad matches up on defense, but who is going to score for you? Hairston’s jumper sucks, Mahinmi is wild with little finesse around the rim. None of the others have scored much if at all at the big kids’ table. Good luck.
The Spurs’s failures are attributable to (a) RJ not being nearly as good as evryone thought in a pick and roll offense, (b) McDyess beeing inept on team defense, (c) Ginobili taking far too long to get his game back (he’s a little psychologically fragile), (d) Tony’s injury (plantar f., not the latest one, and (e) Pop taking forever to finally figure out a consistent rotation. That’s a lot of reasons, but that’s my take-ther is no one simple explanation for the troubles we’ve seen.
I personally would rather see the Spurs let this current regime fade out and then rebuild with young players, primarily through the draft. I realize this requires missing the playoffs, but we can always win another lottery or something.
March 26th, 2010 at 6:36 pm
Wow, Bonner didn’t just stand at the 3 pt line like a stiff, he cut to the basket and got a dunk.
WOW!
March 26th, 2010 at 6:42 pm
Bogans, 1st made 4th qtr 3pt shot as a Spur!
March 26th, 2010 at 6:45 pm
McDyess has serious rotation problems on defense. Starting at about the 4 minute mark of the third, he had back to back plays where he totally looked lost in no man’s land and gave up layups. Contrast that with the very next defensive stand in which Duncan switched to his man, jumped to double team, then quickly rotated directly back to his man for a deflection and steal. McDyess simply does not work in this defense.
March 26th, 2010 at 6:49 pm
Imagine if Ginobili had played the entire 4th qtr against the Lakers?
14 pts in the 4th qtr, a charge taken, an assist on Bogans 3 pointer.
Resign Ginobili now!
March 26th, 2010 at 7:11 pm
@ I man
“Wow, Bonner didn’t just stand at the 3 pt line like a stiff, he cut to the basket and got a dunk.”
I man, you said it. I have been saying this all along. That move is more of what bonner could be doing as a compliment to his game when he is clanking bombs of the rim. @6′10″, he can put it on the floor a bit around the paint area.
bonner’s number tonight not great, but an effect game. 10 to 15 min per game is about max for bonner. Got close to 20 tonight. Bonner contributed tonight - Good Job Bonner!
March 26th, 2010 at 7:12 pm
As much as we hate on Bogans, we have to give him credit for doing a pretty good job on Jamison in the fourth. Very impressive at times.
March 26th, 2010 at 7:16 pm
@Jacob
“mason is about as terrible as one poor sum’bitch can be. GET WITH IT ROGER!”
My gosh, Jacob - I have been known to have few sour words for Rog Mason, but don’t you think you are being a little harsh? What an ass SCOLDING!
March 26th, 2010 at 7:27 pm
@I Man,
“Keith Bogans misses a open 15 ft jumper so badly it ignites a Lebron dunk because the miss went to the top of the key. Why is Malik Hairston behind this bum?”
I Man, another astute take for this really is the crux of the matter. This has been the scene for much of the year.
Bogus contributed tonight in 20+ mins - TOO MANY. — he should be a 10 to 12 min guy, if that. The other mins should go to Hairston.
For tonight, Bogus can enjoy dinner and not feel like a thief for stealing money from the Spur organization.
March 26th, 2010 at 7:33 pm
@Tyler, Jesse, and Bigballs,
I’ve noticed a lot of people seem to dislike the trade idea revolving around the 76ers and Iggy in this thread. I am just curious as to what your trade suggestions might be for the summer.
Surely at this point, we all know that this team as currently constructed won’t have enough juice to get it done next year and we can’t rely on getting an unbelievable draft pick (not that Pop likes playing the youngsters anyway) So that leaves us with one option: a trade. I know there may be some issues with trading both Tony and Manu for the Philly boys, but what solutions would you recommend?
March 26th, 2010 at 7:44 pm
@Hobson13
You know the trade thing can be pretty hard to figure out - so many scenerios, so many considerations - So, its not easy to tell this early.
One thing I know is that Iggy is not the guy. He is a nice young player, nice athlete, nice dunker, but just really nothing to hang his hat on as a player in the league. Oh yeah, some one will pay him, I just don’t believe he is a fit with the Spurs.
Why? Because somewhere in Pop’s system, he will have him shooting spot up 3’s and that is not his game. He can hit an outside shot, but I don’t think he is a consistent enough outside shooter, particular for the money he will command.
Again, someone will pay him if he doesn’t stay with the 76er’s — but Spurs should pass on Iggy.
March 26th, 2010 at 7:51 pm
@Hobson13
Part II
I forgot to mention. The Spurs already have an Iggy on there team in M. Hairston. I think Hairston’s game is every bit as good as Iggy’s. I even think Hairston is a better outside shooter.
We’ve only seen Hairston in the half court game, but he can get out on the wings, run and finish HIGH at the rim. This aspect we see and have seen in Iggy, but Hairston could bring that same skill set to the table, for a lot less MONEY.
With an older team, you need a few guys who get out on the wings, run and finish HIGH at the rim.
March 26th, 2010 at 7:56 pm
@Ballhog,
Looks like Pop likes that Jerrells kid. He was amongst the Spurs final cuts doing camp.
Hum! Pop sure is interviewing and auditioning alot of point guards- Interesting!
March 26th, 2010 at 8:21 pm
The reason Pop is looking at point guards- Hill is a decent backup point at best (right now, potential is maybe there to be a solid starting point), but plays really well as a 2. Parker and Manu are our only real playmakers, and plantar fascitis doesnt really heal well, and is likely to reoccur off and on for the rest of Parker’s career. Getting another backup point can allow Hill to do what he does best- score- without having to worry about distributing. Plus with Manu potentially leaving (I’m still not convinced he is), we need another playmaker. I’m thinking either Jerrells or Marcus Williams (or both, depending on the Manu situation) make our roster next year.
March 26th, 2010 at 8:49 pm
@Bigballs,
Between your D-League wager and the equation of Hairston to Igoudala, you are becoming less and less credible as the night wears on. In all seriousness, because perhaps I am missing something between watching him on the Spurs and in D-League occasionally, why are you so high on Malik? I like him, sure. He is good for doses on energy and effort, shows individual defensive promise, can jump through the roof, and has an excellent attitude despite the lack of PT. But he also turns the ball over, fouls incessantly, and seems to be a bit slow picking up on defensive assignments. His jump shot is terrible, as far as I can tell (from admittedly limited time I have seen him play, although I have watched every Spurs game he has played.) I actually really like the kid for what he offers, but to me it seems like what he offers are spot minutes for defensive intensity and a change of pace. The nights when he is on, he stays in the game. When he picks up 3 fouls in 2 minutes and turns the ball over, he sits back down. Since he has been playing better the last month, maybe Pop will feature him more during next year’s training camp and he will develop int a more regular rotation player-I think that would be helpful to the team. But unless he has more than exceptionally leaping ability, I am not as impressed as you appear to be.
So I ask again (respectfully-don’t go off on me with your inane personal attacks), what is it that makes you think he is as good as Igoudala and deserves more playing time?
I am eager to hear your insights.
March 26th, 2010 at 9:14 pm
So I ask again, what is it that makes you think he is as good as Igoudala and deserves more playing time?
I am eager to hear your insights.
_______________________________
I agree with Half and Half. I would love to think that Hairston is as good as Iggy, especially since Hairston makes a small fraction of AI, but there’s no way Pop wouldn’t play Hairston if he were even 10% of Igoudala. Some of us on this thread have discounted Iggy, but the facts remain. He is a decent scorer, lock down defender, and an unreal athlete. In short, Iggy is a VERY good all around player. Can we really say Hairston would be that good if only given some burn?!? I know we don’t all agree with Pops decisions, but he isn’t medically insane.
March 26th, 2010 at 9:54 pm
Colin
March 26th, 2010 at 2:47 pm
Nice post, Collin.
Tyler
March 26th, 2010 at 3:49 pm
Okay, I still have a few comments/questions for you:
(1) I agree the Sixers ended up “overpaying” a bit for some their players. Such is life, but there’s only so much you can do about that now. That’s just the way it is.
(2) So, how does holding on to (i.e., not trading them - and let’s face it, they’re not letting those guys go for cheap, particularly since Brand is finally showing signs of getting back to 85% of what he was) long-term deals like Brand & Iggy help them solve this “overpaid” salary issue? Same with Dalembert, although it is possible they may be able to find a home for him for a bit cheaper at next February’s trade deadline. We’ll see. And sure, we could wait til then, and if lucky maybe get him for RJ, but that’s a big if, and the fact is we’re running out of time to get a team assembled that can really challenge. So again, the question is, how does holding on to long-term deals like Brand & Iggy help them solve this “overpaid” salary issue?
(3) “If you look at the deals that have been thrown around with them involved, all of them include cap space (the most important) and inexpensive, short contracts.”
First of all, this strategy of “creating cap space” is overblown. The whole point is to get a “star” player or two, often at inflated costs, to help the team contend better. And it can be more difficult than you expect to assemble the “new” team out of the ashes. I’m not convinced Philly needs to do this, or will continue full bore with this strategy.
Also, I’m not sure what deals you’re referring to, but nobody’s going to give up much to assume Brand’s long-term contract, if anything at all (very good player, but still not the same player after the injury). Dalambert’s a slightly different story because his contract expires next year, though he still makes a hefty salary. Philly hasn’t moved him because he’s too valuable to give away too cheaply, and there’s also not a widespread need, because most teams aren’t as weak at center as we are. And frankly, I’m not convinced Philly would move him if they felt they could resign him next year for a bit cheaper (like maybe 3 yrs./9 mil/per). And the bottom line is, you simply can’t hit the “reset button” on their contract issues.
(4) “Also, as Jesse touched on, I don’t look at Iggy and see that guy as the 2nd best player on a championship team, which is what he’s getting paid like. Good player? Yes, but worthy of that price tag? I don’t think so.”
My question is, why not? It is not uncommon for players that perform well on substandard teams to become even better players on good teams. How do you justify referring to Iggy as a “good player”. I don’t care what team he’s on, NOBODY in the entire league, from a good or bad team, puts up 17ppg, 6rpg, 6apg, 1.5bpg, and 1.7spg other than LeBron! And that’s just a good player? Please elaborate and further defend your position, because I just don’t get it.
VP of Common Sense
March 26th, 2010 at 4:20 pm
And why, dare I ask, would I quote such an utterly vacuous comment? LOL! Seriously, you’re subtle attempt at mockery is as inane as the comment itself. Don’t you agree?
March 27th, 2010 at 1:10 am
Okay, I’ll admit it, I’m starting to get a little bit perturbed by some of the absurd commentary going on right now on this thread about Iggy.
Look, I’ve laid it all out for all you guys in hundreds of words of heavy analysis over the past couple of days on Iggy, including DOCUMENTED PRODUCTION DATA. Example: NO perimeter player on ANY team in the league has put up the same level of ALL-AROUND production numbers as Iggy has other than LeBRON JAMES! Does that not compute, does that not mean anything to many of you on this blog? You just discount his talents because he’s in Philly, a substandard team? This is utterly ridiculous. You’re telling me you can’t imagine how even better he could become playing with a guy like Duncan? Are you joking me?!! Maybe you guys just haven’t seen him play that much, I don’t know. But something’s not right here, guys.
And it’s not just the stats with Iggy that makes him an excellent player with still some upside left at age twenty-six if he played on a better team, with a better coach. He also is an excellent team player, a good character guy, is versatile (can play SG & SF), an excellent defender, and can handle the rock. The fact is, he fits many of the needs of this team quite well, including being an outstanding finisher in transition.
Look, everyone on our team outside of center/PF does not NEED to be a great three point shooter. In fact, if you have Iggy’s skill-set you clearly don’t need to be great 3 point shooter. I’ll take someone that takes it to the rack consistently for HIGH % shots, finishing, and often drawing contact to go to the line over a three point shooter any day of the week. If we need a three point shooting specialist, go out and get one with Mason’s expiring, but the fact is our main problem getting a young all-around player on the perimeter, and a defensive stopper/shot-blocker in the paint. And my proposal addresses those issues.
By the way, I like Hairston as a young, still developing role player, but to equate him with Iggy is the very definition of insanity. He could NEVER be Iggy, just like 95% of the league couldn’t.
So seriously guys, I welcome a challenge by anyone to read my comments on this thread over the past two days and tell me why Iggy’s not worth trading for. And please, give me more to work with than, “I just don’t think he’s a good fit”, “he’s not a knock-down outside shooter”, “he’s nothing to hang your hat on”, “Iggy is merely a complimentary player”, “all he can do is dunk and make an occasional jump shot”, “I look at Iggy and don’t see a 2nd best player on a title contender”, even with his numbers “he costs too much” (in other words if this is your contention, point out another 5th year+ veteran player in the league whose numbers are comparable that’s getting paid less).
No offense to you all, but such comments are so vague & off-the-cuff that they do not really advance the discussion in any meaningful way, and they certainly aren’t sufficient to make your case as to why Iggy is “not good enough”, or “is not even any better than Hairston.”
So here’s your mission, if you choose to accept (I love “Mission Impossible”):
(1) Take your central position about why Iggy is not worth pursuing as a part of the deal I proposed, or use any of the quotes above that represent various positions from this thread, AND FLESH YOUR ARGUMENT OUT. Be more specific, go into some detail, use factual information & logic, and support your argument with DATA wherever possible.
Without more of an effort from the outright Iggy detractors, and those who just say “he really isn’t worth that much”, I’m afraid we’re destined to just go in circles on the issue, with no real, clear-headed resolution among us as to whether it’s a good idea to pursue Iggy or not. Perhaps many of you just don’t want to confront head on that as a franchise we’re coming to a crossroads? You tell me.
Hobson13 & Hoopster appear to be two commentators that seem to more fully appreciate the value of Iggy. I’m perplexed as to why there are not more of you.
Do you two have any suggestions?
March 27th, 2010 at 4:19 am
Jim,
FWIW, I was impressed too.
March 27th, 2010 at 5:04 am
@Half Man, Half Practice Squad - Re: Iggy,
Halfman- You are a fool! You and all the Iggy lovers remind me of Jack Box.
Its guys like Iggy that has gotten the NBA salary structure all out of whack. A guy or two that shows a little flash, a little explosiveness and shines for a bad team - then he gets a huge contract.
My gosh — Iggy has never hit a big shot and has never CARRIED a team on his back- just pads his stats on a bad team. Good grief, Philly is 31.5 games out of first place in a weak Eastern conference.
Indeed, I would go with a Hairston or even a Hairston like guy. Why? Simple — dollars and good sense! Similar age, similar skill set, similar upside, but Hairston comes a lot cheaper.
For the $ that the Spurs would have to pay Iggy, they may as well go and get one the real “proven” studs who will be available in free agency this summer.
March 27th, 2010 at 6:14 am
@Bigballs,
Just to be clear, I don’t actually think Igoudala is that great. I think the trade proposal earlier in the thread is foolish, for example. I agree that he is a perennial loser (some players are just cursed like that for some reason.) At the same time, I don’t think Hairston is anywhere near even Iggy’s level. I asked you to substantiate your claim that Hairston is every bit as good as Igoudala. You didn’t. Instead you called me foolish… for asking you to explain yourself. Don’t confuse my astonihshment with comparing Hairston to Igoudala as loving Igoudala. I think it is perfectly reasonable to ask you to validate a claim that is unsupported by any measurement or anyone’s opinion but your own.
I get the fact that Hairston is cheaper. Again, I don’t support going after Igoudala and his contract anyway. That doesn’t mean that Hairston has the same level of skills as Igoudala, which is what your claim was. That is akin to claiming that Matt Bonner has every bit as much game as Amare because he costs a fraction of his salary. If you argument is that we shouldn’t go after Iggy because he is too expensive relative to his value, fine. But don’t claim that Hairston and Igoudala are peers in every way except cost. That’s simple unsupportable… But then again, I am open, as before, to you providing some kind of support for your claim.
March 27th, 2010 at 6:19 am
@Jim
I don’t hate Igoudala at all. I think he is a very impressive player. The problem is (1) he will require taking on a fairly large amount of salary, and (2) despite his impressive numbers, he has never played on a contending team. You may say that stats are stats, and they will translate to a winning team. Fine, that may or may not be the case. But there is certainly a school of thought that teaches us that good players on terrible teams often become merely decent players on winning teams.
The salary issue is bigger, however. I am personally a proponent of rebuilding through a few down seasons and using the draft, trades for youth to rebuild. In my mind, there is no real way to avoid the closing window of our big three and continue to get better. That’s just my take, but I would therefore favor not taking on massive contracts for players who have already played out their upside.
Your proposal for Iggy is not “ridiculous.” But I certainly wouldn’t do it. It would leave us with him as our best player within a very short time. How would that be much different than the current 76ers?
March 27th, 2010 at 9:36 am
@Jim,
You either misunderstand or I’ve misrepresented myself. It’s not that I think Iggy is garbage, quite the opposite in fact. As we neared the trading deadline, most of the hypothetical discussions I had with Timothy were centered around the Spurs trying to pry him from the Sixers.
The problem that I have is your plans to package BOTH Manu and Tony for the Spurs to do it. The Sixers were not going to dump Iggy straight up for a salary dump, but they did let it be known that if you were willing to take back Dalembert or Brand’s contract, he could be had for just that (according to other general managers and reports you could have read on hoopshype.com).
In this league, you need at least three big guns if you’re going to contend (Unless you have the best player in the world-LeBron), Tim Duncan and Iggy with the supporting cast you’d leave with it are hardly enough and you’re still completely capped out. In that scenario, you’re much better off hoping Tony Parker comes back to his expected performance (if you think the All-NBA season he had was a fluke, you could easily expect that he’s at least a legit All-Star) and Manu continues where he is next season.
If you want to put it into perspective of building for the future, I’d argue that the Spurs owe it to Tim Duncan to try everything in their power to contend now.
You underestimate the impact of the economy and the threat of the new CBA coming up. The Sixers were, in fact, looking to dump salaries and start over with a core of Young, Speights, and Holiday.
This will be the last response I have on this thread because, in case you haven’t notice, we did just win a huge game against Cleveland and have been playing much better basketball as of late.
There will be a time and place for this type of discussion. And when it does, unless the Spurs makes some kind of miracle push at Bosh, rest assured that Iggy will be at the top of my wishlist……just not at the price you’re willing to pay.
March 27th, 2010 at 10:33 am
Timothy Varner
March 27th, 2010 at 4:19 am
Tim,
Thanks for your pithy thumbs up!
March 27th, 2010 at 10:55 am
Half Man, Half Practice Squad
March 27th, 2010 at 6:19 am
…….”(2) despite his impressive numbers, he has never played on a contending team.”
Yeah, I guess Garnett became mediocre after going to the Celtics, or for that matter, Pierce was not as valuable to his team (which was crappy) after they got Garnett & Allen. Yeah, Jamison looks pretty shabby after going from Wiz to Cavs. Yeah, Butler look slike he won’t help Mavs at all. Yeah Gasol has looked pretty crappy and has had no impact since he left the Grizzlies juggernaut for the Lakers. I could go on & on, but I don’t have time.
“In my mind, there is no real way to avoid the closing window of our big three and continue to get better. ”
I just suggested a way.
“The salary issue is bigger, however. I am personally a proponent of rebuilding through a few down seasons and using the draft, trades for youth to rebuild.”
Yeah, it won’t be a few that way - it will be 6-10 years to get back on top, if we’re lucky, and Pop probably won’t be around. And of course, say goodbye to the Duncan title years.
“Your proposal for Iggy is not “ridiculous.” But I certainly wouldn’t do it. It would leave us with him as our best player within a very short time. How would that be much different than the current 76ers?”
I have more faith in Hill & Blair, and even the pick up of Williams has a shot a being a VERY good player. And, all of you seem to even more under-estimate the value of Dalembert.
March 27th, 2010 at 12:03 pm
Great win last night and much needed for this team and the fan base. Manu kills the Cavs. seems like he goes for 30 everytime we face them. Somehow some way i think this team will get to 50 wins. Pretty good considering the cast of players we have here.
@jim henderson
i feel your pain on the subject of people coming on here and posting comments but offering no alternatives.
As far as the trade to Philly goes I would not trade Manu and TP. As Hobson stated we resign Manu(although that is getting more difficult by the day) and trade TP and Mcdyess to Philly for Dalembert and Lou Williams. We could sign Randy Foye and or Mike Miller this off season since both are FA. Or at least someone in that mold. Then maybe go for another big and or attempt to bring Splitter over. This would get us down on our cap as well as infusing some youth and size to the roster. Instead of taking on Iggy for 4yrs at $12mil+. Although I do think he is a very talented player he would hurt our bottom line too much at this point. Would rather resign Manu for 3 yrs at $7-$8mil per.
Then we can look at unloading Jokerson at the deadline next season unless we find a sucker this off-season. I would love to make a play for Scola this off season, but think he will cost too much. He is a FA as well.
March 27th, 2010 at 1:50 pm
Might as well make it an even 140 comments. I think Iggy is highly under-rated, too. The claim that he hasn’t led his teams to anything meaningful overlooks the fact that they weren’t expected to do anything at all in the first place. He led them to back-to-back playoffs where the Sixers made it a decent series (6 games) against some of the conference’s elite teams (Pistons & Magic). The second best player on that team is . . . Thadeus Young? . . . Lou Williams? Those guys wouldn’t even start for most teams in the league. Even in the playoff years, Dalembert and Andre Miller rounded out the teams’ top 3.
The problem with the trade proposal above that I would see, though, is that I think Dalembert is most effective on high-tempo offenses. His effort lags when he doesn’t get touches, and he’s not as effective in the half court. I don’t think he would fit our style well and wouldn’t give nearly enough value to make the trade proposed worthwhile.
March 27th, 2010 at 3:44 pm
BY THE WAY, TO ALL YOU IGGY DETRACTORS:
HIS LINE in leading the “keystone cops” Sixers (in which two top starter/rotation players Williams & Young were out) to VICTORY against one of the top playoff teams in the league last night, the Atlanta Hawks, the team we lost to in overtime recently:
25 pts., 10 rebounds, 9 assists, 2 steals, 1 block (a fraction away from his fifth career triple double, not easy to do at all, let alone on a team like the Sixers), 9-12 FG, 2-4 from three point land, including 9 points in the last 4:30 minutes to secure the win.
By the way, there’s only six active NBA players who’ve had more triple doubles than Iggy by the age of 26 (Kidd, James, Garnett, Bryant, Odom, & Baron Davis)!
I know, I know, it’s just stats, right. That said, it’s not bad company to keep, is it? LOL!
Also, you’re all right, Iggy can’t hit big shots:
A THREE at BUZZER to burn LA:
http://www.depressedfan.com/basketball/sixers/iguodalas-game-winning-shot-vi.php
Against NBA finalist Orlando, in the 2009 playoffs:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-GQkHozhYoQ&NR=1
And did you know, Carmelo Anthony, the NBA’s third leading scorer, hit his first buzzer-beater of his career just last night. They don’t happen that often you know, except for Kobe.
Yeah, Iggy just doesn’t have a big shot in him. Oh well, let’s not worry about Iggy anymore. He’s just not good enough for the iconic Spurs, anyway! LOL!
Hoopster
March 27th, 2010 at 12:03 pm
Thanks, Hoopster, that’s all I’m looking for, “reasonable” responses.
Now, let me just take a moment to refresh your memory on how all this got started. I will quote a section from an early post I made on the subject. As a matter of fact, it was in response to your post:
Hoopster
March 25th, 2010 at 5:22 pm
“Good post. I agree with most of it, and share your frustration and concern about getting on top again………….
……….If I were the Spurs FO, and Manu felt like he needed to leave, for the money or whatever, I say consider a sign & trade deal with him & Bonner, package it with Tony (expiring contract next year) & Dice, and try and get Dalambert, Iguodala, & Williams (their young point) from the Sixers.”
As you can see, my whole trade deal involving Iggy was predicated on the very real chance (although, perhaps less than 50-50) that we can not re-sign Manu. If we can re-sign Manu for a contract like your example, them I’m all for your alternative: trade TP & McDyess for Dalembert & Williams. That seems like a doable deal from both ends. That said, we still need to work at getting a bit younger, and a bit more athletic with a versatile wing that can defend. Hopefully by moving RJ at the trade deadline we can do that.
And as I said previously, another way to get quickly into the realm of contending without letting go of any of the big three, is to sign Marcus Camby (this guy still has plenty of game at 36, although he does get injured a bit now & then) to a 2-3 year deal at the 5-6 mil. per year area. It seems we could do that by not resigning Mason, and one or two others, perhaps.
In truth, I don’t really love this idea because it’s really a band-aid solution; it’s not forward-thinking. That said, we “MAY” be able to at least contend with Camby if the big three remain healthy & put it all on the line for the entire year (and RJ starts playing much better, or we get someone pretty good for him at the trade deadline).
Joe
March 27th, 2010 at 1:50 pm
“The problem with the trade proposal above that I would see, though, is that I think Dalembert is most effective on high-tempo offenses. His effort lags when he doesn’t get touches, and he’s not as effective in the half court. I don’t think he would fit our style well and wouldn’t give nearly enough value to make the trade proposed worthwhile.”
Thanks for your thoughtful response, Joe. The thing is, the Sixers are not the Suns, and to be honest, we’re not as slow as we used to be. At this stage, we should be trying to take advantage of easy transition hoops. We simply don’t have the “horses” to grind it out the same way as in other championship years. And again, you’re simply under-estimating Dalembert. He loses interest at times because he’s on the Sixers, wouldn’t you! Believe me, he would not lose interest with Pop and the Spurs.
March 28th, 2010 at 2:53 pm
Get real, everyone. Two options with Ginobili: resign him or he walks.
Sure, maybe someone wants to trade for a 33 yr old, high mileage SG and pay him big money for the next three years, but it’s not realistic. And we aren’t trading Parker. Why? He is a great PG and we will never get equal value.
Who are we going to trade next year? Jefferson’s expiring contract and McDyess’s virtually expiring contract. This comes pretty damn close to the contract values of TP and resigning Manu at 7MM/year.
So, if a sarlary shedding, rebuilding team wants to trade with us it will be for RJ/McD. Then, the Spurs management will have to determine if they want to turn expirings into longer contracts, or become a salary shedding team themselves. That’s the real question. Are we gonna make moves for the next year or two, or just let expiring contracts come off the books (Ginobili, TP, TD) and start over sometime after 2012?
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