Thursday, June 24th, 2010...6:57 pm
With the 20th pick, San Antonio tabs…James Anderson
For the third year in a row the San Antonio Spurs bucked their own historical trend and combed college basketball for immediate help, forgoing their usual European draft and stash routine to nab Oklahoma State’s James Anderson.
Unlike George Hill, Anderson is a player everyone actually heard of before the Chicago pre-draft camp. From ESPN NBA draft guru Chad Ford:
The Spurs have to feel really lucky here. Anderson is a very solid player and a dynamic scorer who can shoot and get to the line. He reminds me of James Harden, who went No. 3 in the draft last year. The Spurs always seem to find value in the draft and here’s a good example. Anderson won’t be a superstar, but he can come in and play right away.
James Anderson should come in and fill in one of the Spurs biggest needs right away (shooting) while he adapts to the San Antonio Spurs defensive schemes. In a worst case scenario, he should be able to immediately replace last season’s Roger Mason Jr. and Keith Bogans production at a fraction of the price.
Another useful wrinkle, according to Draftexpress.com, Anderson also provides a knowledgeable and capable pick and roll wing, an important skill given the Spurs pick and roll dominant offensive sets.
James Andersonwas nothing short of spectacular last season, and it shows here. His 1.07 overall PPP ranks second amongst all players, as do his 20 possessions used per-game. He was above the PPP every in every situation except for guarded catch and shoot situations, and has more experience running the pick and roll (2.9 Pos/G) than any other player on our rankings. High usage/high-efficiency players are extremely difficult to come by, and NBA teams may want to ponder if they’re missing the boat on Anderson due to the fact that he has not been spectacular in workouts. The same thing happened last year withMarcus Thornton.
Between James Anderson, Alonzo Gee, Malik Hairston and Garrett Temple, the San Antonio Spurs would seemingly have at least one rotation quality wing player and a healthy stockpile of talent for Austin.
152 Comments
June 24th, 2010 at 7:29 pm
Surprised they picked Ryan Richard over Solomon Alabi
June 24th, 2010 at 7:57 pm
Thumbs up on Anderson.
June 24th, 2010 at 8:10 pm
With the choices in the draft today, the Spurs seemed to have picked RMJ’s replacement as G and a good third option behind RJ and Hairston.
Does that mean that the probability of getting Splitter just went higher?
At the moment, there are so many speculations. In an interview with Splitter, he said that him playing in the NBA for the Spurs will depend on “how badly (they) want (him) to be.” Of course that would equate to money and playing time.
I’m excited about James Anderson being able to contribute to the team’s need immediately, as he’s projected to be, and I’m glad that the draft is over, just to help lessen the speculations about the Tony Parker draft. I’m not expecting the Spurs to land James, Wade, Stoudemire or Johnson in the free agency, but the prospect of a younger (and improving) plus a healthy (and still very good) players really brings up my day. I’m really hoping that Splitter would finally sign up with them.
June 24th, 2010 at 8:11 pm
For the 2oth pick, after P George (who had easily soared into the Lottery and expected to be out of reach), I was hoping that the FO had targeted someone who would turn out to be a steal (and was HOPING that guy might be Pondexter, or Stanley Robinson who were my 4th & 5th choices) over my own picks of (my #2 choice for the 20th pick) Larry Sanders, and my 3rd choice… James Anderson… who I ranked higher than those 2 shooting SFs as the BPA.
BUT, I was hoping that we’d either trade up or Pop and RC would really see something in a bigman like Whiteside (Maybe Ryan Richards is that guy??)… I was a little perplexed that Anderson wasn’t more highly touted, but thought he might be gone by 20, probably to the Wolves at 16, or several others between 11& 19… I was happy that we was still there once Larry Sanders was gone, but since Avery Bradley was gone, i thought for sure Boston would take either Elliot Williams, James or gamble on a big man.
So I should be happy that we got my #3 choice, since the other guys were gone, but I am disappointed b/c we have GH and Manu, and so
1) we didn’t really need a SG
2) I get the feeling from RC’s demeanor that he was also quite disappointed… I really got the feeling that all the guys they would be happy with were either gone, or we got rebuffed in trading for.
That said, I think that there is good reason to be optimistic about James long-term, I don’ t think the FO is sure what kind of a player he’ll be, but if he is a hard-worker, his size and shot could make him a nice starter some day… that’s the main thing i was hoping for: a guy that will become a nice, effective starter on a very good playoff team a few years down the road.
To that end, I fully expected to take Stanley Robinson at 40, but I am glad we selected a Big, and hope he’s a real steal. Since we (and everybody else) passed on Robinson, I trust that our FO deemed him to be an likely NBA bust. I am suprised b/c I like him 5th at the 2o, but I trust the FO, and will happily take the unknown Big… Boozer and M Gasol were 2nd rounders, after all.
June 24th, 2010 at 8:17 pm
Wow. It sounds like another Blair situation. Anderson was injured so he couldn’t work out for teams. RC said he thought Anderson would go sooner in the draft. If this guy can score in the athletic Big 12 then he should do well in the NBA.
P.S. RC was kinda an ass to that reporter. I guess it comes with the territory.
June 24th, 2010 at 8:30 pm
That’s the way they (Pop & RC) communicate with the media. He did it with a smirk. Also, I think R.C. knows Splitter is going to be here next year. Perfect example is how he responded to the “not drafting a big” question.
June 24th, 2010 at 8:40 pm
Well, the drafts finally over (Anderson was a nice pick-up at #20), and now free agency begins in a week. At present, we definitely don’t needs guards/SF’s (although we could use some rearrangement there to improve overall quality). Clearly, our 4/5 situation, an NBA title contender defense, and a veteran, clutch, 3-point shooter, all represent ongoing concerns.
Indeed, there are still plenty of unanswered questions. When are we going to know about Splitter? What are we going to do in free agency? What trade possibilities remain that will allow us to sufficiently retool this team? Does the draft say anything about Mahinmi, Gee, or Hairston’s prospects?
I say we still need a dependable, tall big in the paint that can block shots. We need a veteran guard/SF that we can count on to nail big threes in those important pressure-packed situations in the playoffs. And we need a proven, lock-down defender on the perimeter. So, how do we go about filling these needs? Any suggestions or comments?
June 24th, 2010 at 9:03 pm
- David Kahn is a complete tool…
Okay, Babbitt, Elliot Williams (even though they already have Jarred Bayless), and Armon Johnson are GREAT picks for the great K-Pritch. As much as I don’t think Gomes is much of a player, he’s a solid true backup SF, and Babbitt is a nice sub for Batum, who now gets locked into big minutes and the Blazer starting SF spot…
But what the hell is Kahn doing? He goes and picks up Webster who is too streaky to be either a starter or a reliable 6th man, and then trades Babbitt (who was worth way more than Webster as trade bait — and worse, he essentially traded Babbitt AND last year’s Ty Lawson for Martel friggin Webster! HA!) AND THEN, as an never-ending vote of “No Confidence” in Wesley Johnson, goes and trades for TWO MORE SFs in Hayward, and Bjelica? Wow! What a lunatic… there’s no shortage of duochebag franchises in the NBA. Season-ticket holders up there need to DEMAND the firing of David Kahn. Seriously.
- I like Sactown’s gamble on bringing DMC and Whiteside in to pair with their ROY stud.
- Detroit got very lucky getting a talent like Monroe, even if they are gonna be soft for a long while yet.
- And Toronto got even luckier in picking up Ed Davis to potentially mitigate the loss of Bosh over the long-term.
Surprised N.O. takes on another PF (Brackins), they really could have used a C or an SF… will they be able to pull of a trade of West or Okafor? But, regardless, they passed on better prospects in not only Aldrich, but PFs Sanders, Seraphin, Davis, and Patterson. WTF? They draft pretty well, so is Brackens the sleeper of this draft?
- I don’t understand Indy picking up Paul George, when they are weak at so many other spots and Granger demands so many minutes. Sanders, or James Anderson would have made much more sense, given that all these guys are risks. I can only think that George will make better trade bait and can help them pick up a PG or get two solid 8-man rotation guys in exchange for Murphy. I suppose George was the BPA, and is who the Spurs would have selected @ 1o, if we had been willing to part with TP. We’ll see what Larry Bird does next.
June 24th, 2010 at 9:07 pm
Jim,
Trade for James Posey, and hope Splitter can block shots well.
June 24th, 2010 at 9:08 pm
I would love to see the spurs go after Mike Miller, Kyle Korver, or Travis Outlaw via free agency for the 2/3 spot
June 24th, 2010 at 9:13 pm
blah-blah-blah-blah……….lets get some bigs
June 24th, 2010 at 9:28 pm
Jim Henderson
June 24th, 2010 at 8:40 pm
“I say we still need a dependable, tall big in the paint that can block shots. And we need a proven, lock-down defender on the perimeter. So, how do we go about filling these needs? Any suggestions or comments?”
I think RC is pretty damned sure that Splitter is coming over. I’m not saying Splitter is the perfect fit, but that is our answer for a tall big in the paint.
“We need a veteran guard/SF that we can count on to nail big threes in those important pressure-packed situations in the playoffs.”
I have no idea how we get this. Anderson is a good guard who may be able to knock down threes, but he’s a long shot. The only way we get a veteran is through an RJ trade. I think a Parker trade is a long shot at this point.
“And we need a proven, lock-down defender on the perimeter.”
Jim, I just don’t think we will get one of these PLUS the veteran SG. I can’t see us pulling off a trade that will net us with both. The only trade I can think of that would get us all that you ask is RJ to GS for Biedrins and Azebuike. However, we don’t need Biedrins PLUS Splitter. I don’t think their games would mesh well at all. Perhaps with more improvement, Hill could be our veteran 3pt shooting SG.
We really need to hope that Hairston, Temple, and Anderson are the real deal and at least one can be a difference maker this next year. Pop needs to play these guys plus Blair for extended minutes for the first 20 games. Maybe one of them could surprise us.
June 24th, 2010 at 9:31 pm
Yeah of course asking r.c. about why he didnt draft a big? like it seems like he knows that splitter is probably going to be a spur this year and for free agency, i truly think the spurs should go after Raja Bell first, hes a pretty great defender/ 3points shooter, and that can help us lock down the other teams best player and hopefully can get in kobes face again.
June 24th, 2010 at 9:31 pm
I like the pickup of Ryan Richards. Having a big that can shoot perimeter shots is essential in todays NBA game. Although he may need a stint with the toros to learn the system. Anderson nice cheap pickup to play minutes at the 2 and 3 spots. Looks like Splitter will be with the spurs. Now its just a matter of money. Spurs will spend full MLE to get it done. Starting five of parker, hill, anderson, duncan, and splitter sounds good to me. Bring ginobilli off the bench with blair, and jefferson because he can only play well with ginobilli. Mcdyess can be a serviceable big that can give us great 10 minutes or so behind all of our bigs. Very excited about next years team. I forecast a slow start as typical spurs team goes, but this year a monster rodeo trip to take us to top 4 in standings. Go Spurs Go.
June 24th, 2010 at 10:04 pm
Jim Henderson-
I don’t know why you’d claim we “definitely” don’t need any SFs… are you referring to our D-Leaguers, or are you excited about RJ’s upcoming final year in SA? More of Hill or Manu, and now Anderson, as undersized threes?
Granted, you qualified that with an almost painful understatement:
“(although we could use some rearrangement there to improve overall quality).”
Uh, yeah.
We haven’t really addressed any of our major off-season needs yet. Sure, I’m hoping for James Anderson (my 3rd BPA choice for the #2o) to be good enough, and daggers enough, to give us significant minutes as a rook, and along with an improved Hill, and maybe a better shooting TP, perhaps we’ll have gotten the 3 point range we need… BUT in addition to smart, athletic, physical perimeter defense, I still don’t think we’ll have the clutch scoring we need. Manu is the only never-say-die high efficiency guy we have to rely on. Sure, optimistically, we can hope that Splitter, GH, and Anderson could give us the additional scoring we need. … but I don’t see us as contenders without another ACE scorer, or overall talent.
In contrast, I think we are still looking like a middling playoff team, and in two years we will be where we are now, but ready to rebuild in earnest… that is UNLESS, we could send TP, RJ, and picks to the Hornets for Mr. Paul. Their moves today (see my 2nd post above) seemed to be curiously cost-cutting… we could send them 25 Million in expiring contracts… could Peter Holt make that back in TV and Playoff revenue if we went all-in for HOF talent? For the record, and strictly hypothetically, I think D Wade would help us more than Bosh would, for one reason: the guy is CLUTCH.
Short of swapping for a top-tier player such as a healthy CP3 (or the dominant, no-longer more realistic, quintet- which I won’t mention again- of a Maggette, Azubuike, MG, GH,& TP ), we’ll have to start thinking rebuild, with apologies to Timmy.
June 24th, 2010 at 10:12 pm
Hobson13
June 24th, 2010 at 9:28 pm
“I think RC is pretty damned sure that Splitter is coming over. I’m not saying Splitter is the perfect fit, but that is our answer for a tall big in the paint.”
I agree that Splitter will “probably” come over, but the point I was making is, he’s not enough, and he’s not a shot-blocker. We still need a guy like Turiaf. Even AJ might work from Wolves. He’s a decent shot-blocker, and probably a better fit than Biedrins.
“The only way we get a veteran is through an RJ trade. I think a Parker trade is a long shot at this point.”
We either need to trade one of these two, or perhaps we can get an under the radar “gamer” for a decent price as a FA. Rasul Butler, for example could work, and could be reasonably cheap. I don’t think the Clips will make a bid on him. Anyway, that’s just one example. Even a guy like Steve Novak of the Clippers could work, I don’t know. Bottom-line: We MUST have another dependable 3-point shooter off the bench. I’m hoping the Bonner experiment is over.
“And we need a proven, lock-down defender on the perimeter.”
“Jim, I just don’t think we will get one of these PLUS the veteran SG.”
Maybe not, but we need to try. I believe some interesting imbalances were created on some team by their draft picks. For example Memphis is too SG/SF heavy. It looks like they’re not going to try & resign Ronnie Brewer. What is his value on the open market? What can we do to get him? Any ideas?
Sign & trade w/Bonner & a future draft pick for Brewer? Memphis could certainly use a shooter at the stretch 4 for 10 mpg. The problem for them is, they have Brewer, Sam Young (Blairs teammate at Pitt), and #12 pick Henry all at SF (and that’s factoring out Gay), and they have a TON of SG/PGs. They have to trade somebody. Right?
June 24th, 2010 at 10:20 pm
I am essentially with Hobson on this one.
RC has to be sure of Splitter coming over, and if he isn’t putting another big on the roster is a massive disincentive to Splitter.
With Duncan, McDyess, Blair already locked in we add another big outside of Splitter and theres a log jam for minutes, if i’m Tiago and I see playing in the NBA as a personal goal not a financial necessity i’m not about to come to the river walk just to fight for minutes.
We have a lot of guards and swing players I like the idea of letting these guys butt heads in summer league/training camp and see who comes out as a big dog.
Competition is a wonderful wonderful thing, and I think after having to wait in the wings for 2 years Malik Hairston is either going to rip the still beating heart out of people to get in and show exactly how much he wants this, or he is not made of the right stuff for the roster. Either way this can’t hurt the spurs.
I’m very happy with Anderson at the #20. I obviously would have loved to draft higher but it is what it is, and at 20 I think he is a great risk/reward pick.
Surely he can play better than the Bogans / Romaju tag team of last season even if only in limited minutes.
June 24th, 2010 at 10:24 pm
Jim I love Brewer as a player, great D doesn’t take bad shots, and is a really physical guy. I worry a little about his injury history, but I worry more about his lack of outside shooting.
I think you are right that OKC has to move someone, but I also think you are right that we need a vet 3 point shooter, and I’d rather see a trade that targets someone who is a Guard/SF style 3 point catch and shoot guy ala Mike Miller (not a perfect pick just someone I grabbed to illustrate).
June 24th, 2010 at 10:28 pm
td4life
June 24th, 2010 at 10:04 pm
Am I correct to assume that you don’t disagree with this summary statement I made from an earlier post?:
“I say we still need a dependable, tall big in the paint that can block shots. We need a veteran guard/SF that we can count on to nail big threes in those important pressure-packed situations in the playoffs. And we need a proven, lock-down defender on the perimeter. So, how do we go about filling these needs? Any suggestions or comments?”
June 24th, 2010 at 11:02 pm
raja bell, if kobe hasn’t snagged him already…or ray allen if the celtics break after paul pierce potentially leaves… Kyle korver,
June 24th, 2010 at 11:10 pm
obviously we were not going to knock out all our weaknesses with this draft, but hopefully the long ball is one of them.
lockdown perimeter d is still my biggest worry. 3 point shooting comes and goes, but it looks like now we’ll have enough shot creators (tp, manu, anderson) that we won’t have to worry about offense too much.
jim- i still contend that a true, shotblocking big is not a true need we have. it’s a luxury. we need a mobile big that can execute p&r d now that timmy is no longer the force he was. if we can have timmy camp out under the basket to block shots, and not have to chase people around anymore, i think that’s good enough for our shotblocking needs.
i agree that the calculus points toward splitter coming over. hopefully this helps with our mobile big part of the equation.
one interesting thing for me: with anderson (yes i know, it was good value), who isn’t known for his D (over say, damion james*), does this confirm a philosophical change for the spurs? i absolutely love hearing that anderson is a high efficiency, high usage player. it’s rare (duh) and it’s proof that he’s a baller offensively. i hope that he can pick up our defensive schemes quickly, but even with effort, he’s not the sic’em bowen clone many of us pine for. the question remains though: is scoring our impetus as a team, and not the lockdown D of years past?
*hush, i can’t help but like the guy
June 24th, 2010 at 11:18 pm
Anderson sounds like a safe pick, but I really have to wonder what the FO have in mind with this kid Ryan Richards. Stashing him in Europe is not an option since he reportedly said he’ll rather withdraw from the draft than play in Europe. A short/long-term project? Will the Spurs offer him a (partially) guaranteed contract and see whether he’ll develop into a serviceable big? Are they (or rather Holt) willing to do that?
June 24th, 2010 at 11:19 pm
Bushka
June 24th, 2010 at 10:20 pm
“RC has to be sure of Splitter coming over, and if he isn’t putting another big on the roster is a massive disincentive to Splitter.”
I’m not saying get another big before Splitter has had his opportunity to sign. But how much longer until we have an answer on this? We have other moves we need to make in a timely, preferably unrestricted fashion, that may be contingent on him signing, or not signing.
Bushka
June 24th, 2010 at 10:24 pm
“Jim I love Brewer as a player, great D doesn’t take bad shots, and is a really physical guy. I worry a little about his injury history, but I worry more about his lack of outside shooting.”
But we need a great veteran defender AND a shooter, if we can’t get them in one guy. Which is why I like even better the idea of going after Battier from the Rockets, another team with a log jam at the SG/SF spot. 14th pick, Patterson, Ariza, Budinger, Battier? Too much talent fighting for minutes at the same position.
How about Bonner, McDyess, & a future draft pick for Battier & Andersen? We’d have to absorb an extra year of Andersen’s salary, and give up a pick to get a just past prime Battier who in some respects has become a bit superfluous on the Rocket roster. On the other hand, we need a guy like Battier: a dependable perimeter defender that can knock down the three a decent clip (38.5% - career). Houston get’s a better shooter in Bonner, and a veteran “big” in McDyess that can be depended on to bang in the rotation with Yao and Scola (and whoever else they sign or resign), while grooming Patterson until he puts on the weight & gains the experience to perhaps move to PF full-time. But of course, we would need Splitter, or somebody, to feel ok about sending McDyess in this deal.
The point is, there are potential deals out there, and we need to come up with the ones that will allow us to truly compete. I know, it’s easier said then done. I know that I’m demanding and hard to satisfy, but what can I tell ya!
June 24th, 2010 at 11:28 pm
zainn
June 24th, 2010 at 11:02 pm
“raja bell, if kobe hasn’t snagged him already…or ray allen if the celtics break after paul pierce potentially leaves… Kyle korver,”
Problem is they’re all too expensive, except “maybe” Bell.
June 24th, 2010 at 11:32 pm
If you look at my last post, this is as predicted. Spurs listened and angled for a tp trade but didn’t undervalue him one bit and so are gradually getting better from the bottom of the team up. I really hope that we can pinch a nice veteran point to back up Tony who can hit the three now . I’ll enjoy watching the team next year
June 25th, 2010 at 2:03 am
True about the two spots for two needs Jim.
I guess in a perfect world we fill that slot with one guy but tough when we don’t have a package to really attract that kind of two way player that easily, not without giving up a hell of a lot or taking on way too much salary.
I thought Bell as well, but he is aging and coming off some serious injury downtime.
Brewer would be exactly what Bogans was meant to be only younger faster and ..better..lol
June 25th, 2010 at 2:06 am
Really looking forward to this season going to enjoy the development of the guys, especially the guards I think someones going to man up and just take the minutes.
June 25th, 2010 at 3:46 am
[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by San Antonio Spurs, Kelim J. Warren. Kelim J. Warren said: RT @spursbuzztap: 48 Minutes of Hell >> With the 20th pick, San Antonio tabsJames Anderson http://buzztap.com/-9qY3zu [...]
June 25th, 2010 at 3:54 am
QUESTIONS:
If we sign Splitter and Anderson, we’ll have 12 players on the books for next season.
We could save money by signing 13 instead of the Spurs’ usual 15. Pop likes an insurance 5th big: not likely to be Ian, worst case could be Bonner since he practices hard and knows the system, which can help to develop Blair, Tiago, maybe even Richards.
Assuming we sign Splitter to the MLE, how much money would we have to spend fleshing out those last 1-3 spots?
You guys are asking for R Brewer or R Bell… considering the guys we have already I’m not sure we pay to add talent to the perimeter… are we talking Matt Barnes at $1.5M or Micheal Petrius-like talent at over $5M?
Or rather, do we spend what money we would have on that other Big?
If Tiago is our 2nd big and Blair is our 4th in the regular season/McD is our 4th in the playoffs, can we afford a 3rd big… say a healthy Tyson Chandler to back up and play alongside both TD and Splitter… isn’t such an acquisition, or even Ty Thomas out of reach financially, unless via trade?
Aren’t we stuck in an either/or, since we are even more limited if we wanted to ALSO add a better perimeter player, whether it’s Morrow, R Brewer, Redick, or whoever? I’d rather pay for one real baller than several Bogans, Masons, and Bonners. But to get a real talent, aren’t we really just looking at trade scenarios (we’ll have over $26M in the expirings of TP&RJ, and another $5M in McD)…
So, aren’t we pretty much limited to talking trades?
June 25th, 2010 at 4:35 am
Go Spurs Go!!
June 25th, 2010 at 4:49 am
I like the picks. Kinda wished we would have grabbed stanley robinson with our second round pick.
Dont send him to the toros. Thats a waste of time. Look at all the guys ripping up the D league then sucking when they play in the nba.
I hope we get a new coach in free agency. Pop is a fag.
June 25th, 2010 at 5:12 am
Can the Spurs still use the expiring contracts of Bonner and Mason to pursue Beasley? Miami is looking to move him for nothing more than cap space.
June 25th, 2010 at 5:17 am
td4life - I think your numbers are off by one. Right now the Spurs have 7 players under contract with team options for two more, Gee and Hairston. Adding Splitter and Anderson would give them a roster of 11 players. Who am I missing?
June 25th, 2010 at 6:52 am
Funny someone mentioned Beasley. I know he’s a basket case but I live in Miami and I believe he is a system guy. Surrounded by the right people he could be a great off the bench scoring machine.
Clearly the Heat want to give him away - wish we could swipe him. If it doesn’t work out - it’s a cheap risk compared to RJ.
However the guy we really need to be that Ariza type length defender with decent three point range is Dorell Wright. That’s right - just like Bruce Bowen - a Riley castoff who can really thrive in our system. He can be had cheap as he will slip through the cracks of FA. He’s young with dumb hops and seems to finally be getting his basketball IQ up to NBA standards.
I’m sure the FO is aware of how valuable RJ’s expiring can be come February and TP as well. Should Splitter arrive and we give some run to the young players plus Wright - I think we can make a serious run next year (health permitting).
June 25th, 2010 at 6:56 am
I still think we need one more shooter and a defender, so I took a quick look though the NBA rosters to find a few decent G/SF’s that can either shoot the three and/or are reasonably decent on defense. I tried to only include the ones that are reasonably priced. In no particular order (salary in 2010/11):
Maurice Evans ($2.5 M-expiring after next season)
Gerald Henderson ($2.1)
Delonte West ($4.67 - expiring)
DeShawn Stephenson ($4.15 - expiring)
Arron Afflalo ($1.96M)
Raja Bell - FA
Charlie Bell ($3.84)
Azubuike ($3.36 - expiring)
Anthony Morrow ($1.03 - expiring)
Battier ($7.35 - expiring)
Brandon Rush ($2.07)
Rasual Butler - FA
Ronnie Brewer ($3.78 if they make him a qualifying offer)
Jerry Stackhouse - FA
James Jones ($4.64 if team option is picked up)
Dorell Wrighy - FA
Carlos Delfino ($3.5)
Damien Wilkens - FA
Wayne Ellington ($1.08)
Jarvis Hayes - FA
JJ Redick ($3.89 - qualifying offer)
Matt Barnes ($1.6 - player option)
Jodies Meeks ($762k)
Rudy Fernandez ($1.25)
Kyle Korver - FA
Mike Miller - FA
Again, this is just a quick look at a few guys I could reasonably see in a Spurs uni, either through free agency or trades. From the list I like:
Arron Afflalo - competes defensively and can shoot, but I think Denver values him highly
Raja Bell - experienced, good defender and shooter, but is he healthy enough?
Battier - for obvious reasons, a perfect fit in our system, but how much would it take to get him?
Jerry Stackhouse - a vet who’s been though it all and could be had cheap, I think he’d love playing for Pop
Wayne Ellington - pure shooter, young, cheap and could get lost in the shuffle in MN. I think he could blossom in our system
Rudy Fernandez - great shooter, athletic, but how much would it take to pry him away?
Mike Miller - would be great in our system, great shooter and very underrated passer, a no nonsense guy, but could demand a hefty salary
Sorry for the long post.
June 25th, 2010 at 7:07 am
Of course, if we bring over Splitter that would give us 12 players:
Duncan
Blair
Splitter
McDyess
TP
Manu
Hill
RJ
James Anderson
Hairston (team option)
Temple (FA right now)
Gee (team option)
I think it’s going to be a battle between Hairston, Temple and Gee for two spots. If I’m not mistaken, typically the Spurs usually only take 11 guys in order to leave open the possibility for a two-for-one trade.
June 25th, 2010 at 7:34 am
Shane Battier is absolutely the guy we need, but I see no way to get him for a reasonable price unless Daryl Morey gets himself fired or something.
June 25th, 2010 at 7:43 am
I didn’t really look at James Anderson before the draft because I didn’t think he was much of a possibility. So I went to DE and looked at his stats compared to the other SGs in the draft.
He was avg in fg%, mostly because of a drop in 3 pt shooting from his previous years. However, he was tied for first in TS%. This is because he was #1 in 2pt fg% and he gets to the line and shoots 81%. Additionally, he turns the ball over at a very low rate despite heavy usage by his team. He’s also a decent rebounder. His only real knock was low assist rate.
Unfortunately, according to DE at least, he was a poor peremiter defender. I think Anderson is a good value at 20 and helps the team in the long run, but I’m not sure how much he helps the team right now. We need 3 pt shooting and D from our 2s and 3s and at best he provides one of these. Still, I think he’ll be good and I’m not unhappy with the pick.
June 25th, 2010 at 8:15 am
It makes a great deal of sense why we selected Anderson. With Mason Jr. gone, we desperately needed a backup, if not a starter, at the SG who can immediately come in and play. With Splitter coming over, I see the front court too crowded to resign Bonner, especially with two decent trade chips (RJ, TP) and one virtually guaranteed to be gone by trade deadline (RJ). It appears that this is the Spurs new depth chart:
PG: Parker, Hill, Temple
SG:Manu, Anderson
SF: RJ, Hairston
PF: McDyess, Blair
C: Duncan, Splitter
We all identified 3 areas of need several weeks ago. Here they are along with my explanation on each:
1) Shot blocking big to take up minutes and help Duncan. Spurs Answer: Tiago Splitter.
While I don’t think Tiago is a great shotblocker, he is a decent defender and should be able to come in and play meaningful minutes. He’s not the perfect answer, but barring a trade, he is the FO’s answer.
2.) 3 pt shooting (possibly 2 players needed) Spurs answer: Anderson? IMO, the Spurs have yet to address this need. Anderson may be a good player, but we can’t seriously expect a rook to hit big playoff threes. We haven’t addressed this as far as I’m concerned.
3). 2-3 decent (not Bonner or Mason) bench players. Spurs Answer: Anderson, Temple, Hairston, or Gee. This need again has gone unanswered unless we expect these players to seriously improve their game over the next 4 months.
Of all three areas of need, we have only addressed one area, and it was a partial answer at that. Surely our hopes aren’t pinned on guys like Anderson, Temple, Hairston, etc. I know these guys can improve and perhaps be really good, but we won’t be able to seriously compete for AT LEAST 1 year.
For the rest of the summer, the FO will take this team in one of two directions: We will stand pat and allow these young players to develop and hope for the best (read 2nd round exit at best). Or we make a trade involving TP or RJ to bring in more veteran talent. I am still hoping we can unload RJ for Al Jefferson or Andre Igoudala. If that were to happen, we would have the guns to challenge anyone in the league.
June 25th, 2010 at 8:29 am
PG: Parker, Hill, Temple
SG:Manu, Anderson
SF: RJ, Hairston
PF: McDyess, Blair
C: Duncan, Splitter
One more thing: Looking at our depth chart, we are stacked at the PG position. I also think we are in good shape at the SG position since Hill can really play both PG and SG. I believe we have needs at the SF spot and perhaps 1 spot available in the front court if we move McDyess to the bench. To me, this is why an Al Jefferson or Iggy trade would make sense. Iggy (although naturally a SG) can certainly play SF and is a great defender. Big Al can take the Tim role while Tim becomes the David Robinson mentor. A Splitter/Jefferson/Blair front court would be unreal.
To me, an Al Jefferson or Iggy trade would make sense. Iggy (although naturally a SG) can certainly play SF and is a great defender. Big Al can take the Tim role while Tim becomes the David Robinson mentor. A Splitter/Jefferson/Blair front court would be unreal. Some might argue that Jefferson and Duncan can’t play together because neither can space the floor. Look no farther than Bynum and Gasol. Neither guy is a good 18 ft shooter and yet they coexist just fine. Just some thoughts and theories, but I sure hope we unload RJ for an allstar level talent.
June 25th, 2010 at 8:31 am
WE WANT RAJA!
WE WANT RAJA!
WE WANT RAJA!
The only thing to worry about is his shooting, since he had a wrist injury. But otherwise, his defense should still be top notch after basically being off a year and if he does improve his shooting, he will be the perfect guard in the spurs system.
June 25th, 2010 at 8:48 am
getting back to the actual draft pick, this video on nba.com has a lot of good things to say about Anderson.
http://www.nba.com/video/channels/draft/2010/06/24/20100624_pick1_analysis.nba/
well worth watching.
June 25th, 2010 at 8:58 am
Here’s something that occurred to me last night during the draft, and also in reading through a ton of draft/trade analysis this morning.
Sam Presti must had a lot of input to the decisions on the great Spurs draftees and trades of the 2000′s. Take a look at the wheeling-and-dealing he has been doing for OKC. That’s the kind of roster-dealing us Spurs fans came to expect. That’s what we are missing now. Granted, the Spurs’ situation is different since they are trying to build around an aging Hall-of-Famer and TP and MG.
There is no way that Presti would have dealt for Richard Jefferson for OKC. I also think that he would not have done those bizarre deals for Ratliff and Haislip, and let the young guys walk in and out from the D-League the way they have, were he still with SA. Then again, I don’t know how the decision-making works for SA and how much personnel voice Presti had while at SA. You have to love what he has been doing for OKC, regardless of what you think about the potential of Cole Aldrich.
June 25th, 2010 at 9:17 am
I like James anderson he’s a 20 point scorer and a good 3 shooter with help from guys like Keith Bogans and Manu Ginobli he can be come a great player in this league.
This is the spurs regular season depth chart
PG: Parker Hill Temple
SG:Anderson Ginobli
SF:Jefferson Bogans
PF:Duncan Blair
C:Splitter Mcdeyce Richards
Not to mention trading and free agency i think that we should trade Mcdeyce a dreaf pick and Jefferson for a center such as Pau Gasol and sighn a foreward i think Shane battier is a free agent and so is Rudy gay so our depth chart would be
PG: Parker Hill
SG: Ginobli Anderson
SF: Battier (Gay) Bogans
PF: Duncan Blair Richards
C: Gasol Splitter
who can beat that lineup
June 25th, 2010 at 9:20 am
I agree with those who say we do not need a shot-blocking big. Most good shot blockers are good only at that. They often do not provide good help defense, for example. Obviously David Robinson is an exception, but he is a freak of nature. The Spurs certainly need to protect the paint more effectively next season, but this does not necessarily need to be done with shot blocking. Remember when Oberto was a starter here. Tough man defender, excellent help defender, nice touch around the basket, good rebounder, etc. We need these things more than a stiff who blocks shots.
As I’ve said before, I think the Celtics are a good model here. If you compared their starting five with the Lakers, on paper the Lakers had a superior front court. But in the finals the Celtics neutralized that advantage with depth and versatility. I think the Spurs can have something akin to that with a lineup of Duncan, Splitter, Blair and McDyess, and perhaps Mahinmi. Blair will be better. He can be for us what Big Baby is for the Celtics. McDyess can still be effective if his minutes are kept fairly low. I think Splitter can be a starter right away. This can work.
June 25th, 2010 at 9:23 am
I liked the Anderson pick. One thing the SPURS need is shooting. Hopefully he works out.
I too think the SPURS are sure they are getting SPLITTER. Otherwise they wouldn’t have taken a 19 year old with the second pick.
I think if Hairston gets more playing time then that’s a good start.
June 25th, 2010 at 9:38 am
Ted-
Presti is a protege of Buford. Whatever he knows about managing, he learned from Buford. I completely agree that Presti’s done a fantastic job, but I don’t think anyone other than Pop and Buford can be credited for the success of the Spurs over the past decade.
The situations in OKC and San Antonio couldn’t be more different. For the past three years, Buford has been working at extending the success of a team with four championships. We picked twentieth yesterday. That’s the best draft spot we have had in twelve years! OKC, on the other hand, has absolutely no history of success. Presti had to do a lot of dealing because he was starting from absolute scratch with one skinny talented player. Because they sucked, though, he did have a lot of good picks to add talent. He has utilized these picks very well.
The Spurs have had to be very smart, and very lucky, to maintain over a decade without the benefit of lottery picks. Ginobilli and Parker were overlooked by many organizations. Splitter, Blair and Anderson are also smart, smart picks. Buford and Pop know what they are doing.
June 25th, 2010 at 9:45 am
I still feel like we need another shot-blocking, good defender big to at least come off the bench and produce.
If you’re thinking veteran defender, great 3-point shooter, Shane Battier would be the perfect fit. But I dubt Houston lets him go. I would also love love love love love to have Trevor Ariza, but he’s got 4 years left on his contract and I don’t see Houston letting him go either.
Although no one is sure of what the FO will do next after the draft, I’m just hoping the draft isn’t the last attempt the FO makes to upgrade our roster.
June 25th, 2010 at 12:18 pm
If the Spurs want a lockdown defender at the NBA minimum, they need to sign Bobby Jones. He was on a 10 day contract with the Spurs before. His story is similiar to Bruce Bowen being cut by the Heat and then joining the team. Bobby Jones coach @ Washington, Lorenzo Romar, said that he consistently shut down Brandon Roy and Nate Washington in practice. Even draftexpress.com says Bobby Jones could be a Bruce Bowen clone. He would be a tremendous upgrade on Keith Bogans, Ime Udoka, or whoever the Spurs try to sign for the NBA minimum at the end of free agency.
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Bobby-Jones-351/
Ryan Richards signing kind of scares me. He wants to be Lamar Odom, a left handed big on the perimeter. In other words, as a 6’10″ big, he hates to bang inside. Also, he did the fewest bench reps (I believe it’s 185 lbs vs. 225 lbs in NFL) of ANY player (that means guards included) at the NBA combine @ 4 reps. I believe Devin Ebanks, a super skinny 6’7 185 player drafted by the Lakers did 8 reps. Ryan Richards will be spending the entire year in the D-League, mark my words.
June 25th, 2010 at 12:27 pm
td4life
June 25th, 2010 at 3:54 am
“If we sign Splitter and Anderson, we’ll have 12 players on the books for next season.”
Are you counting D-League guys? Otherwise, I only count ten, with Anderson & Splitter:
Blair
Duncan
Hairston
Manu
Hill
RJ
Dice
Parker
Anderson
Splitter
“You guys are asking for R Brewer or R Bell… considering the guys we have already I’m not sure we pay to add talent to the perimeter… are we talking Matt Barnes at $1.5M or Micheal Petrius-like talent at over $5M?
Or rather, do we spend what money we would have on that other Big?”
Yeah, I don’t think we have the $ to offer anyone after Splitter $5 mil.+ type contracts. But it’s a good question. I’m not sure exactly how that works. As far as “bigs” or perimeter guys, we REALLY need a veteran perimeter defender/3-point shooter, a la Shane Battier. So, in my view, we have to make a trade to come up with the pieces we’re still lacking. We don’t have enough to do it with $ alone in the FA market. I’m not sure whether we have a BAE, or any other signing exception this year, but it would be pretty small.
“……isn’t such an acquisition, or even Ty Thomas out of reach financially, unless via trade?”
Yes, I’m quite sure it is.
“So, aren’t we pretty much limited to talking trades?”
To get what you call “real ballers”, I believe so.
Hurm66
June 25th, 2010 at 6:52 am
“However the guy we really need to be that Ariza type length defender with decent three point range is Dorell Wright.”
Yes, I would be interested in going after him.
Tyler
June 25th, 2010 at 6:56 am
Off your list, and leaving out those I don’t like or deem “unlikely to get/afford”, here is who I think we ought to consider further, and perhaps think about ways to acquire:
Raja Bell – FA
Charlie Bell ($3.84) - Warriors just picked up
Azubuike ($3.36 – expiring)
Anthony Morrow ($1.03 – expiring) - an FA
Battier ($7.35 – expiring)
Brandon Rush ($2.07)
Rasual Butler – FA
Ronnie Brewer ($3.78 if they make him a qualifying offer)
Dorell Wright – FA
JJ Redick ($3.89 – qualifying offer)
Matt Barnes ($1.6 – player option)
Rudy Fernandez ($1.25) - like him, but too similar to our pick, Anderson.
The big question now is to make sense of making a deal for any of these players, and carefully consider the financial feasibility & implications.
By the way, while I agree that getting a veteran tough-nosed wing defender/shooter is an important need to fill, I also believe that we need another “BIG” on the front line, perhaps in lieu of McDyess (with the assumption that Splitter is coming over - which I hope we hear about SOON!). Otherwise, our line still does not have the requisite combination of youth/size/talent/shot-blocking to contend with the Lakers.
doggydogworld
June 25th, 2010 at 7:34 am
“Shane Battier is absolutely the guy we need, but I see no way to get him for a reasonable price unless Daryl Morey gets himself fired or something.”
Are you looking at the redundancy & oversupply of talent on that team at the SF spot? There’s no way Ariza, Budinger, their 1st round, #14 pick, Patterson (he is not ready for PF in the NBA), & Battier are all going to fight over 48 measly minutes. Battier is the most likely move, due to a combination of age and return trade value. Now, whether we have what the Rockets would want (and are willing to give) in return is another story.
quincyscott
June 25th, 2010 at 9:38 am
“Remember when Oberto was a starter here. Tough man defender, excellent help defender, nice touch around the basket, good rebounder, etc. We need these things more than a stiff who blocks shots.”
That was when our core stars were younger, and Duncan was getting 2.5 bpg., instead of 1.5 bpg. A big difference. I agree that we don’t want JUST shot -blocking. You have to have good position defenders in the paint, but shot-blocking and altering shots in the pain/at the rim is VERY important as well, and we don’t have enough of it to challenge the Lakers. Splitter is a pretty good position defender in the paint, but he’s a mediocre shot-blocker, at best. And you’re comparison to the Celtics is off-base, in my view.
Bentley
June 25th, 2010 at 9:45 am
“I still feel like we need another shot-blocking, good defender big to at least come off the bench and produce.”
Exactly.
June 25th, 2010 at 1:31 pm
@lvmainman - I believe Richards was still rehabbing his injured shoulder at the time, so he probably didn’t want to aggrevate the injury with one of the more pointless measurements in pre-draft camp. At any rate, this guy’s a stretch big, not a low-post player - that’s how people are assessing him anyway.
I actually never heard about Bobby Jones but he does sound like a solid player. Is he a FA or does he need to be bought out from his Euro club?
June 25th, 2010 at 1:34 pm
Oh never mind - he seems to be a free agent. He could possibly try out at the SL perhaps?
June 25th, 2010 at 1:43 pm
The following is another trade proposal. I want to preface it by asking you to not focus in on getting “stars” back in return. We have enough stars already, for now. The most important thing for us to do is fill critical, specific needs with solid/quality talent, particularly when the deal encompasses salary dumping, and not giving “stars” away in the deal. And remember, virtually ALL deals are far from perfect. With that said, and imploring you to keep an open mind, here’s one proposed deal to carefully consider:
RJ (SF), Hairston (SG/SF), & (PG/SG)Temple
to Portland for
Pryzbilla (C), Gomes (SF), & Bayless (Combo).
I think Portland’s owner is wanting to trim back on salaries. I believe he thinks that they’re paying too much at the center position (over 21 million), and thus wants to get a jump on dumping Pryzbilla’s expiring contract of about 6.9 mil., and with Camby there, he’s become expendable. In addition, they just agreed to absorb Gomes 3.9 million three-year deal from the Wolves for the ability to dump Webster’s 4.3 million 3-year deal, but more importantly, to gain the opportunity to snag Babbitt (the 16th pick). As with Pryzbilla, Gomes is extraneous in Portland (they got to SF’s back for one), and not that cheap, since they’re locked in with Batum, and hopefully with Babbitt over the long-term. RJ would give them a one-year rental of upgraded talent, allow them to get significant cap relief in 2011, upgrades their talent at the “small-ball” PF, and of course provides them with the size/experience necessary to most effectively compliment Batum/Babbitt for one year while they continue to develop. Hairston gives them a young, gritty defender on the wing to draw on, deep in the rotation, and Temple has the ability to give them length defensively as a back-up to Miller at the point (& can fill in a SG, along with draft pick Elliot Williams), and their rookie PG draft pick, Armon Johnson (34th pick), gives them a speedy & developing penetrate & dish type of guy. If the Blazers balk at either Hairston or Temple, offer them a future draft pick. By the way, in this deal, we’re absorbing about 10 mil. in salary beyond 2010. The Blazers are losing that 10 million off their cap beyond 2010.
We get one of the better back-up centers in the league in Pryzbilla. He’s far from spectacular, but he does what we need: gives us size (7’1″), not too old (30), plays excellent position “D” in the paint, a more than adequate shot-blocker (2.3 per 36 min.), and is a very solid rebounder. Gomes is not a spectacular guy, but he is a versatile, hard-working, competent player that gives us solid position “D”, size, and relative youth (27) at the SF spot, and can even play PF in small-ball sets. While he’s not a great 3-point shooter, he does consistently nail it at about a 37% clip (e.g., Battier is at 38.5%). Bayless gives us one of those more & more common “combo” guards that can play the point & SG, which would allow us to employ maximum flexibility in our rotations. He’s a very solid, YOUNG player to add to our guard rotation, along with Manu, TP, & Hill.
New Roster:
TP, Hill
Manu, Bayless
Gomes, Anderson
Splitter, Pryzbilla
Duncan, Blair
Reserves: McDyess, Gee, & FA?
This is just one of many possible trade proposals. Any thoughts?
June 25th, 2010 at 2:29 pm
so our big situation is still in question. buford says that he is happy with our “stable of big”. i guess our “in-stable” guys (dice, blair, duncan) and our “out-stable” guys (bonner, mahinmi, splitter), are all solid options to choose from. i would imagine we will look no further than these guys to fill out our frontcourt unless we look for some D-league talent.
i also think whatever funds we have left will be geared towards a veteran shooter.
jim, or anyone. what are the chances we trade tony to make another free agent aquisition? what are your opinions on the gee, temple, hairston, mahinmi situation in regaurds to the draft?
June 25th, 2010 at 2:39 pm
Update: Trade Proposal With Blazers
I forgot that Przybilla’s knee injury could still be a lingering problem because he re-injured earlier this year. Have to take that into account I guess!
June 25th, 2010 at 2:51 pm
rj
June 25th, 2010 at 2:29 pm
“…..buford says that he is happy with our “stable of big””
RC is not going to come out and make an announcement that he’s unhappy with our “stable of bigs”. GM’s are part politician. I’m sure you realize that.
“…….our “out-stable” guys (bonner, mahinmi, splitter), are all solid options to choose from. i would imagine we will look no further than these guys to fill out our frontcourt unless we look for some D-league talent.”
All I can say is, if you think that the above strategy is going to allow us to contend for a title, you’re smoking some pretty potent stuff.
“jim, or anyone. what are the chances we trade tony to make another free agent aquisition?”
Not good, but I hope we’re carefully & aggressively looking at all of the possibilities in this regard, as well as potential deals for RJ and/or Manu.
“what are your opinions on the gee, temple, hairston, mahinmi situation in regaurds to the draft?”
It means that one of the SG/SF’s will not make the team. And at present, it also means that Mahinmi is still hanging on by the skin of his teeth.
June 25th, 2010 at 3:15 pm
Jim-
Przybilla may be done playing altogether, but I don’t see this proposal happening from either end.
I don’t think the Spurs would spend that much to get a nice backup, who isn’t likely to make you dramatically better, and could really be regrettable if he gets hurt again. Just the same, I don’t see Portland parting with him for RJ. They aren’t that concerned with cap space, they do want elite talent however… they are actually willing to take back more salary if if makes them contenders, and the whole organization thinks that they are close, they are committed. They consider LA their #1 enemy, and only rival… they have been burned with Greg Oden’s medical woes, and will keep all their bigs to contend if one goes down. They would consider trading some of their Bigs for a major talent, but not for space, nor for depth. Portland media widely reported that for over a week Pritchard was trying to pry away Paul from the Hornets until it fell through yesterday. They are less substantiated rumors that they want to trade for Bosh or Amare. And they certainly don’t need RJ for small ball purposes, b/c (a) they prefer a big lineup may even bring J Howard back (b) they are pretty happy with their value from Cunningham and Pendergraph when forced to play small ball due to injury.
Following the draft, they have too many good-but-not-great combo guards and would like a PG, if anything. Fernandez and the Blazers are disenchanted with each other. I can tell you not to fall for the Rudy Fernandez mirage. He really disappointed them when he had a chance to step in once B-Roy got hurt, including versus Phoenix in the playoffs.
So, I really wouldn’t look to Portland at all. And honestly, I don’t think many trades out there are gonna be pivotal for us this year… to get a nice player back we’d have to give up young talent or lottery picks we don’t have, or take on a bad long-term contract. Maybe a multi-team trade would net us some great return for RJ. Next summer we’ll probably make Battier an offer. Life w/o TP is a bit tricky too, when you consider how important the PG position is, and how hard it would be to get a really nice PG to SA… I think it’s gonna be foreign PGs in SA for a long, long time.
June 25th, 2010 at 3:25 pm
td4life
June 25th, 2010 at 3:15 pm
A pretty sober assessment of our chances to do anything to become “true” contenders again anytime soon. I don’t disagree with much of your feedback. So I’ll just leave it at that for now. The Przybilla injury problem clouded the deal for me anyway. Oh well, I’ll see if I can find another one at some point.
June 25th, 2010 at 6:11 pm
Trade Proposal With Warriors: Ellis & Randolph & J. Crawford’s trade exception for Jefferson and maybe a 2011 1st or 2nd rounder?
Our Line-up would be:
PG - TP / Hill / Temple
SG - Ellis / Anderson / Gee
SF - Manu / Hairston
PF - Splitter / Randolph / Blair
C - Duncan/ McDyess
We would get a 25 ppg scorer who can get his own shot, avgs over 2 spg (and is only 24 years old). Randolph has a lot of potential and could be groomed to be a defensive asset from Duncan (and is only 20 years old).
The biggest thing is we keep our core, gain a scorer to help take pressure off the big 3, and could become one of the best transition teams in the league. This would be a fun team to watch!
June 25th, 2010 at 6:41 pm
jk31007
June 25th, 2010 at 6:11 pm
Warriors are a ripe team to look at. However, for me there’s a few problems with the deal that you proposed. Number one, I don’t think the Warriors will move Randolph, even to move Ellis’ contract, or for RJ’s expiring contract. Number two, even though Ellis has talent, I’m not a fan of his. And number three, I see a conflict with Randolph & Blair, two young, talented PF’s vying for too few minutes. Plus, at least in year one, it would be a crowded back court: too much talent spread over two positions, and A LOT in salary at just the guard slot. In fact, we’d be over the cap with just Duncan and the three guards: Manu, TP, & Ellis.
June 25th, 2010 at 7:17 pm
I’ll propose another deal with Portland, but I won’t try to sell the deal. I’ll just see if any of you have any pros & cons that you want to offer.
Parker, McDyess, & Hairston
to Portland for
Miller, Przybilla**, & Batum*
Please consider how each player would benefit each team, and take a brief look at the relevant stats before you render initial judgment. And remember, we may lose Parker next year anyway. Thanks.
** Dependent on injury expected to be okay before too long
* Could be solid starter with us for YEARS
June 25th, 2010 at 8:23 pm
@Jim Henderson
“Number one, I don’t think the Warriors will move Randolph, even to move Ellis’ contract, or for RJ’s expiring contract.”
The Warriors just traded Corey Maggette and a 2010 second-round draft pick for Charlie Bell and Dan Gadzuric.
Charlie Bell and Dan Gadzuric!!!
Charlie Bell and Dan Gadzuric!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Both are MAJOR scrubs, even RJ can produce in Nelsons uptempo system and give you way more than these two.
Bell makes about 8 million for the next 2 years and Gadzuric make 7.2 million in the final year of his contract. RJ makes 15 million. That would be 22 million off the books between the two of them, with only Biedrins 9 mil+/year to dump. If they want cap space for next season. This would be the way to do. They building the team around Curry anyway.
Plus, I dont think it would matter if we got back Wright instead, he would give us about the same thing.
“… a conflict with Randolph & Blair, two young, talented PF’s vying for too few minutes.”
I dont see a problem with backup playing time, McDyess should sit more and save his body for the playoffs. Blair can play C just like this year.
“… A LOT in salary at just the guard slot. In fact, we’d be over the cap with just Duncan and the three guards: Manu, TP, & Ellis.”
We spent more this year on RJ, Manu, TP, & Duncan. Plus Manu can play SF, so it make no difference.
June 25th, 2010 at 8:30 pm
@Jim Henderson / PDX trade.
Miller and Przybilla are old, we are suppose to be trying to get better (which is unlikley in any TP trade) AND younger. We would only gain Batum, so this is really Parker for Batum.
It would make more sense to trade with IND and get a young up-and-coming big in Hibbert and and wing with greater potential in George.
Any trade in which we can keep TP, Manu, Hill & Duncan would be much better for the short term.
June 25th, 2010 at 9:33 pm
man i actually think we’re pretty set with anderson and splitter coming over. and if we get shane battier, then im calling championship. the problem is that shane won’t get the minutes he wants, at the end of games, its always manu parker and hill at the guards unless we play small ball w/e jefferson. idk but im still happy with what we have done this summer. GO SPURS GO!
June 25th, 2010 at 10:39 pm
I was looking for a 3-team trade in which we give up RJ to get back Turiaf, Azubuike, and Battier… one problem is all are expiring contracts, so there’s very little incentive to offer from the Spur’s side, unless we’d sweeten it by giving up some promising value.
Another player I’d like to add to our frontcourt is Tyson Chandler, which with Battier, and another all-around talent would put us over the top… but I don’t know how the spurs could get this done.
@ Jim Henderson
Your Blazer trade favors the spurs, they would love Parker in addition to Miller… but have been thrilled by Miller so far, they also love Batum, which is part of the reason they traded away Martel. I don’t see them making such a trade w/o getting more talent back… and they would not do anything like that until the big FA dust settles.
For the sake of argument, Miller isn’t as hard to contain as Parker today, but he REALLY elevates the play of shooters, leapers and post-players… I think his window of return is not too much shorter than the younger TP, because of his style of play.
As an alternative to the Spurs giving up more long-term value than just TP, maybe we could ask for less back…
Batum was injured last year, but was showing unexpected growth offensively, leading the Blazers to wonder anticipate alot more upside as yet untapped, and see him as their solution at SF, unless they can add LBJ or maybe JJ. What about Parker? It would be a CLEAR win-now move, which I don’t think they’d do until they see who’s healthy and what they’ve got next year. Unlike Pop, they aren’t averse to mid-season trades.
I think if we don’t get a starting PG back, then we need a solid back up… Maybe Steve Blake, while turning to Manu and Hill in the 4th. Would the Blazers give up Batum for Parker? I honestly don’t know. Should the Spurs? We’d be in serious need of scoring.
@JK31007
GS really wants to part with Biedrins and Ellis, which are both terrible contracts, in their eyes and everyone else’s. If Ellis is a bad fit in GS, I don’t know why you think he’d be a good Spur. He wouldn’t. His a headache, and is getting less efficient as he ages. He’s a 3/4 of the most over-rated player I’ve ever seen, Iverson. The case against AI was made objectively plain when he traded jobs with Billups (who in contrast is one of the most under-rated of players.) But at least AI had heart. GS has clearly stated that they aren’t trade Randolf, w/o getting back major talent, he’s to young, with too much upside. But they might to get free of one of their two bad contracts… but there is no way that the RC and Pop would make the trade you suggest.
June 25th, 2010 at 10:51 pm
Guys, I think RJ and TP are the horses we got. The good thing about RJ being sort of a lame-duck is some young guys can really push themselves everyday. Of course, TP and RJ should both be better next year for us, and maybe we get to the second round, maybe further. Next summer, we’ll see who earned some loyalty from SA. And we can go add several talents… Battier, Jordon Hill, Azubuike, Randolf, Turiaf, Morrow, Pietrus, whomever. But, this year is mainly gonna allow our younger guys, Tiago included, to “Pound The Rock” and see what they are made of, and see to what TP brings to the floor in his FA year.
Assuming Portland doesn’t have a major upgrade, but Oden and Roy are both healthy, and that while Phoenix falls off and Utah takes a minor step back, Dallas is slightly better, Houston brings it, Sacramento makes some progress but is still a ways off, and Denver is what it is. With Tiago, we might be a 3rd-round team and a number two seed. I’d love to knock the lakers back, but the writing is on the wall.
PS- Sorry about all the typos in my previous posts.
June 26th, 2010 at 12:33 am
jk31007
June 25th, 2010 at 8:23 pm
“The Warriors just traded Corey Maggette and a 2010 second-round draft pick for Charlie Bell and Dan Gadzuric.
Charlie Bell and Dan Gadzuric!!!
Charlie Bell and Dan Gadzuric!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Both are MAJOR scrubs, even RJ can produce in Nelsons up-tempo system and give you way more than these two.”
I’ve already stated previously that RJ is a good guy to dump salary with the Warriors. I’ve simply stated that Randolph is near the bottom of their list of guys they would offer up for expiring contracts.
“Blair can play C just like this year.”
I would very much be annoyed by that. Blair will be working his ass off developing his mid-range jumper this Summer. He needs to be rewarded with the confidence from the coaching staff to use it games by being given significant playing time at his natural NBA position, which is PF. Duncan should be playing more center this year, with Splitter.
“Miller and Przybilla are old, we are suppose to be trying to get better (which is unlikley in any TP trade) AND younger.”
Przybilla’s only 30, TWO years older than Parker. That’s not TOO old. Batum’s only 21, with significant upside at a position we’re weak in. Plus, he’s a great fit. Also, the two starter/rotation players we’re sending them avg. 32 years old. The three starter/rotation players that we would acquire in the deal avg. 28 years old. We would actually get younger in this deal.
td4life
June 25th, 2010 at 10:39 pm
“Your Blazer trade favors the spurs, they would love Parker in addition to Miller… but have been thrilled by Miller so far, they also love Batum, which is part of the reason they traded away Martel. I don’t see them making such a trade w/o getting more talent back… and they would not do anything like that until the big FA dust settles.”
Parker is a CLEAR upgrade over Miller. Blazers need some more scoring, and TP can score. Word is the Blazers would love to move Miller for a younger, top-notched point. They clearly want to win NOW, for good reason: their MAIN guys are about as ready as they’re going to get (Roy, Aldridge, Camby). What better guy to lead them over the top than a 3-time all-star, 3-time champ, & FINALS MVP? Besides, Miller is 34, six years older than Parker, and there’s a lingering feeling that he’s not the right fit for Roy & the Blazers. That’s why they were apparently involved in making noise about Paul as we approached the draft. Also, Dice could give them some scoring punch & additional veteran leadership in the front court with Camby, and Hairston gives thema young & athletic guy that can play some pesky “D”, and could be a nice “situational” role player for the, with still some upside. I’m sure they like Batum, but to get Parker, the deal certainly might fly in my view, particularly since they have a competent & versatile Gomes, and a great young scorer in Babbitt with the 16th pick waiting in the wings at the SF spot.
June 26th, 2010 at 6:48 am
I say the Spurs should at least make a call to New Jersey and see what they would want for Derrick Favors’ rights. I personally don’t think he’ll be a Net anyway when the season starts. I think they really did want to trade the pick, but couldn’t find a taker. I believe they picked Derrick Favors as an insurance policy in case they don’t get Chris Bosh, Amare Stoudamire, Carlos Boozer, or one of the other big name free agents to go along with one of them.
June 26th, 2010 at 8:18 am
@Jim Henderson
June 25th, 2010 at 12:27 pm
“Are you looking at the redundancy & oversupply of talent on that team at the SF spot?”
Ariza, Battier and Budinger averaged 89 minutes last year so it’s silly to say they will “fight over 48 minutes”. And their draft pick, Patterson, is not a SF. He played the 5 for Kentucky until last year when they got Cousins. He’ll back up Scola at the 4.
If Houston felt the need to shed a SF they’d deal Ariza. The only way we get Battier is if he wants out. His contract expires next summer, if he tells them he’s definitely leaving they might trade him while they can still get something back. But that something back won’t be spare parts, we’d probably have to give up DeJuan or other good young talent.
June 26th, 2010 at 11:02 am
doggydogworld
June 26th, 2010 at 8:18 am
“Ariza, Battier and Budinger averaged 89 minutes last year so it’s silly to say they will “fight over 48 minutes”.”
They didn’t have Kevin Martin fully in mode until March, and Battier was injured for most of the rest of the season at that point (missed 15 games). Ariza & Budinger had to play some SG as a result. For both of them, their natural NBA position is SF. It will be a different story this year with all of them in the fold, healthy from the start, and with Budinger in his second year — and that kid is good! So the real log-jam at SF will begin this season without a move. And with young, high-paid, prolific scorer Martin, they’ll be little room to shift Ariza & Budinger for many minutes at the SG spot (and they also have Jermaine Taylor there). They’re not going to deal Ariza. They just signed him to a not too cheap multi-year deal. They may have been hoping that he could play their SG spot, but found out it wasn’t going to work mid-way through the season — hence the signing of Kevin Martin. The fact is, Ariza does a lot of what Battier does, yet he’s 6 years younger. Battier is the odd man out here.
“And their draft pick, Patterson, is not a SF. He played the 5 for Kentucky until last year when they got Cousins. He’ll back up Scola at the 4.”
The Rockets also have Jordan Hill & Andersen to back up Scola, plus any free agents they sign. Patterson will get some burn at PF, but he could get some time at SF as well. He’s athletic enough. He’s not ready to handle PF yet in the NBA. College is a lot different than the NBA in that regard. He’s undersized, and needs to put on some weight.
“But that something back won’t be spare parts, we’d probably have to give up DeJuan or other good young talent.”
Battier’s contract’s expiring. He could be moved easier than you think. Unfortunately, I just don’t really think we have what they want, or would be willing to give it to them. I certainly wouldn’t trade Blair for him. It’s not like we have an abundance of young talent to give away to fill an immediate need, unlike OKC, for example.
June 26th, 2010 at 2:20 pm
so jim, here’s what i’m smoking
bbq ribs
what is your suggestion of how to handle the big situation?
my posts are dumb
June 26th, 2010 at 3:37 pm
rj
June 26th, 2010 at 2:20 pm
I’m just saying, you can’t seriously believe that we’re going to contend with the Lakers with an aging Duncan & McDyess, and under-sized Blair, by bringing back guys like Mahinmi & Bonner. It’s just not going to happen. And it is VERY unlikely that Splitter will be enough, and it’s simply too much to ask for a European player in his first year to be our savior.
That’s why I’ve been saying, WE NEED TO MAKE A SIGNIFICANT TRADE in order to contend in the next couple of years, and also, to accelerate our BUILDING FOR THE FUTURE.
Our draft picks, as usual, were a good start at our FUTURE, and both could end up being steals for where they were drafted. And that’s great, but neither is likely to in any meaningful way help us better contend during the Duncan window. Organic development of our young players is also unlikely to be quick enough to allow us to meaningfully contend during the Duncan window.
We are left with trades, and anything minor we can do in free agency, given our cap situation. Our principal pieces to trade are TP, RJ, & McDyess, although I would not rule out Manu for the right situation.
I’m going to continue to suggest possible trades on this blog. I assume, and hope, that management is seriously looking for the right opportunities to potentially deal one or more of the guys that I just mentioned. The three players that I would not trade are Duncan, Hill, & Blair. Duncan is the heart of the system, and unfortunately we’re nowhere near prepared to proceed without him. Hill & Blair are our best young talents (and hopefully Anderson). We need to build around them, hopefully by securing a young “star”, or budding “star”, but at least by upgrading the overall talent with young, talented, promising players.
What we need is a younger (which means at least 5 years younger than the average age of Duncan & McDyess, which is 35), tall (6’9″ or taller, depending on leaping ability), big (240 lbs. or more), to add to our front court (even WITH Splitter) that can effectively block/alter shots in the paint — a “rim protector”. Splitter is not a real shot-blocker. We also need a proven, veteran perimeter defender that can knock down the three at a solid-to-superior rate (37% - 44%), as well as an additional three-point shooter - role player, someone who is a “gamer”, and will not disappear in the playoffs (just one example, Derek Fisher). Ideally, that’s what we need, and the closest we can get to filling each of those needs the better. And we do have a few valuable pieces to trade to try and get them.
That’s why I’m making trade proposals like the one on this thread involving the Blazers. Not a perfect deal, but in my view, worthy of consideration (and I’ll be making more of them soon - I hope to put a half dozen or so together in the next week or so, as we kick off the FA season). It’d be nice to know when the f_ _ _ Splitter is going to make his decision!
June 26th, 2010 at 4:51 pm
When is this “shot-blocker” going to play? Even if you cut Duncan down to 28 minutes (which I recommend) Splitter needs 30+ to learn the system and Blair will hopefully develop enough to earn 24+. That’s 82++ minutes, leaving 10-14 (less in the playoffs) for the new guy, Bonner at stretch 4 and/or small ball. Even if you zero out Bonner and small ball how much impact will a shot-blocker have in 10-14 minutes? And how much sense does it make to trade away a stud like TP for a limited minute shot blocker who DNPs in the playoffs?
June 26th, 2010 at 5:17 pm
Nick Batum said in a broadcasted draft day interview that TP called him this week and heard he might be headed to Portland, and that the two of them might be paired together.
Blazers have expressed strong interest in acquiring TP, they are offering Miller and Fernandez and idk what else… probably Gomes, whom they have stated officially stated they are planning on releasing.
That is not worth it from the Spurs standpoint… Fernandez is a disappointment. Would Portland give up Babbitt? Probably. And Bayless? Probably. They want Parker. If I’m the Spurs there is no way I consider it without getting Batum, who is just about untouchable according to Portland media.
Q: If we don’t trade RJ, aren’t we still likely over the cap meaning we won’t be able to spend his $15M on quality talent? Meaning we will still be stuck with cap signing exceptions next summer?
June 26th, 2010 at 7:45 pm
Td4life, no way I trade Parker to Portland. We also have to keep in mind the other team and not just what the Spurs are getting. No way in hell I want to see Parker lined up next to Roy and Alderidge. That would be a very difficult lineup to beat. Miller is an over the hill PG who was signed for FAR more than what he is worth. Fernandez could be a good player, but there are no guarantees.
We can trade Parker to Minny or the Warriors who suck or to Philly or Indy who’re in a different conference, but we can’t give Parker to a team we would very likely see in the playoffs. If they offered Roy (which they won’t) then Parker can go to Portland. Otherwise the Blazers can can screw off.
Regarding your question about RJ, the answer is yes. IF his contract is allowed to just expire, then all we can do is sign a middling FA this next summer since we will still be over the cap (assuming we resign TP). If we trade him now, we will more than likely continue to be over the cap. Speaking of RJ, I think his value will skyrocket come the trade deadline. There will be some team out there (GS, Minny, Philly) who will become more desperate to unload a large contract, especially if their team is underachieving.
Perhaps I’m softening a bit on my reluctance to trade him at the deadline, but that is when we will probably get the best value. Of course by this time our season will be f*cked since it will be very difficult to integrate a new piece into the system in 3 months, but this team is going nowhere anyway as they are currently constructed. I have to believe that if we don’t make a trade in the summer months that the FO is on a two year plan and they know this next season is simply for the young guns to gain experience.
June 26th, 2010 at 8:50 pm
hobson13
June 26th, 2010 at 7:45 pm
“No way in hell I want to see Parker lined up next to Roy and Aldridge. That would be a very difficult lineup to beat. Miller is an over the hill PG who was signed for FAR more than what he is worth. Fernandez could be a good player, but there are no guarantees.”
I disagree. The West is going to be tough no matter what. We need to worry about what WE need to do to get better as a team NOW, AND for the future, because our “stars” are old now. The key in the deal is Batum. No Batum, no deal. Batum is a perfect fit for us at a BIG weak spot, the SF position. Still at just 21 years of age, he also has tremendous upside. This guy can defend & shoot the three. In addition, we get Przybilla, one of the best back-up centers in the league. True, he’s not a scorer, and it’s a good thing, because we don’t need a SCORER on our front line right now. Duncan can score, Blair is going to soon become a VERY good scorer (this year perhaps, if he’s given a real chance), and Splitter is a pretty good scorer as well. What we need is a tall, “do the intangibles”, BIG guy to give solid minutes in the paint, blocking/altering shots, and rebounding on both ends. Przybilla has a history of doing just that (e.g., career 36 minute bpg. of 2.7). As to Miller, he’s not “over the hill”. Career 36 minute averages: 15.2 ppg., 7.5 apg., 4.3 rpg., 1.4 spg., 46% FG. LAST year 36 minute averages, in his FIRST year in Portland: 16.5 ppg., 6.4 apg., 3.8 rpg., 1.3 spg., 45% FG. That is not a drop-off that suggests he’s “over the hill”. Granted, he’s 34, but Batum is 21, and Parker’s back-up is 24 year old George Hill. Miller’s got at least another 2-3 pretty good years. He’s a hard-working, resilient guy. Did you know, he’s had eight seasons where he’s played ALL 82 games. That’s a durable guy, with a great work-ethic. And again, with Batum, there’s a good chance we’d have a guy locked in to our 3-spot for a decade. That, along with Anderson at the SG (I think he may have been a real steal), Hill at the point (hopefully - if not, we have a couple years to get a young stud in that role - either way, Hill should be a “big” contributor long-term), and Blair at PF (who in my view, has significant upside), starts to give a look of a team that is really starting to try and “rebuild on the run”. I’m not saying it’s a perfect deal, but it’s certainly worth a serious look in my view.
I’ll be making several other trade proposals in the coming days. I welcome your comments. Hopefully we’ll find one that we all agree makes sense to both teams involved, and makes the Spurs better this year, AND in the future.
June 26th, 2010 at 9:33 pm
doggydogworld
June 26th, 2010 at 4:51 pm
“When is this “shot-blocker” going to play? Even if you cut Duncan down to 28 minutes (which I recommend) Splitter needs 30+ to learn the system…”
30 mpg. “average” for the season is too much to expect from a transplanted European player in his first year with the team. I’d be very happy if we could get 25 mpg. of productive and efficient play (Scola got 24.7 mpg. his first year with the Rockets). Duncan’s minutes I would reduce further as well, down to 25 mpg., and also give him more days off. His body is wearing, and needs to be treated accordingly. If Blair can improve his mid-range jumper a bit over the Summer (I’m expecting this out of him), I’d like to see him average up to 25 mpg. this year as well. That leaves about 21 mpg. for the “shot-blocking” big, plenty of time to have an impact on games. I am also in favor of discontinuing the stretch 4 concept, not resigning Bonner, and trading McDyess for a 30 year old or less post-defender, shot-blocking big.
“And how much sense does it make to trade away a stud like TP for a limited minute shot blocker who DNPs in the playoffs?”
First of all, the proposed deal is NOT the rotation shot-blocking big for TP straight-up. It’s TP, and an aging, 36 year old big (Dice), for a perfect fit 21 yr. old SF with tremendous upside (Batum), a very good veteran PG with solid all-around career numbers (Miller), AND the 30 yr. old shot-blocking big, considered by many to be one of the best back-up centers in the league (Przybilla).
Secondly, we have to come to accept that we aren’t going to win by playing Duncan 40+ minutes per game anymore in a seven game series. It’s simply too much. He almost killed himself in the six games against Dallas last year (3 of the games over 40 minutes, 5 over 36 minutes), and then was already burnt out a bit by round two against the Suns. Instead, we need to assemble a “team” of bigs that are ALL going to be depended on, and expected to fulfill their role every night, with all of them playing between 20-30 minutes per game on a regular basis, INCLUDING during the playoffs. This is going to require more ball movement in the offense, and sound execution. The days of relying on Duncan to consistently dominate big games is over. The coaching staff & all the bigs will have to trust each other that they can get the job done, TOGETHER. And finally, we need to realize that Blair needs be a horse for this team. We need to show confidence in him, because we will not win without him. This might sound scary, but we will ultimately sink or swim depending on how much Blair has been able to improve his game over the summer, and how much confidence the coaching staff show in him by sticking with him in games, even with his inevitable mistakes. He needs regular minutes, and if that means fouling him out, so be it. He’ll learn, but you gotta let him experience it.
June 26th, 2010 at 10:06 pm
Jim Henderson
June 26th, 2010 at 8:50 pm
“I disagree. The West is going to be tough no matter what.”
Yes, but you don’t want to make a trade that would make the west even tougher. While not a firm rule, it is generally accepted that you don’t trade an all star player to a conference rival on the ascent. Jim, you know this.
“In addition, we get Przybilla, one of the best back-up centers in the league.”
I agree that when Przy plays, he is a very good backup center. With that said, he has a LONG history of injury. In his 6 years in Portland, he’s only lasted the entire season once. He’s played in 76, 56, 43, 77, 82, 30 games during his Portland stint. He is completely unreliable.
“As to Miller, he’s not “over the hill”.Miller’s got at least another 2-3 pretty good years.”
I will temporarily concede the point of Miller not being over the hill. The stats you provided does suggest he is still playing at a high level. On top of this, his salary is probably not too bad. However, he’s 34 yrs old and has played in almost 900 NBA games. There’s absolutely no way he has 2-3 good years left. Sure his game has aged well and if he were 32, then he would be a different story. I am certain we will begin to see at decline in his game as soon as this next season. He has pulled a “Houdini” on father time, but it can’t last much longer.
My overall take on this trade suggestion: I’m indifferent on this one. The upside to Batum is neutralized by the age of Miller and the injury history of Przy. I think this trade is at best a double when we would need a home run in order to unload Parker.
I hate simply being a naysayer without any good counter trade, but I’m temporarily out of good trade ideas. I still believe some idiot GM (Kahn, etc.) will get desperate at the trade deadline and unload a good talent for an expiring contract. Houston used this strategy last year and it worked well for them. I hate to say it, but the only way for us to compete for a title this year is for us to throw together some hail mary trade. I just don’t know that our conservative FO will do that. On the bright side, RJ’s expiring should fetch us something nice if we wait it out.
June 26th, 2010 at 10:26 pm
“I am certain we will begin to see at decline in his game as soon as this next season. He has pulled a “Houdini” on father time, but it can’t last much longer.”
Stranger things have happened. Look at Nash.
“I think this trade is at best a double when we would need a home run in order to unload Parker.”
It’s VERY rare to get “home runs” on trades such as these. A triple maybe, but you’re definitely going to have to rely on the intangibles that the deal ends up bringing you to get your ass home.
I agree, the Przybilla injury history is of major concern. However, he does have an expiring contract. Maybe we could get one solid year out of him, and reevaluate. I don’t love the deal, but I do think Batum is going to be really good, filling a BIG whole on our roster. And remember, we might lose Parker next year anyway.
June 26th, 2010 at 10:37 pm
jim, I really don’t see the portland trade a good option rigt now..we still have proven winners in parker and ginobili, and the only player I’d be willing to trade is rj. Even if we don’t, we still have enough to contend with the lakers. We have two 7 footers in duncan and splitter…never underestimate the spurs, which is what most nba analysts have learned iver the past decade. You know why? Because of our ever efficient core of duncan ginobili and parker. I’m pretty sure next season is our year to make it atleast to tbe finals and stop phil jacksons threepeat. and next year is an odd number as well. And the spurs would never take on the huge amount of money in monta ellis’s contract (whoever said that) we should wait until the trade deadline and move rj’s contract if possible. But I’m pretty sure we’ll see an improvement in his performance next season. Go spurs go!
June 26th, 2010 at 11:27 pm
**TRADE ALERT**
I’m proposing another deal, this time with Indiana, and again, I won’t try to really sell the deal. I’ll just see if any of any of you have any pros & cons that you want to offer.
*WARNING* - Multi-Player deal. If it’s too complicated for your taste, just pass on it!
Parker, RJ, & McDyess
to Indiana for
Granger, Murphy, TJ Ford, & Rush
The deal could require Parker to come to terms with a contract extension before the deal can be consummated, OR not (if they’re JUST going for max cap relief).
Please consider how each player, and their contracts, would benefit each team, and take a brief look at the relevant stats as appropriate before you render initial judgment. And remember, we may lose Parker next year anyway. Thanks.
* Note: ALL contracts in the deal expire at the end of this coming season, EXCEPT for Granger’s. He has 4 more years at about 10 mil. per year.
* Remember, the Pacers drafted the highly talented George at #10, who happens to play the same position as Granger, and has a similar type of game (though more raw, of course).
* Remember, Indiana REALLY wants and needs a top point guard to help turn the direction of this franchise.
* The deal clears MAJOR cap space for Indy in 2011 - they’ll have NOBODY under contract for more than 2.5 million in 2011 (except perhaps George - he might qualify for a bit more as a rookie contract drafted at #10, and also Parker, if they extend Parker as a part of the deal).
* Remember, there’s ALWAYS pros & cons for both teams in any deal.
Okay now, help me identify the STRENGTHS & WEAKNESSES of the deal from the perspective of BOTH teams. Thanks.
Useful resources:
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/
June 26th, 2010 at 11:32 pm
zainn
June 26th, 2010 at 10:37 pm
Sorry, zainn, but we’re not going to even make it to the Western Finals with the status quo in place; that is, without a significant trade. If we don’t make this type of trade, you’ll see.
June 27th, 2010 at 12:59 am
hobson13
June 26th, 2010 at 7:45 pm
Jim Henderson
June 26th, 2010 at 8:50 pm
I agree EXACTLY with everything hobson13 wrote in reaction to my post about the current TP rumours going on in Portland… with the exception of his analysis of Miller. Miller transformed Philly, and carried them in the playoffs, and is known to be as bulletproof as Henderson described. He’s also an extremely good true PG, and we’ve also got Manu and Hill to run the point. He’d be a better mentor to Hill than Tony, and his window is at least as long as TD’s. HOWEVER…
Jim, the deal Portland is talking about is shipping out Fernandez, I wondered if the Spurs would send Bayless and Babbitt instead, b/c we could use young assets to entice someone like Houston to take RJ’s expiring for our solution at SF. But as we both have said, Batum is the only piece we would take back… so we can stop talking about Portland, b/c they see him as a piece of their core for 10 years, he improves every year, and they think of him as Scottie Pippen.
It is common knowledge true that you don’t trade stars to make your conference rivals better. However, both teams may have to make very tough decisions and consider EVERYTHING, as they otherwise have a very big gap to close versus LA. If a Portland trade netted us Batum, and gave us assets to help us move RJ this summer, we would have to consider it. But it won’t net us Batum.
To wit, I previously wrote:
“So, I really wouldn’t look to Portland at all. ”
And
“Guys, I think RJ and TP are the horses we got. [...] Of course, TP and RJ should both be better for us next year, and maybe we get to the second round [..] But, this season is mainly gonna allow our younger guys, Tiago included, to “Pound The Rock” and see what they are made of, and see to what TP brings to the floor in his FA year.”
Thus, hobson13 is correct:
“I have to believe that if we don’t make a trade in the summer months that the FO is on a two year plan and they know this next season is simply for the young guns to gain experience.”
and that a midseason trade would only underscore that outlook.
So plan A is to move RJ before the preseason, an plan B is to make Holt some money in with another trip to the playoffs while developing the young guys: I do believe TP will have a terrific overall season, and that Tiago will be a clearly above average NBA starting center.
June 27th, 2010 at 2:20 am
I can conceive of only one trade proposal that makes us contenders in the next two years.
Let me preface it by saying…
* I think the two biggest pieces we need to truly contend are a solid all-around two-way player at SF, or possibly G. And an unbeatable big-man rotation. (I’m not really in favor of substitution specialists, be they shooters, defenders, or shot-blockers. The possible exception are smart, physical, high-motor guys that can really play. I want 10 studs in our rotation).
* The following trade assumes that Tyson Chandler can give us a very close approximation of what he did in New Orleans and Chicago. If the FO deems that he can’t be that, then no deal.
* To unload Biedrins, GS should have to sacrifice a piece that we need, AND a chip that we use as a subsequent trade enticement.
* Detroit needs defense down low to anchor the play and development of Villanova and/or Monroe. Tying up money in a seven footer is a better move than their other expensive contracts. In general, (and not surprisingly!) they are disappointed in their expensive assets of Gordon, Villanova, and also Hamilton, and should be willing to rebuild and get out from under some of those (4 year) contracts. To take on Biedrins, they should insist on giving up more cap space than they are taking back, as much as is allowed. But being under the cap, Detroit also could take back more (shorter-term/expiring) contract money than they send out in longer-term contract money.
* Charlotte still desperately needs more scoring. By extending an offer to T Thomas, they are not in need of too many more defensive Bigs, and wouldn’t need FC Chandler… but then again it’s Larry Brown so who knows, maybe they’d want a true C, such as Biedrins.
So…
1) We send GS RJ for Biedrins, Azubuike, and a 3rd player that will be of value to Charlotte, Houston, or Detroit. Azubuike becomes our probable starting SF, giving us much of what RJ was suppossed to. We retain Hill, TP, Manu, and Anderson.
2) We acquire Chandler (for a low-risk one year?) and Detroit gets Biedrins (and possibly an additional shorter contract, especially if Charlotte asks for Maxiell). Charlotte gets one of Detriot’s SGs, plus either Maxiell, Villanova, or Wilcox’s expiring. Either Detroit or Charlotte could get the 3rd player which San Antonio acquired from GS, or Hairston, etc.
Step 2 above is one scenario; I think it’s also possible that other teams may have a need for Biedrins are Charlotte, Toronto, Atlanta, or maybe Houston. Of course, they could deal with GS directly. But we are smarter, we could swoop in first, and being smarter, we can sell deals that GS’s Larry Riley cannot think strait about. Jordon and Dumars are also not very good GMs.
June 27th, 2010 at 4:55 am
TD, Splitter, Chandler, Blair, McD
TP, Hill, Dorell Wright, Manu, Azubuike, Anderson
June 27th, 2010 at 10:42 am
td4life
June 27th, 2010 at 2:20 am
First, about a few comments above, there’s a line that say, “Your comment is awaiting moderation”. That’s my comment from last night. I have no idea why it’s taking so long to post. It’s another proposed trade, this time with Indiana. Hopefully it shows up at some point in the next 24 hours.
On the Portland deal: There’s no way Portland is AS HIGH on Batum as you suggest. He’s nowhere near the Scottie Pippen category, and it’s a BIG jump to even consider projecting for him that much upside. Pippen’s a top-50 player, ALL-TIME. Plus, they’re simply different players: Batum’s a spot-up shooter, not great off the dribble, particularly in half-court sets; Scottie was always a good play-maker & rebounder; that’s not Batum’s strengths. Batum can be a very good player, but a top-50 player? That’s VERY unlikely; he is likely to be a very good player, but he may not even ever be an all-star. An occasional all-star is his ceiling, in my view.
On your trade proposal:
Interesting idea. I’m not too good at following, and properly evaluating three-team trades. Obviously three-team trades are harder to get done. It’s like coming to an agreement when you were kids with two other brothers rather than just one.
I do have some of questions/comments for you:
(1) Chandler has had an injury-plagued background. Isn’t that a concern?
(2) I believe Chandler has opted out of his contract of 11.7 mil. per. It could be a tough task to find a trade partner under such conditions, don’t you think?
(3) To me, Biedrins wouldn’t solve Charlotte’s problems by a long shot. Thus, I would think they’d rather get in position to clear contracts rather than get saddled for 9 million per over 4 years.
(4) Seems to me that Detroit is already locked into too many questionable long-term deals (Villanueva, Maxiel, Hamilton, Gordon). They can’t afford for another one to be a costly one, and Biedrins is clearly a gamble at this point. I would try to blow that team up if I were them. It would be hard to get rid of Gordon & Hamilton (their longest/biggest deals), but every other larger type deal should go, I would think. By the way, Wilcox & Maxiell do not have expiring deals.
(5) how did Dorrell Wright show up on our new team out of all this?
Also, you and Hobson seem resigned to having TP next year. Why? I think we still need to actively look at trading him for the right pieces. We may not be able to keep him next year anyway, so we need to be proactive now, or the wheels are going to eventually fall off this Spurs machine. We don’t want to be desperate, but there are options out there, and some unsolicited interest as well.
June 27th, 2010 at 12:08 pm
**TRADE ALERT**
I’m proposing another deal, this time with Charlotte, but again, I won’t try to sell the deal. I’ll just see if any of you have any pros & cons that you want to offer.
*WARNING*
This is a Multi-Player deal: If these kinds of deals are too complicated for your taste, just pass on it!
TP, RJ, McDyess, & Hairston
to Charlotte for
Wallace, Agustine, Diaw, & Diop
Please consider how each player, and the contract situation, would benefit (or not benefit) each team, and take a brief look at the relevant stats, as appropriate, before rendering initial judgment. And remember, we may not be able to keep Parker next year anyway. Thanks.
A couple basic things to consider:
* Charlotte desperately needs a scorer, and an experienced all-star point guard to run that team. Felton just won’t cut it (he’s a FA).
* Charlotte could get themselves in position to sign at least two star free agents in the 2011 season by doing this deal (two if Parker resigned - and remember, they will still have Steven Jackson as well - probably three FA’s if they don’t resign Parker). They would be freeing up an additional 15 mil by us absorbing Diop & Wallace’s contracts for 2011. Without resigning Parker (with just Steven Jackson there), as it stands now, they would have just 7.6 million per year under contract on their roster. A sampling of the FA’s that are expected to be on the market next year:
K. Perkins
A. Horford
M. Gasol
S. Dalembert
D. West
C. Landry
J. Green
T. Murphy
Z. Randolph
C. Brewer
S. Battier
A. Kirilenko
J.R. Smith
C. Butler
T. Prince
A. Afflao
K Azubuike
W. Chandler
Charlotte needs to make moves to get themselves in position to challenge in the east over the next 2-3 years. They need a reshuffle in my view. We need to add talent at our weakest links.
June 27th, 2010 at 12:29 pm
jim, we saw last season that by adding new pieces to our roster it takes a long time for players to find their roles on the team. you can’t just assume that by trading tony, everything is going to be all right. with the charlotte trade, dj augustin is nothing compared to tony parker, and hill is really not ready to take the reins right now. PASS
June 27th, 2010 at 12:39 pm
**TRADE ALERT**
I’m proposing another deal, this time with Sacramento, but again, I won’t try to sell the deal. I’ll just see if any of you have any pros & cons that you want to offer.
RJ & Hairston to
Sacramento for
Dalembert & Donte Greene
Please consider how each player, and the contract situation, would benefit (or not benefit) each team, and take a brief look at the relevant stats, as appropriate, before rendering initial judgment. And remember, we may not be able to keep Parker next year anyway. Thanks.
A few basic things to consider:
* Kings never had Dalembert in their long-term plans. They acquired him for his expiring deal.
* The Kings are over-stocked at center: Dalembert, Thompson, Cousins, & Whiteside.
* Kings need a relatively cheap, defensive-minded, back-up SG, and a bit more cap space for 2011, because they have FOUR important player/contracts coming up in 2011 that are expiring, and significant raises will be required to keep them: Evans, Thompson, Caspi, & Landry.
* RJ’s/Hairston’s expiring deals would give them an additional 3-4 million in cap space for 2011.
June 27th, 2010 at 12:41 pm
Delete this line from previous comment: “And remember, we may not be able to keep Parker next year anyway.”
Obviously, Parker is not in this deal. Thanks.
June 27th, 2010 at 12:53 pm
@Jim Henderson
I realize that Batum and Pippen have different games. However, there are VERY few players the Blazers would give up Batum for at this point in his career. I’ll leave it at that. (By the way, I live in Portland, and I hear ALOT about Batum from Blazers employees on the radio. They are much more committed to him than Aldridge. Justifiably, I think.)
Regarding Tony Parker:
I wasn’t addressing trading him because with the right roster we wouldn’t need to, though I am open to it But, I don’t see many ways to upgrade. We would need a reliable go-to scorer good for an automatic 16-21ppg, and/or a top-notch play-maker. I don’t like TP long-term and never have. But this year he’ll continue to be a tough matchup for other teams as a scorer, and we need all the tough matchups we can get.
Andre Miller makes other players much better. His impact on AI2 and Oden (also Batum) were unmatched. I don’t see us getting an excellent PG through a trade. As I’ve said in a previous post, expect the Parker, Udrih, Dragic, DeColo trend to continue for awhile.
Dorell Wright: I was just taking a stab at adding a promising player with our Bi-Annual exception.
I understand your concerns about Chandler, and briefly addressed them in my post. I proposed him really for one reason only, there are very few players that we can add to this team that put us over, a best-case Chandler is one of them. With his quickness and defense, we would have a three-headed monster up front that would be championship caliber. If the FO determines he has not recovered, after flying out and meeting with him, then, as I said, no deal. I was imagining he doesn’t opt out, but a sign and trade could work here as well. This is really a clutching at straws thing, I admit. But I would be very excited about a healthy TC.
Rather than bogging this down any further and explaining why a team such as Detroit could see untapped value in a defensive-minded center, while shedding some salary down the line and sending scoring support to Charlotte, I’ll just admit that I’m really dreaming here. Once again, I think we are stuck with the guys we have. Dammit.
I don’t see how we move RJ to get any significant help this year without sweetening it with chips I don’t know if we’d let go of. Most RJ deals, especially at the deadline, won’t help us this year, but could help us down the line. And that’s about all I can say.
June 27th, 2010 at 1:18 pm
zainn
June 27th, 2010 at 12:29 pm
“you can’t just assume that by trading tony, everything is going to be all right.”
I’m not making that assumption at all. However, in my view the deal gives us a chance. And by the way, don’t make the assumption that all multi-player trades take YEARS to effectively assimilate. Look at what Boston did in 2007-2008: they added several players: Garnett, Allen, Posey, G. Davis, P.J. Brown, and gave up several players: A. Jefferson, Delonte West, W. Szerzebiak, R. Gomes, among others, and still won the championship in their very first year. Our problems last year go WAY beyond assimilation issues.
“with the charlotte trade, dj augustin is nothing compared to tony parker, and hill is really not ready to take the reins right now.”
And RJ is no Gerald Wallace either. What’s your point? The fact is, Augustin is a skilled, young point guard that can hit the three, and would be a more than adequate complement to Manu, Hill, & Anderson, particularly for the privilege of getting GERALD WALLACE ON OUR TEAM (all-defensive 1st team last year, by the way!).
No offense, but for those of you that just have a CLOSED mind on the possibility of dealing Tony Parker, you might as well not bother getting involved in the discussion.
Our line-up with this deal would be the following:
Hill, Augustin,
Manu, Anderson,
Wallace, Gee, Diaw
Duncan, Blair, Diaw
Splitter, Diop
Reserves: Temple, etc.
In my view, that’s a VERY competitive team with a FUTURE that’s looking better.
June 27th, 2010 at 1:33 pm
td4life
June 27th, 2010 at 12:53 pm
“Regarding Tony Parker:
I wasn’t addressing trading him because with the right roster we wouldn’t need to, though I am open to it But, I don’t see many ways to upgrade. We would need a reliable go-to scorer good for an automatic 16-21ppg, and/or a top-notch play-maker.”
See the recently proposed trade with Charlotte on this thread, and the Pacer one as well, if it ever shows up.
“I don’t see how we move RJ to get any significant help this year without sweetening it with chips I don’t know if we’d let go of. Most RJ deals, especially at the deadline, won’t help us this year, but could help us down the line. And that’s about all I can say.”
In my view, the RJ deal to the Kings (see recent post) helps our team NEXT year, and “possibly” for the future. Dalembert can defend & protect the rim, and Donte Greene CAN play, is young, with upside, and yet is somewhat superfluous in Sacramento because they have the young & talented Casspi who’s going to hog most of the minutes at SF.
June 27th, 2010 at 3:19 pm
@ Jim Henderson,
If the Spurs last Nov couldn’t see the benefits of trading Bonner and Mason for Stephen Jackson, why are they now going to do something beneficial? Remember Bonner and Mason were expiring contracts and players that won’t be back this year and the Spurs got nothing in return.
Stephen Jackson knows the Spurs system. He won a championship with the Spurs, due to his clutch 3 4th qtr 3ptr’s in game 6 vs. the Nets.
Stephen Jackson was 1 of 4 NBA players in 08-09 that averaged 20 pts, 5 rebs, and 6 assists. The other 3?….. Try Lebron James, Dwayne Wade, and Chris Paul.
Stephen Jackson gets paid half those 3 players. Half of Iguodala, Deng, Turkoglu, etc., etc. and the Spurs didn’t want him.
Warriors traded Stephen Jackson straight up for Vladimir Radmanvic basically. (Raja Bell told teams he couldn’t play last year and needed wrist surgery).
Spurs had Bobby Jones on a 10 day contract but didn’t want to develop him? Bobby Jones according to his college coach shut down BRANDON ROY and NATE WASHINGTON in practice. But Mahinmi, Hairston, Gee, are worth 3 yr development plans? http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Bobby-Jones-351/
I agree the Spurs need a bold move, but I don’t believe in their willingness to do so. Kicking Ratliff, Finley, and Haislip to the curb says they’re gun shy due to the Jefferson fiasco.
Why are the Spurs going to be bold now? Why are the Spurs going to be proactive now?
June 27th, 2010 at 4:00 pm
@lvmainman
Seriously, Stephen Jackson wasn’t available until after the start of the season, and by that time, we already had Jefferson on board. Acquiring Jackson wasn’t an option at that time.
June 27th, 2010 at 5:07 pm
Henderson-
I believe Sacramento would rather have one year of Dalembert and Green than one year of RJ and Hairston.
Dalembert can push the development of their other bigs (Whiteside is years away anyway) and possibly re-sign if those other guys don’t develop ahead of schedule. He can also play alongside those other younger guys in the front court.
Regarding any proposed deals of expirings for other expirings, the Spurs are probably gonna have to part with something of value (a future first rounder at least). Or take on a smaller, longer contract of maybe a so-so talent, just to net us the trade exception.
June 27th, 2010 at 6:24 pm
GINOBILI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rp0QYJW2gXQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5RUUlE9nRBQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5RUUlE9nRBQ
DEJUAN BLAIR
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3zmUQbdiJk
TONY PARKER
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CK_CK_mddeE
June 27th, 2010 at 8:30 pm
Everyone is missing the steal of the draft. Look up Ryan Richards on YouTube. He was the concensus player of day 1 and really turned some heads with his athleticism. I also took a look at some footage of him on YouTube. Raw but he is only 19 and is pushing players around. He goes up strong and looks to dunk like a thicker version of stoudemire. Then after he dunks on someone, he looks to push them out of the way and run down the court. He is funadmentally sound on the block and has a REALLY nice shot from about 20 feet. I even saw footage of him running the fast break and the man has a handle, the likes of Odom in LA.
If Splitter doesn’t sign, I say screw him and bring this guy Richards over right now. I think he could learn alot behind Tim. And he has made it clear to all that he wants to come over NOW not in a few years. If they stash him in Europe, one of those teams are going to find him and sign him to a longer term contract and we will be in the Splitter dilemma all over again. Hell, he has to give us more than Bonner did in the playoffs. Isn’t that what makes Pop worth the money he makes, his ability to coach young talent? Ala, Parker, Hill and Blair (off course with the preface that he has talent to work with)…
Go Spurs Go!!
June 27th, 2010 at 8:59 pm
This guy just opted out of his meager contract with the Heat. If we end up not trading anybody to get another shot-blocking big, stealing this guy away from Miami would be a good idea. He’s likely to go cheap, he’s a LATE bloomer, and this guy PROTECTS THE RIM.
http://www.miamiherald.com/2010/06/24/1698033/miami-heats-joel-anthony-to-become.html
June 27th, 2010 at 10:29 pm
lvmainman
June 27th, 2010 at 3:19 pm
I’d be in favor of inviting Bobby Jones to camp to try out for the team. Even if he has to spend some time in Austin, it’s worth a shot. He sounds like the type of defensive player that will rub off on other teammates, and that’s what we need. Plus, he’d be cheap. As long as there’s not some sort of character/personal problems associated with this guy, we need to get Pop on the phone on this one! He could be just one of those guys that has just fallen through the cracks. I know he’s had some consistency issues with his shooting over the years, but he did make his threes at a 39% rate in the Italian League this past year. His defense alone could be worth 10-15 mpg. We definitely need to step up the volume on “D” this year. That’s the only reason Boston got so far this past season.
June 27th, 2010 at 10:52 pm
jim, I guess I can see ur point of view.i just think the pg of a team is basically like the quarterback in the nfl. Everything goes through him, and tony parker has proven to be one of the best ever since2003, but I am totally open to trading rj but that’s it. And adding dalember w/o trading mcdyess would just overload our forward big positions. Maybe we could get adecent guard from sactown in that town when including rj and mcdyess for dalembert and guard, and it’d be a go for me. Sorry for all the criticism before jim henderson, but I’m totally against trading tony unless we get bigger superstars in return like paul, d williams etc.
June 28th, 2010 at 1:41 am
@ Tyler,
Stephen Jackson was 1 of 4 NBA players in 08-09 that averaged 20 pts, 5 rebs, and 6 assists. The other 3?….. Try Lebron James, Dwayne Wade, and Chris Paul.
Jackson was paid $7 mil this past season. Half of any decent player in the NBA.
Jefferson is a forward and Jackson is a guard.
Spurs front office needs to be aggressive adding quality players when they are available at a discount, regardless as to when they become available.
June 28th, 2010 at 3:54 am
I’ll provide a scouting report on Bobby Jones, having seen a lot of him in-person when I was at UW. But first… Didn’t he play for the Spurs very briefly?
He’s very much a Spurs-type of person. He has a lot of character, is smart, and works very hard (one of the places I used to see him, along with Brandon Roy, was in the library in the middle of the night). UW’s drop-off wasn’t just because of losing Roy-Jones was the key to the pressure defense that got them to consecutive Sweet 16s. So if nothing else, he’s a good wing defender who will fit in well with the team. He had virtually no perimeter game, though, probably because he played Center in high school. He’s athletic, but has never seemed to have the feel for how to play when facing the basket. He had no real handle, no vision, and wasn’t an effective passer. His shot was never very consistent, either, especially when contested. It might be that working with Chip could turn him into a more effective shooter. But realistically he’s not likely to be much more than a defensive specialist/offensive liability. I like Bobby an awful lot, so I’d love to see him become an solid rotation player for the Spurs. Unfortunately, though, I just don’t see it happening.
June 28th, 2010 at 4:31 am
i was thinking in this trades of portland
postdraft
portland trade andre miller to indiana for paul george, brandon rush and troy murphy.
larry bird said that they desesperate need a veteran pg.
and then trade babbitt or paul george and eliott williams for tony parker
we lose in the are of pg but i think williams is very similar to hill and the spurs have the ability to work on him like they do in hill playing pg and sg and we get stronger in the sf area with george or babbitt.
portland with tony have a upgrade, they still have a good sf of the draft with babbit or george , and have rush and troy murphy
what you all think about this ?
June 28th, 2010 at 8:17 am
Hi, I’m new here. I love what the Spurs are about, and I really feel Pop has the best job in the NBA. I also get a lot of flack from Laker fans because I’m from LA, but I’m sticking with the silver and grey.
Can the Spurs acquire Michael Redd in a restructured deal? Spurs pay part of his salary to relieve the Bucks (I mean like a couple mil at most with a future first-round draft pick). Redd is approaching the twilight of his career with question marks about his health and the imminent lockout. Hopefully we can score him the way the Spurs did with Finley. I don’t think the Bucks want to hold onto him. With this stealthy move, the Spurs go back to being instant contenders with Splitter in the mix.
June 28th, 2010 at 12:18 pm
zainn
June 27th, 2010 at 10:52 pm
“Sorry for all the criticism before jim henderson, but I’m totally against trading tony unless we get bigger superstars in return like paul, d williams etc.”
Well, that means you’re COMPLETELY closed to trading TP, because you’re never going to get either of the top two & YOUNG point guards in the league for Parker. And by the way, I wouldn’t classify Parker as a “superstar”. Those guys you listed (Paul, Williams) are “franchise” players. Parker is not.
Tim in Surrey
June 28th, 2010 at 3:54 am
“I like Bobby an awful lot, so I’d love to see him become an solid rotation player for the Spurs. Unfortunately, though, I just don’t see it happening.”
I appreciate your personal perspective regarding Bobby Jones from 4 years ago in college. That said, I’d be surprised if his overall game has not matured some in the areas that you noted were weak: hence his 39% 3-point shooting in the Italian League this past season, plus 1.8 steals per game in 25 mpg. (he also shot 39% from three in 24 games with the Nuggets two years ago). Also, if the Spurs can’t afford to get a more established all-around perimeter defender, which includes a consistent 3-point game (e.g. Battier), Jone’s defense alone for 10-15 mpg. might be worth a shot. WE SIMPLY MUST IMPROVE THE INTENSITY OF OR PERIMETER DEFENSE. And he could be a cheap addition that has the potential to make a difference. It seems like it’d be worth a look.
June 28th, 2010 at 1:42 pm
Free agency starts Thursday. I think we need to be looking at trades right now, but if we don’t have anything in the works at all by Thursday (and even if we do), we need to be intently looking at the free agency market as of 7/1/10. The following list is the best I was able to come up with, taking into account our limited financial resources. For example, in my view, we simple can’t afford guys like Mike Miller, Kyle Korver, etc.
That said, I’m by no means an expert on what our cap/exceptions situation will specifically allow us to do. So, lets assume that we are NOT going to resign Mason, Bogans, Bonner, & Mahinmi, and we are giving 4.5 mil. of the MLE to sign Splitter. How much money would we have to acquire any other free agents?
Okay, here’s the list. Who could we use, who might we want, and who could we afford?
Player….Team….Status…….Age….Position …2010/Sal
J. Childress ..Hawks …(R)…….26 …..SG/SF ….3.6 2008
T. Allen …….Celtics ….(U) ……28 ……..SG.….2.5
M. Daniels …Celtics ….(U) ……28 …….SG …………1.99
T. Thomas ….Mavs ……(U) ……33 …….PF …………825
J. Petro ……Nuggets ….(U)…….24 ……..C …………825
W. Bynum …Pistons ….(U) ……27 …….PG …………825
A. Morrow …GSW ……..(R) ……24 …….SG …………736
C. Hunter …..GSW ……..(R) ……25 ……..C …………632
R. Bell ……….GSW ………(U) ……34 …….SG …………5.2
S. Blake ……..Clips ………(U) ……30 ……..PG ………..4.0
R. Butler …….Clips ………(U) ……31 …….SG/SF ……3.9
S. Novak …….Clips ………(U) ……27 …….SF …………1.0
D. Mbenga …Lakers ……(U) ……29 ……..C …………959
J. Anthony ….Heat ………(R) ……27 ……PF/C ………825
D. Wright …..Heat ………(U) …….24 …….SF …………2.9
R. Brewer ….Grizzlies ….(R) …….24 ……SG/SF …….2.7
S. Hunter …..Grizzlies ….(U) …….28 ……PF/C ………3.7
M. Williams ..Grizzlies …(U) …….23 ……SF ………….825
S. Rodriguez ..Knicks ……(R) …….24 ……PG …………1.58
E. House ………Knicks …(U) …….32 …..PG/SG ……2.86
J.J. Redick …….Magic …… (R) ……26 ……SG ………..2.8
M. Barnes …….Magic ……(U) ……30 …….SF ………..1.6
L. Amundson .. Suns ……..(U) …..27 ……PF/C ……..855
A. Johnson ……Raptors ….(U) …..23 ……PF …………3.9
June 28th, 2010 at 1:57 pm
Ginobili
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rp0QYJW2gXQ
June 28th, 2010 at 1:58 pm
Ginobili offense
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5RUUlE9nRBQ
June 28th, 2010 at 1:59 pm
Ginobili defense
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCerawsZg90
June 28th, 2010 at 1:59 pm
Sign a Defender like Tony Allen or Matt Barnes
June 28th, 2010 at 2:00 pm
Dejuan Blair
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3zmUQbdiJk
June 28th, 2010 at 2:00 pm
Tony Parker
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CK_CK_mddeE
June 28th, 2010 at 5:29 pm
Video clip, Joel Anthony mix, “the greatest player we’ve ever seen”! Obviously they’re just playing around with the title in quotes, but this guy can protect the rim, AND he hustles & has a good attitude:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RY1V0tpM0fw
June 28th, 2010 at 5:35 pm
Here’s another guy we could use 10-15 mpg.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wq-zUwozpOc
June 28th, 2010 at 5:51 pm
Another “energy” guy worth a look for 10-15 mpg. of hustle in the paint & defense the rim.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b5gRJoF39Ew
June 28th, 2010 at 7:45 pm
Guys, what if were to work out a sign and trade deal with Parker going to the Knicks. The Knicks would love to have him and Parker would VERY likely sign an extension with them. In return, perhaps we could get back Anthony Morrow and Ronnie Brewer. Anthony Morrow could definitely shore up much of our shooting woes and Brewer, while not a great shooter, is a good athlete and a VERY good defender. Brewer, with a bit of time can come close to being a Bowen-like defender. While he is listed as a SG,he has the size to play the SF position for a long time in the Spurs system. Both players are under 26 yrs old and can be building blocks for the future.
I will admit there are risks to this trade. Both are Restricted FA. However, if we offered them both say $5 million/year contracts, that would be sizeable raises over what they are making. While Memphis has some cap room, they will be using it in persuit of keeping Rudy Gay. GS, is over the cap and IMO, would have a difficult time matching that salary.
While this trade doesn’t help our situation with a big man, it does address 3pt shooting, a need for youth and a need for RJ’s replacement, and a very good perimeter defender. It’s not the superstar trade I am looking for, but we may need to look for sign and trade opportunities with Parker and NY. I am quite sure Parker would sign an extension and NY, by fascilitating a sign and trade, would essentially get Parker for free.
June 28th, 2010 at 11:19 pm
Hobson13
June 28th, 2010 at 7:45 pm
Hey, Hobson, any thoughts on these two trade proposals I made from earlier on this thread?
Jim Henderson
June 27th, 2010 at 12:08 pm
“TP, RJ, McDyess, & Hairston
to Charlotte for
Wallace, Augustin, Diaw, & Diop”
Jim Henderson
June 27th, 2010 at 12:39 pm
“RJ & Hairston to
Sacramento for
Dalembert & Donte Greene”
(See full comments at the actual post for these two trades.)
I also posted another trade with Indiana, but it says the following: “your comment is awaiting moderation”, and so it hasn’t showed up on this thread. In brief, here is what is was:
TP, RJ, McDyess, & Hairston
to Indiana for
Granger, Murphy, Ford, & Rush
A few points to take into consideration:
- Pacers get a HUGE salary dump in 2011; their player contracts are perfectly aligned for a major salary purge.
- Their talented draft pick George is what they believe is a young, future Granger, with a much cheaper price tag for awhile. Even though George is a bit raw, he has the talent & confidence to be a quick study. Four years under Granger does not make sense to me, especially considering the need to upgrade the team at the point.
- Pacers would position themselves with a good shot at resigning Parker (they desperately want to get their hands on a top PG, long-term), AND signing another two top free agents, to go along with Hibbert, George, Hansborough, & Dahntay Jones (in 2011 free agency, they’d have a good shot at signing Parker + 2 or 3 of the following players: Z. Randolph, J.R. Smith, C. Butler, T. Prince, A. Afflao, K. Azubuike, D. West, J. Green, C. Brewer).
- Spurs would have to absorb the last 4 years of Granger’s contract, but Murphy, Rush, & Ford’s are expiring deals.
June 29th, 2010 at 6:41 am
“TP, RJ, McDyess, & Hairston
to Charlotte for
Wallace, Augustin, Diaw, & Diop”
Jim, I think this trade would definitely get us younger. Augustin is a downgrade from Parker, but Wallace is an upgrade from RJ. Diaw and Diop are both good bigs who are veterans and could immediately come in and play on our front line. I actually don’t mind this trade too much. Charlotte can unload some salary with RJ and get a good PG in Parker. ON top of this, there is no chance of seeing them in the playoffs.
“RJ & Hairston to
Sacramento for
Dalembert & Donte Greene”
This, on the surface this seems like a safe trade. However, this trade might leave us dangerously thin at the SF position. With that said, we would get back a big in Dalembert. He is an expiring contract and we can sign him next summer for far less than the $12mil he currently makes. Greene is an interesting player. The guy is a 6’11″ SF and if he could learn to shoot (I bet Chip Engelland could help him big time) then he might be a serious player on the wing. I would do this trade only if the FO was convinced they could make a baller out of Greene. If they were, then we would get younger and bigger.
“TP, RJ, McDyess, & Hairston
to Indiana for
Granger, Murphy, Ford, & Rush”
Absolutely. Granger is a young star and would only get better around Duncan and Manu. We would have this guy locked down for 4 years (at a reasonable contract no less) so there’s no way he’d bolt. Murphy will be a FA next summer and will probably get a contract for less than what he’s making. Ford is a decent PG and can get us through next season and Rush is a decent SF. We could let Ford go after next season, but we could have a formidable front line with Splitter, Duncan, Blair, and Murphy and I think they could all work together. This trade would get us younger, more scoring punch, and a key big man in Murphy. I would do this trade in a second and would pray that Indy would too.
I said this on draft night and was wrong, but I’ll say it again. I really do think we will make at least one big move this summer and that has to come sooner rather than later. There have to be numerous teams wanting TP so there’s no question we will be active on Thursday (start of Free Agency) the question is whether or not we bite on any suggested trade.
June 29th, 2010 at 7:48 am
http://projectspurs.com/2010-articles/june/parker-qhe-popovich-told-me-im-not-going-anywhereq.html
parkers’s not being traded (most likely)
June 29th, 2010 at 10:35 am
That’s a completely worthless take by Jeff Garcia of Project Spurs. Parker supposedly says he’d be very open to leaving the Spurs. Pop supposedly tells Parker that, “he’s not going anywhere”, in relation to the Portland rumors. And Jeff Garcia concludes that we shouldn’t trade Parker without even considering what we could get back that would in fact HELP THIS TEAM COMPETE!
How many times do I have to drill it into peoples heads: WE AIN’T GOING NOWHERE with our SF and shooting situation. WE AIN’T GOING NOWHERE without more size, youth, and “rim protection” in the paint. The fact is, we simply cannot adequately fill these gaps without trading a valuable piece, barring a shrewd & LUCKY deal for unloading RJ & his fat expiring contract. DROP the “big-three” idol-worship, and lets move on. If we do that, we at least have a chance at a title in the next three years. If not: low seeds, and early exits.
June 29th, 2010 at 10:59 am
Hobson13
June 29th, 2010 at 6:41 am
Thanks for the feedback on the trade proposals. I was surprised though with your “luke-warm” take on the Charlotte proposal.
“I actually don’t mind this trade too much.”
You do realize how good Wallace is, right?
18.2 ppg., 10.0 rpg., 1.5 spg., 1.0 bpg., .586 TS%, 3rd in the league in WP48, improved his 3-point shot to 37.1% last season, and was named FIRST TEAM all-defense.
In fact, I think I’d rather have Wallace than Granger because he’s a better defender. And we need to upgrade our defense, first & foremost, in my view.
Actually, I’m worried that Charlotte would balk at letting Wallace go. I tried to entice them by including the over-priced Diaw & Diop, and helping them clear major cap space for 2011. But I’m just hoping it’s enough.
Also, what do you think of the free agent list that I posted. Interested in any of them, other than Brewer & Morrow? If we end up not making a deal for a big, what do you think of the following energy/shot-blocking LOW-COST options as free agents to give us 10-15 minutes a game?:
Anthony, Amundson, Mbenga
I provided short video clips of them on this thread.
June 29th, 2010 at 11:52 am
Jim Henderson
June 29th, 2010 at 10:35 am
“That’s a completely worthless take by Jeff Garcia of Project Spurs. Parker supposedly says he’d be very open to leaving the Spurs.”
I’m inclined to agree. We have a direct quote from Parker saying he may leave (I’m putting it mildly, what he said was actually disturbing) and then we have hearsay as to what Pop may (or may not) have said. It seems more and more that Parker is actually very willing to leave. If this is true, we have to read the writing on the wall and Parker’s writing may very well say something like this: “Sure I’d love to stay in SA if they make me a HUGE offer, but otherwise I’d like to explore my options in a larger market.” I know I’m putting words in his mouth (to an extent), but it may not be that far off from the truth.
Final word on Parker: If we did some sort of sign and trade involving Parker to NY, as long as the Knicks gave him a nice extension (which they would), I think he and the Knicks would do it in a millisecond. Something to consider…
“You do realize how good Wallace is, right?”
Yes, Wallace is an animal and would make a huge impact on both ends of the floor. IMO he is a vastly underrated player since he plays for Charlotte. I did a bit more research on Augustin and think he could be a very nice young piece. I don’t think he’ll be a star, but he could be very solid and secure our backcourt for the future. Diaw and Diop are ok, but not that great. Jim, I don’t hate the trade, but I don’t love it because Parker is a better player than anything the boobcats would give us back. Wallace is good, but he is also a bit injury prone and is not as young as he might appear (he’s been in the league 9 years already).
As bad as RJ was for the Spurs last year, he really isn’t total garbage. He can still play and score as long as he plays in an uptempo system (GS would be PERFECT) where he can get a number of shots. He can’t produce on 8-10 shots/game and thats what he got for long stretches of the season. In retrospect, that’s why he was such a bad fit for the Spurs. We play relatively slow and have numerous offensive options. I say all that to make this point: While RJ is not a $15 mil/year player (obviously), he is still a very good player and can thrive in certain systems. RJ is not a washed up, used up, injury prone Tracy McGrady who only had value due to his expiring contract. Bottom line: I think we can get more for these two guys besides what the Charlotte trade nets.
June 29th, 2010 at 12:03 pm
Jim, here are the guys on that list I liked. I’m not sure we could afford them outside a sign and trade situation, but here’s the list.
J. Childress - he’s a good player who could help us out on the wings
T. Allen - Great perimeter defender
W. Bynum - Nate Robinson Jr. except cheaper
J Anthony - Best rim defender on this list. Nice athlete/shot blocker.
JJ Redick - good shooter/perimeter defender, high BB IQ
L Amundson - super pain in the ass to play. Physical defender and overall defensive pesk.
June 29th, 2010 at 3:51 pm
Good to see some trade options involving TP. I’ve been saying for a while that Tony is going to demand a big ole’ contract. What desperate team will offer a 5 year contract to Tony at age 29? There are several options. Could be a dreadful big market team or maybe a mid market who thinks he’ll get them over the hump. After this big FA period is over the NBA landscape will be much clearer.
If NY or CHI comes out of this FA period looking bad, like only getting Johnson, they might be desperate as hell to do something. There could be bigger offers for TP and all teams really gunning for the big FA’s are big market teams where Mr. Longoria would sign his extension.
June 29th, 2010 at 4:13 pm
Would NY take TP and RJ for Gallinari and future draft picks? Then we could make serious noise in the FA market with new found cap space.
June 29th, 2010 at 4:27 pm
If NY would give up next years #1 and Gallinari for TP and RJ, I would jump at it.
First, we would seriously address two problems: Shooting and Age. Our 3 pt shooting would go from a major problem, to becoming an asset. Adding Danielo and a wing such as Miller? and suddenly we can chuck it again.
If NY only gets Amare OR Johnson, they might go for this. RJ gets the up tempo style he craves. TP gets his fat contract in the biggest of markets.
June 29th, 2010 at 5:22 pm
Obviously CHI wouldn’t make an offer for TP but they would be desperate to do something big, which could lead to Parker being moved in a 3 way trade, etc…
June 29th, 2010 at 5:25 pm
Lenneezz,
NY wouldn’t want to blow their cap room on RJ. Besides, Tony and RJ make a combined $27 mil. Gallinari makes only $3 mil. The salaries have to come close to matching up. I think we can either trade RJ in a desperation trade for a decent player or in a salary cap dump for several spare parts.
June 29th, 2010 at 5:27 pm
why are so many people talking about making such huge trades for parker? we saw what a couple of pieces did to our chemistry last year and now we want to trade parker and a few other people for like half of another team. we are not getting gerald wallace or danny granger. we are all just fantasizing.
IMO the spurs shouldn’t REBUILD the team they should add pieces that could really help us. the james anderson pick was great. our shooting was really bad last year and we needed a good shooter. I think the spurs should let go of roger mason jr., and keith bogans and play Alonzo Gee and Malik Hairston (if he can get his shooting percentage higher) more. Gee shined in the minutes he played last year for Washington.
Also its most likely Tiago Splitter is coming to SA. he can help us big time with the youth we need to inject to our big men. I think that the signing of Dorell Wright and and a really good defender could help us. To me RJ did not do as bad as people are saying. of course he didnt live up to his expectations but he wasnt a shitty benchwarmer either. RJ knows the system and could have a big improvement from last year.
If we do this improvements or something like it imo we will contend for a championship
June 29th, 2010 at 5:44 pm
I think D’antoni would want RJ if the premium guys passed. But, you’re right about the salaries. It would take alot of wrangling and only a fool would take Curry.
June 29th, 2010 at 5:48 pm
Doesn’t change my premise though. A team targeting FA’s could get screwed and desparate.
What if Miami gets 3 guys? There really are only 6 premium FA’s (obviously some are more premium than others)- LBJ, Wade, Bosh, Johnson, Boozer and Dirk. MIA gets Bosh and Wade, Dirk stays in DAL or goes to PHX, CHI or NJ gets Boozer, LBJ stays in CLE. There are plenty of scenarios where some team could be very desparate.
June 29th, 2010 at 5:51 pm
Ok, what about Parker and Dice for Gali, 2011 #1 and Duhon?
June 29th, 2010 at 5:59 pm
Ya know, getting the salaries to match up isn’t that hard. Knicks sign Miller/Brewer for purpose of a trade. Or maybe even Chandler. If the teams wanted to get the trade to work, they could get it done
June 29th, 2010 at 10:39 pm
Hobson13
June 29th, 2010 at 12:03 pm
“While RJ is not a $15 mil/year player (obviously), he is still a very good player and can thrive in certain systems. RJ is not a washed up, used up, injury prone Tracy McGrady who only had value due to his expiring contract. Bottom line: I think we can get more for these two guys besides what the Charlotte trade nets.”
I agree that RJ is not a lousy player, etc. I was less upset with RJ’s offense than I was with his defense & rebounding, particularly for about the first 2/3′s of the season. If he’s on the roster this year, I do think he’ll play better. But the key for me about the Charlotte trade is: Do these pick-ups make us a better team? And I say they do, because we would become better defensively, and about the same offensively. Wallace is FIRST TEAM all-defense. Diop is a BIG, pretty solid defender in the low post. Diaw is also a VERY versatile player: is crafty enough to play the 3, 4, or 5 spot; can hit the three, can score inside, has a good handle, is an excellent passer, and is a solid defender in the low post & out on the perimeter. And here’s an excerpt from a scouting report on Augustin by ESPN’s John Hollinger:
“Augustin is a tiny guard who excels in two areas. First, he’s an outstanding spot-up 3-point shooter on the weak side, so he can occupy defenders when he’s playing off the ball. Second, he’s a slick penetrator on the pick-and-roll who uses his quickness to get to the basket.”
Now granted, Augustin is no Tony Parker: he’s nowhere near the finisher that Parker is at the rim, for example. And at this point, he’s probably even a bit weaker than Parker is defensively. That said, in the rotation with Hill, Manu, & Anderson, he could fit, and give us another weapon from behind the arc, helping to spread the floor for Manu’s wild drives into the paint!
Bottom line: with the Charlotte trade we’re getting size and defense in the post (Diop - 28 years old), one of the most versatile players in the league (Diaw - 28 years old), a speedy, young point to compliment Hill, and give us another solid 3-point threat (Augustin - 22 years old), and a guy that can do it all - defense, rebounding, scoring (Wallace - 27 years old). We’re giving up an excellent point guard, but one that can’t hit the three, and is somewhat of a liability defensively (Parker - 28 years old). A guy who never fit our system too well, coming off his worst year in the league at age 30 (Jefferson). A young guy after 2 years in the NBA that’s never made the rotation, and has not established a 3-point presence (Hairston - 23 years old). A veteran PF that has clear seen his best days, now at age 36 (McDyess).
In my view, the players we’d be acquiring in the deal would fill our needs better OVERALL than the players do that we’re giving up.
This would be our front line:
Duncan, Blair, Splitter, Diop, & the FA, Joel Anthony
Duncan - 6’11″ - 25 mpg.
Blair - 6’6″, 275 lbs. - 25 mpg.
Splitter - 7’0″ - 22 mpg.
Anthony - 6’9″15 mpg.
Diop - 7’0″, 300 lbs. - 9 mpg.
Now that’s a fundamentally sound front line that can score, and be physical in the post, rebound, & protect the rim. That is a front line that is deep & can stay fresh. If that line can work as a committee, with great teamwork and accountability, they can compete against any front court in the league.
This would be our guards & SF’s:
Hill - 6’2″ - 3o mpg. (.399 from three)
Augustin - 5’11″ - 18 mpg. (.420 from three)
Ginobli - 6’6″ - 27 mpg. (.377 from three)
Anderson - 6’6″ - 14 mpg. (.376 at OSU)
Wallace - 6’8″ - 35 mpg. (.371 from three)
Diaw - 6’9″ - 20 mpg. (.332 from three*)
(* 2 of Diaw’s last 4 years - over 41% in three)
We’re still small at the point, but everywhere else we have good size. Great combination of scoring, in the half court & in transition, three point shooting, passing, dribble penetration, defense, and rebounding (particularly Wallace). That’s a tough set of guards & wings. Of course, all the minute distribution is fluid, and is just a very crude estimate. For example some games, Diop might not play much, if at all against smaller, quicker opponents. Diaw’s, Anderson’s, & Augustin’s minutes might also fluctuate more than the others based on match-ups, and other factors.
Overall, those top eleven players, front and back courts, would be a tough team to handle, as long as the chemistry all works out. They all seem like good character guys.
“J Anthony – Best rim defender on this list. Nice athlete/shot blocker.”
If the FO is not actively looking at TP and/or RJ trade scenarios (or even if they are), do we make an offer to Anthony on or soon after July 1? We need somebody like him, and there’s not many like him that we could get for any cheaper. Why not make him an offer to have a role with a franchise that has won four titles. Make him a solid offer, but tell him that it has an expiration date (like a week). Take it or leave it. Don’t give him the opportunity to test the market too long. He’s 27 years old, never made more than the 825k he made with the Heat last year, and has a limited game. How about we offer to double his salary to 1.65 mil. (about 5 mil. over 3 years), and ask him to come play in the same front court as Tim Duncan. We’d like you to help us chase a title. See what he says. I think it’s worth a shot.
If we still want an EXTRA (in other words, signing just him would not be enough) 3-point shooter, about the cheapest I can come up with is Steve Novak of the Clippers. 27 years old, never made more than a million/per, and the reason is because he has a very limited game. Weak defender, can’t rebound, weak off the dribble. That said, he can shoot, with range at the SF spot, and his height gives him an edge (6’10″). Also, in some ways he’s a good fit for our offensive system because he’s a great “spot-up” shooter, and while not a great passer, he’s smart - does not turn the ball over - and is a good character guy. His only play-off experience with Houston in 2007-2008, he hit 2 out of his 3 three point attempts. If we’re stuck with a cheap option to fill out the roster with a shooter, he might be worth a look. He could end up earning 5 - 10 minutes per game, in case of injury to one of other top eleven
June 30th, 2010 at 3:04 am
Charlotte don’t need to clear cap spaces, at least not by trading Gerald Wallace. He’s probably better than the most of FAs in 2011 so it doesn’t make any sense to dump his salary. Charlotte do need a PG if they don’t intend to re-sign Felton, but TP is not a good option for that. He’ll likely leave when his contract expires (hard to imagine TP staying with a borderline playoff contender like the Bobcats), and the Bobcats will be left with no PG.
I like Diaw, but Diop is useless and way overpaid. There are good reasons why Larry Brown DNPed him every night over Nazr, and I can only assume Pop will do the same.
June 30th, 2010 at 3:06 am
What I meant to say was that it doesn’t make any sense to dump GW’s salary just to sign a FA who’s not really better than him.
June 30th, 2010 at 9:52 am
30 June 2010
@ Jim Henderson…
Hey Jim, First of all, I want to thank you! I’m kinda a long time reader of this site at least from last season, & I really enjoy & appreciate your blogs; your imputs & ideas! Any who, I was studying your list of your F/A’s. I like Louis Amundson, P F/C. Watching him in the playoffs really shows his blue collar mentality. I can see him, along with what he would bring, his tough physical defense to this team. He seems a little small, but effective. Also, with his existing salary, sounds like a big bang for our buck. I also like J J Redick (SG). He’s young, & posesses the same work ethic as Amundson. He’s smart, can knock down the 3′s & plays decent “D.” Now, I can see him possibly demanding a bit more cash. I also see that he was already making around 2.8 mil. Other than that, he would fit well into the Spurs’ system. As much as I enjoyed watching Tony Allen for the C’s in the playoffs; his defense & his ability to score was pretty good! Like Redick, I can see him want to demand a bit as well. Marquis Daniels, Allen’s teammate, may be of an intrest as well. It sounds as if he has some defensive skills as well. I also like Ronnie Brewer of the Grizz (SG/SF). He’s young & has some talent. Now, as for your tade to the Bobcats thingy. I like it. I’d prefer to keep Parker, perhaps. Now, Parker is good & all, don’t get me wrong, Parker fans, but the guy is pretty much one dimentional to me. You know; drive to the paint & score; depends on his speed; teardrops. He’s starting to get older now, & he needs to extend his game to making more assists; getting his teammates more involved, & he needs to extend his shooting range to where he can hit the long ball more. If TP continues on the current path for the next 2 or 3 seasons, his career may be cut short. To bring in Nando de Colo at least by next year may be the project that the F/O needs to be thinking about. Any who Jim, back to your trade possibility with Charlotte. I like most of the players you say that would come over in the trade. I’ve always envisioned Gerald Wallace in a Spurs’ uni. Niiice!! Diaw would be a real nice addition as well. Now Diop…. well…. he’s alright, and all with his size, which is a start, but Amundson…. now, he’s tha man! Jim, tomorrw will be an exiting & intresting day in the NBA world. I’m sure that the Sprus F/O is quietly looking at things & weighing the cost. I’m not a big RJ fan right now, but yes, perhaps… maybe, he will be much improved come this season, if they don’t do a trade on him. From watching this team under the POP era, for players to adjust to his system seems difficult for them & very teadious as well. I do agree that this system does not fit his style of play. He’s still a good player who could produce, if under a run & gun team, at least 20 a night. But the bottom line is it’s all going to come down to the F/O. I’m sure we all know that. This whole F/A thing has become a soap opera! Any who Jim, it’s gonna be all in the F/O’s court. They’re the ones who make those “big bucks” to decide what’s best for the organization; what’s best for the fans, yadayadayada! But any who, Jim & Spurs fans, I’m sure once the smoke clears, I don’t know about y’all, but I’m not really expecting much of a change. I can see the possibility of Splitter coming over which will be great! Whew! I would also like to see what Richards can do during the summer league. If he does well, perhaps the F/O would have a change of heart about him & want to sign him on the team. We can really use his size and ability, too, but I’m sure it’s to the Torros you gowo! But I’m sure with the signing of Spitter, after that, the $ will be funny, which means that it may become an issue. No more Bogans; no more Bonner; no more Mason! Ian may be a no more, too! But once again, don’t be suprised by what the F/O will do. I guess I’m just trying to let myself down easy as a fan. So fans, enjoy the next few days, they will be exciting! And thanks again Jim. Thanks Spurs fans for your passion for this team, & GO SPURS GO!!!
June 30th, 2010 at 12:34 pm
Sam
June 29th, 2010 at 5:27 pm
“we are not getting gerald wallace or danny granger. we are all just fantasizing.”
You can say that all you want, but explain to me why the trade proposals that I presented with Indiana & Charlotte are so “fanciful”? Those are legitimate trade proposals, and make us a better team. And by the way, don’t make the assumption that all multi-player trades/acquisitions take YEARS to effectively assimilate (they rarely work out poorly like last years moves did). Look at what Boston did in 2007-2008: they added several players: Garnett, Allen, Posey, G. Davis, P.J. Brown, and gave up several players: A. Jefferson, Delonte West, W. Szerzebiak, R. Gomes, among others, and still won the championship in their very first year. Our problems last year go WAY beyond assimilation issues.
Charles
June 28th, 2010 at 4:31 am
We’re not going to give up Parker for 2 mid-to-late 1st round picks. No way.
Ian
June 30th, 2010 at 3:04 am
“Charlotte don’t need to clear cap spaces, at least not by trading Gerald Wallace. He’s probably better than the most of FAs in 2011 so it doesn’t make any sense to dump his salary.”
But you’re getting TONY PARKER for him! Don’t you realize that Charlotte is done, with or without Wallace, without a top 8 PG?! The cap/space issue is just augmented by having Wallace in the deal. It’s not the principal reason why they put Wallace in the deal. No, that reason is Tony Parker, clear & simple.
“Charlotte do need a PG if they don’t intend to re-sign Felton….”
Felton? You think Felton’s enough at point guard for them to challenge in the East?! Really?!
“……but TP is not a good option for that. He’ll likely leave when his contract expires (hard to imagine TP staying with a borderline playoff contender like the Bobcats), and the Bobcats will be left with no PG.”
I just got through telling you that the Bobcats will have tremendous cap space in 2011 to quickly build a talented nucleus to accompany TP, Steven Jackson, Chandler, Ty Thomas, etc. They should have enough cap space to sign THREE top FA’s in 2011 (and I listed for you the options). Along with a nice contract, that’s not going to be enough to entice TP to stick around ……with a team that would clearly be a threat to the top tier in the East? You’re making a big assumption there, in my view.
“……but Diop is useless and way overpaid.”
Number one, Diop is not worthless. Overpaid, yes, but how do you think we get Charlotte to give up Wallace in this deal?! That’s one of the ways.
June 30th, 2010 at 1:01 pm
td4life
June 27th, 2010 at 5:07 pm
“I believe Sacramento would rather have one year of Dalembert and Green than one year of RJ and Hairston…..Dalembert can push the development of their other bigs….”
As I said, RJ’s contract gives them an extra three million to make sure they can sign all their key young guys: Evans, Thompson, Casspi, & Landry. That is VERY important.
As far as using Dalembert as a one-year “renta-player-coach” for their bigs? Yeah, I suppose that “could” be useful, but couldn’t RJ’s experience rub off on Casspi as well? And the Kings do have Thompson — two years of significant playing time in his first two years. He’s their starting center, and has been very productive. He could be a good mentor for Whiteside, and Cousins as well.
Bottom line: I don’t think the one-year player-coach idea should outweigh the risk of not signing all four of those players next year. It’s important for them to not let their cap get out of control. They’re not the Lakers.
June 30th, 2010 at 3:33 pm
should the spurs try to pick up Ryan Gomes as a free agent to backup RJ at SF?
June 30th, 2010 at 4:47 pm
Jim
“You can say that all you want, but explain to me why the trade proposals that I presented with Indiana & Charlotte are so “fanciful”? Those are legitimate trade proposals, and make us a better team. And by the way, don’t make the assumption that all multi-player trades/acquisitions take YEARS to effectively assimilate (they rarely work out poorly like last years moves did). Look at what Boston did in 2007-2008: they added several players: Garnett, Allen, Posey, G. Davis, P.J. Brown, and gave up several players: A. Jefferson, Delonte West, W. Szerzebiak, R. Gomes, among others, and still won the championship in their very first year. Our problems last year go WAY beyond assimilation issues.”
I wrote it wrong they are legit trade proposals but gerald wallace is the face of the bobcats so i dont think we can trade for him. Danny Granger is possible but we would need to make a big trade that would mess up chemistry. Sorry for the bad wording.
Oh yea guys I got some good news. RJ opted out of his contract.
http://www.nba.com/2010/news/06/30/spurs.jefferson.ap/index.html?ls=iref:nbahpt2
June 30th, 2010 at 4:56 pm
@Jim Henderson - On what basis do you say “Charlotte is done without a top 8 PG”? Wallace is their best perimeter defender, best rebounder, and a better fit next to Stephen Jackson who’s a ball-dominant player. They will screw themselves by trading such player for a ball dominant guard like Tony.
“RJ’s contract gives them an extra three million to make sure they can sign all their key young guys”
Of those guys you mentioned, only Landry needs a re-signing and I think Sacremento holds his bird rights so the cap space doesn’t really matter. RJ’s contract only adds 2-3 mil more to their current salary so I don’t know how his contract will help them - it will only restrict their ability to sign FAs rather than helping it. Even if they don’t intend to bring players via free agency, having more cap space always helps (a la OKC).
Having said that though, I think Dalembert is not a positive influence on Cousins or Whiteside, and the Kings would be doing themselves a favour by getting rid of him. From all I’ve heard/read about him, he’s a headcase himself with bad attitude problems.
June 30th, 2010 at 4:59 pm
@Sam - wow… so he did really opt out. Good riddance but this may have just killed any hope of winning championship next season.
Thanks RJ! You were nothing but pain in the ass for the SA franchise!
June 30th, 2010 at 6:01 pm
Sam
June 30th, 2010 at 4:47 pm
“Danny Granger is possible but we would need to make a big trade that would mess up chemistry.”
That’s a big assumption, that a big trade would mess up our chemistry (I’m sure Boston was glad you weren’t making their personnel decisions back in 2007). And if we’re going to operate on that assumption, let’s hope TP doesn’t leave through free agency next year, otherwise we’re going to be consigned to a year or more of “chemistry” problems. Now, that’s NOT a proactive approach, and it is certainly not working to grab control over one’s own destiny. Instead, operating under such an assumption is in fact an act of passively accepting the status quo ….. for as long as we can possibly encourage it, with little to no change. And maintaining such a philosophy, without even taking into account the circumstances, is doomed to fail over the long run
Ian
June 30th, 2010 at 4:56 pm
“On what basis do you say “Charlotte is done without a top 8 PG”? Wallace is their best perimeter defender, best rebounder, and a better fit next to Stephen Jackson who’s a ball-dominant player. They will screw themselves by trading such player for a ball dominant guard like Tony.”
The point guard is a very important position for most teams, particularly for those teams that don’t have a superstar at another position, or at least a few players with significant play-off experience, and demonstrated leadership (none of which the Bobcats have). The Bobcats have had a mediocre point guard for years, with Wallace in attendance, and look where it’s gotten them: a low seed, one & done exit, in a weak Eastern Conference. TP & Jackson are both “game”-type players that will do whatever it takes for a team to WIN, and that’s just what they would do together in Charlotte. Besides, perhaps you forget that Parker & Jackson were our starting back court in 2003 when we won the title. I’d say they did fine together then, and there’s no reason they couldn’t do fine together in 2010.
“RJ’s contract only adds 2-3 mil more to their current salary so I don’t know how his contract will help them..”
As I’ve already stated, in addition to RJ’s contract, we’d also be absorbing an additional year on Diop’s contract of 6 million in 2011, as well as another 9.5 million on Wallace’s. The point is, Charlotte would be setting themselves up for MAJOR cap space in 2011 with this move (similar to what NJ, NY, Chicago, & Miami are doing now).
“…….Dalembert is not a positive influence …….. from all I’ve heard/read about him, he’s a headcase himself with bad attitude problems.”
Cite your sources, or nobody can possibly take this information seriously.
“…..Thanks RJ! …….Good riddance but this may have just killed any hope of winning championship next season.”
We would have virtually no shot at winning a championship next year even if RJ stayed.
June 30th, 2010 at 7:50 pm
@Jim Henderson - I was talking about RJ to Sacramento scenario, but with RJ opting out, there’s no point in discussing the matter any further. Still, saying that RJ’s extra 3 mil allows signing of young players in Sacramento doesn’t make any sense at all. Maybe you confused their salary situation with some other team?
As for Bobcats and its players: Felton isn’t a mediocre player. Not a great one, but he isn’t that bad either. Blaming him for the franchise’s dismal records is rather short-sighted, because this franchise is still a very young franchise with not a lot of opportunity to load up on talents (and picking a guy like Morrison with #3 overall doesn’t help the cause).
I can’t recall the exact source criticizing Dalembert’s attitude (I’ve read the article after he was traded - either ESPN or Yahoo: search through their archive if you’re interested), but it said that whenever there was an opportunity, Dalembert would miss practice and didn’t seem all that passionate about playing basketball. Sounds pretty much like a guy with poor work ethics, if you ask me.
June 30th, 2010 at 7:57 pm
Found the link:
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/rumors/post/Dalembert-on-block-for-two-years-?urn=nba,250014
“”The guy did not like basketball. He showed up late, didn’t work on improving his game, and took every opportunity to stay away from the practice court,” the Inquirer opines.”
That’s the quote I was referring to.
June 30th, 2010 at 8:49 pm
Ian
June 30th, 2010 at 7:50 pm
“Still, saying that RJ’s extra 3 mil allows signing of young players in Sacramento doesn’t make any sense at all. Maybe you confused their salary situation with some other team?”
Of course it does. You know how much it’s going to cost them to resign Evans?! Dalembert’s expiring deal will only put the Kings about 4-5 million under the cap. Evans new contract alone will take that up, perhaps more, let alone resigning Casspi, Thompson, Landry, and Donte Greene, if they decide to resign him. You have to understand, Sacramento is not a BIG market team. Their owners are not going to want to get anywhere near luxury tax territory. And if things go as planned, Cousins is going to get a HUGE extension in a few years. If a large expiring deal is not what Sacramento wanted, then why did they do the deal with Dalembert? Center is not a weak spot for them, so what else would be the point of getting Dalembert other than for taking on a large expiring deal? And if that’s the strategy, RJ’s is (was) simply a larger expiring contract.
“Felton isn’t a mediocre player. Not a great one, but he isn’t that bad either.”
Mediocre is not “bad”. It’s mediocre, and that’s what he is compared to all the other starting point guards around the league. And that will simply not be enough for Charlotte to win anytime soon. And it’s not about blaming Felton; it’s just a reality.
“I can’t recall the exact source criticizing Dalembert’s attitude….”
Again, if you’re wanting to make a valid point about this, YOU need to cite a source. Otherwise, it should be treated as it is — just conjecture, and so the point is pretty much meaningless.
June 30th, 2010 at 9:08 pm
Ian
June 30th, 2010 at 7:57 pm
Okay, thanks for the link about Dalembert. That said, I’m not sure I buy the reporters take on the matter. She did not cite one source for how she actually came to the conclusions she came to. Now, overpaid is one thing, for which I concur. But just offering a disdainful “opinion” about his attitude, and that no team could really “win” with him, without any evidence is not something I’m going to jump in & buy with open arms. How did she learn about Dalembert? Simply by watching him play in the Sixer games? Did she go to their practices? Did she interview people associated with the Sixers? If she did, she should have cited sources, even anonymous sources would be better than nothing! Now, that doesn’t mean that I wouldn’t put any credence in this source. It is the Philly Inquirer, a fairly reputable paper. But the reporter was just lazy, and that just makes me a bit suspect. And by the way, this story was listed under the “rumor” section at Yahoo Sports. Got to be a little careful there.
Again though, thanks for the link. It’s better than having nothing to go on at all.
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