Friday, December 24th, 2010...6:38 am
Orlando Magic 123, San Antonio Spurs 101: Where the Spurs’ second double digit winning streak went to die
Truthfully, the Spurs’ most recent streak has shown signs of death for several games. The Magic were due for a win; the Spurs were due for a loss. San Antonio was playing its second game in less than 24 hours. This was a predictable beat down.
How did Orlando beat San Antonio so convincingly? Dwight Howard had his way with everyone (11-13, 29 points and 14 boards), the Magic collected 30 fast break points, which exceeded the Spurs’ total by a gaudy 28, and the Spurs did not make nearly as many threes (8-22) as they gave up (13-25).
The game served as a reminder that San Antonio doesn’t have it all figured out, and they’re especially in need of solutions at the defensive end of the floor. Gregg Popovich is showing his hand by continuing to test drive a zone defense in a feeble attempt to escape the horror that is San Antonio’s man-to-man. This team misses George Hill, but even with him on the floor the Spurs are a good but far from great defensive team.
One thing I appreciate about the game is Gregg Popovich’s willingness to pull the plug early. The Spurs’ old core is notoriously bad on the second half of back-to-backs (witness the loss the Clippers earlier this season) and Pop more or less through in the towel mid way through the 3rd quarter. By the 2:00 mark of the 3rd, the Spurs were down 18 points and fielding a line-up of Chris Quinn, Gary Neal, Ime Udoka, Matt Bonner and Tiago Splitter. Put differently, Tim Duncan and Manu Ginobili played 20 minutes in this game, and Tony Parker played only 25.
Had the Spurs’ second unit managed a run, Gregg Popovich may have returned his starters to floor. But he’s never been one to do everything in his power to stop the bleeding. Some nights he prefers to die quickly and he just lets the team bleed out. This was one of those nights.
42 Comments
December 24th, 2010 at 7:05 am
“Defense wins championships.”
December 24th, 2010 at 7:19 am
@ td4life
“Defense wins championships.”
+1
So all those saying we don’t need to add some SIZE to this team what are your excuses now……………We still haven’t played against Boston, Miami, Lakers, Denver at Full Strenth, Dallas at full strength…..
So we can add poor perimeter D to poor interior D. its almost impossible to fix the perimeter D - would take like 2 new additions and we would have to give up too much of our Offense - which I LIKE. But we can add a BIG and NOT GIVE UP ANY OFFENSE…….. and sure up some of our problems on the perimeter and interior at the same time……
I know we are close to the LUX tax line - so our FO will have to be creative and maybe get a 3rd team involved - but however they get it done they NEED TO GET IT DONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
December 24th, 2010 at 7:49 am
The Spurs seemed to be taking it easy against Orlando, and it should have been obvious to most what Pop was doing with his team. Just look how early the secondary was put in and how long they played. One he is taking it easy on his star players for the Champion ship where we will most likely take it. Second it keeps his team healthy as they observe the new Orlando trades to see how they played so when we play them again we can surprise them with the same beat down but when it counts. Spurs are a smart team and when other teams and folks get big headed off a win like yesterday they forget about the strategy or reasoning behind each move. Orlando can enjoy the “victory” but we still hold the best record in the league and we will win the Champion ship this year. Plus we continue to play our secondary they will continue to be an assist when our older guys retire.
December 24th, 2010 at 7:53 am
There is still 53 games left in the season. A lot of time to get better defensively.
Will the Spurs be a great defensive team like years past? I don’t think so. But they can be a good one and being able to get stops in the guts of a ballgame is of more importance to me as the season goes along.
But please let’s not overreact to an early season blowout (1st one so far) loss on a back-to-back game.
December 24th, 2010 at 8:14 am
@marion
I agree with you about not over reacting to one loss. To much is being made of a single loss in the regular season. This was the second night of a back to back right before christmas. Also a good point is that it is our only blow out so far in 29 games. Every team will have an off night here or there. We are also missing our key guy off the bench. Hill adds so much to our offense and defense. He may be a bench player in name, but his importance is as valuable as a starter. It is okay to lose every once in a while. 1 out of 11 is acceptable to me. It makes you go back and reassess what you did to get to the win streak so that you can play even better. Go Spurs Go.
December 24th, 2010 at 8:18 am
There are only 8 teams in this league that can reasonably hope to beat SA on a given night….. that’s why SA has the best record…… Of the NBA’s Elite - we have played very few and fewer still at 100%…… remember that…..
December 24th, 2010 at 8:58 am
@TD = best ever
Don’t try to force feed me the strength of schedule crap. The lakers have the easiest schedule, why don’t they have the best record?
The spurs have the best record in the league because they focus for each game (mostly, ahem clippers.) They have also shown that they can make deep playoff runs, especially with this core. And to top it all off we have the best bench we have ever had when it comes to draining buckets.
So don’t give me, or anyone else on this blog, the “they haven’t played a contender yet” speech, and don’t use this game in particular as a catalyst for more “trade Tiago for a better big” propaganda.
Not meaning to attack anyone, I know that post sounded angry. My outlook on the day is very much influenced by the spurs performance the previous night.
December 24th, 2010 at 9:35 am
@ tdforlife & TD = Best EVER:
In the long run you both are 100% correct. Last night, I think Pop felt after 3 games the Magic may have gotten all the new players somewhat tuned in to what they wanted to do offensively and decided to just run with them to see will they ‘click’ offensively. Well, a desire to stop their losing (8 out of last 9) a home game and the Spurs poor D allowing 34 & 35 pt. quarters= blowout. Let’s finish 2010 with 3 wins, then we can wake up New Year’s Day and see what we can do in the remaining 50 games. Happy Holidays.
December 24th, 2010 at 9:40 am
i was half-tempted to scratch an “L” on our schedule before this one even started. this orlando team could be dangerous if gil starts playing like agent zero and d 12 makes his free throws the way he did last night. splitter bodied up with him well and he, quinn, and neal did spark a run that forced stanvan to put his starters back in the 4th quarter. orlando is supposedly thin up front despite having the best big in the league. maybe guys like tim and splitter could attack dwight in the low block and draw fouls. getting him in foul trouble might be the best way to combat his presence. next up- the washington wall-zards
December 24th, 2010 at 10:01 am
If ever there was a loss to be had THIS were to be expected.
If Any person thinks the Spurs are going to magically win every game of the season…you are living in a dream world.
Orlando IS better than their record indicates at this time. And probably just got better as a team with the recent trade. They are a top 10 team in this league. AND for those that DON’T think a b2b on the road against a premier team would warrant a difficult task in winning is expecting a utopian outcome regarding this team.
I appreciate all the fandom and expectation of wanting a “perfect” season. But the facts are what they are. The Spurs have so far done an amazing job a securing wins they probably had no business winning.
Losing to Orlando in this game is not a fault of players or coaches. It just so happens to be fact of what many other teams in this same scenario would have probably done under the exact same circumstances.
It’s done…the Spurs actually lost a game. Boo Hoo! (Other losses to come this season as well)
I’ll take the record they have. Look forward to improvement. And might even remind some later this season that this loss is or was not as disappointing as some want to make it to be.
2 days rest. Washington game. Another 2 days rest…LA. Another 2 days rest…Mavs.
I look forward to a different team that played in Orlando last night. They deserve that optimism. They’ve proved to be able to beat good teams. There shouldn’t be any fear they can’t start another winning streak.
Get back to me after the next few games and rant the negative vibes.
December 24th, 2010 at 10:08 am
As spursfanbayarea said, losing 1 game out of 11 is not bad and it forces us to assess our weaknesses.
As the saying goes, we learn more from our mistakes than from our successes.
As much as I hate seeing the Spurs lose, I hate seeing them get injured even more. When win streaks get too long, its natural to over-exert the starters to try to preserve the streak (see KG ’08-’09).
Also long streaks attract attention from the rest of the league and the media.
Pop played this one perfect, a loss on a back to back against a hungry team that was too new to scout. Our bench got plenty of burn, which is a huge plus in the big picture.
Now that the Spurs are 15-1 with Quinn in the game, its probably ok to give him his due without fear of jinxing him. Dude’s been such a solid and unheralded pick-up.
As for Orlando, they looked great. Turkoglu’s past success was based on him being a ball-handler and having Howard as a pick and roll partner. JRich is a huge upgrade from VC. There is no reason that Ryan Anderson can not provide the same meaager production as Rashard Lewis could provide (he was just rotting on the bench). Arenas provides the team with the ideal sixth man. All they need is a back-up center and they’re dialed. Surprised Earl Barron wasn’t included in the deal.
December 24th, 2010 at 10:16 am
Same thing happened last year. Back-to-back against the Magic and the MAgic blew out the Spurs. This loss and they way they lossed did not surprise me at all. This was one of the losses that I marked on my schedule.
And guess what I already marked that first game against Boston as a possible loss too. It’s on a back-to-back.
Of course they need to improve defensively. But they didn’t lose this one because of bad D. They lossed because they just didn’t want it at all. They came out like they came out against the Clippers. Only TP came out strong. Plus like the article says, the Magic were due. It was the perfect storm. A new look team was due vs. the team with the best record, that didn’t care if they lossed a back-toback game against a team they already beat.
They’ll play good D when it counts. Like they did in the previous game against Denver. They held them to 14 points in the 4th quarter because they were actually trying
Tuesday is the big game.
December 24th, 2010 at 10:37 am
Ehh I’d rather lose to a revamped Magic team on the 2nd game of a back to back on the road by 20, than lose by 20 to a Milwaukee team without its franchise point guard at home. (I’m looking at you Lakers)
December 24th, 2010 at 11:04 am
@Bentley
+4
Haaaaaaaaa
Loved seeing Kobe get unhinged (too bad he had a case). Boykins is my new hero.
December 24th, 2010 at 11:15 am
@ junierizzle
We didn’t play good D against DENVER - We played a ZONE and Denver didn’t MAKE OPEN SHOTS - that’s not good D - That’s DODGING A BULLET………… And its he same reason why the MAVS have NEVER and WILL NEVER win a title……
& @Matt in OC
Strength on Schedule does matter - That’s why there have been like 5 teams go on 8,9, or 10 game winning streaks and we are only 1/3 thru the season……And as far as the Lakers - they are not built for the regular season as much as they are for the playoffs - So no matter how much they struggle now - they will be ready when it matters which is why we need to make a trade to Keep that # 1 SEED throughout the Playoffs……
But I agree with you about not trading Splitter - he has shown some signs - but I don’t think he will be enough still - He doesn’t strike me as a Defensive Stopper / Shot blocker / and that’s what the SPURS NEED
December 24th, 2010 at 11:33 am
I had a feeling the win streak was going to die last night. The magic were due cause they are too good of a team to loose 8 out of the last 9. Also the spurs had a long winning streak and were traveling to Orlando on a back to back. Also NBA scheduling is so weird, the Mavs last played on the 21st and next play on the 27th. They basically just got a weeks vacation in season.
December 24th, 2010 at 11:45 am
Good idea: Rest the big 3 on a night you’re almost certain to lose, against a team that is premier but unknown quantity and hungry as heck for a win, road/segababa/etc., and most importantly,
with the only 2 WC teams relevant to the spurs’ title hopes BOTH on the schedule next week.
no brainer
December 24th, 2010 at 12:19 pm
TD=B.E.:
“to fix the perimeter D – would take like 2 new additions” - perhaps Hill and Anderson?
While you keep suggesting that a big should be traded for, I can’t recall that you’ve ever suggested a workable trade. The only player the Spurs could trade for without giving up players would be one that earns a minimum salary (the Spurs could use a draft choice or cash and one trade exception). If the Spurs should trade players, they’d have to trade away sufficient salaries to match the incoming salary. Trading away one minimum salary player can only get you back one minimum salary player. So did you want to trade Bonner, Tiago, Dice or some other key player?
I don’t disagree that it might be helpful to have one more good big, but if it is to be someone good enough to be a starter or the first big off the bench you have to be willing to get rid of some key player(s). The only current Spur starter that the Spurs seem likely to consider parting with might be Blair, but as I don’t expect they could find anyone that would be an improvement for the same salary that seems unlikely.
If you want to continue to go on saying the Spurs need another big, please tell us what how exactly you would remake the team to get the big you’d like (seeing as how none of your past proposals would actually work).
December 24th, 2010 at 12:56 pm
@ Daniel T
Anderson id not a good Defender my any stretch on the imagination….. And getting back Hill would help but wouldn’t have made much difference these last 2 games because we were abused by Big 2 guards these past 2 games….
As far as a workable trade - WHY Do I need to be the one to come up with it - That’s what the FO gets paid to do - and If we need a contract over 2 million - Im willing to give up Bonner - he have a ton of shooters as it is and can get by w/o him just fine……. plus we can save some money
December 24th, 2010 at 3:11 pm
@TD = Best Ever
Anderson not a good defender? He was voted by his own peers as the best defender going into the draft.
LOL at your negative cognitations without proof of evidence.
You are a ranter. A person without ability to issue means to your thoughts.
The suggestion of coming up with a solution to your hypothesis was not a challenge but a question to as how you would make the changes you suggest.
Perhaps it’s a good thing you don’t make the decisions for this team.
December 24th, 2010 at 3:31 pm
TD=B.E.
I asked you for your opinion as you seem to get demanding at times with your CAPS frenzy:
“they NEED TO GET IT DONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!”
That sounded as though you feel they should do something now, though elsewhere you say:
“BUT DURING THE OFF SEASON”.
I’m not sure if that just means no wholesale changes at this point, while you still want to add one big now. If you do want to add a big, you do “NOT GIVE UP ANY OFFENSE”, though you would be “willing to give up Bonner”.
You seem fine with “TIM and DICE when he gets his customary 10 min/game”, and agree with “not trading Splitter”.
That pretty well narrows it down, you think the F.O. that this off-season signed Bonner to a 4 year contract should wise up and trade him. I don’t expect that to happen, and while they have plenty of other shooters they don’t have a big that spreads the floor like Matt.
I’m pretty much in agreement with you that it would be a good thing for the Spurs to get bigger. I haven’t made up my mind if while being good it is a necessary thing. To get anyone worthwhile would seem like it would require blowing up the team in a fashion similar to Orlando. That would seem drastic for a team with the best record in the league at the moment. It would be nice to add a piece without losing a piece, if the FO were actually able to pull a rabbit out of the hat.
December 24th, 2010 at 3:34 pm
@TD=
First of all, I tend to disagree with your view on James Anderson… I don’t know what games you saw but from what I can remember the guy hustles on defense now, for a rookie, id say he is average to an above average defender… he hits the open shots makes some good passes and even gets back to contest shots at the basket when beat… if he’d be playing right now I’m sure all of us hear would be congratulating the front office for drafting another hidden gem..
Now back to the trading talk again…. not to pick on you but if your willing to trade Matt bonner to get another big, I just don’t know if its possible… Matt is on contract for the next 2-3 years, I seriously doubt any other team would want to trade for him… the only players that would possibly be able to be traded to get somethin of value in return would be a combination of Blair, mcdyess, a draft pick and one of our reserves. Blair gives you a potential double double guy , mcd provides veteran leadership plus an expiring contract and well a future first pick… that’s only about 5 mil combined… so if you can get another 7ft shot blocker to bully D. Howard, P. Gasol, K.G., A. bynum etc. I’m sure everybody would like to see that happen but its just not realistic without having to give up T.P manu R.j or hill… the best we can all hope for is Tiago splitter which as of now doesn’t look too bad
December 24th, 2010 at 4:00 pm
@ Johnny.
The Mavs actually had a tough back to back and have “played” better quality competition up to this point. They didnt get a week vacation. They come back and play OKC, while the NBA let the Spurs off the hook with a game at Washington. Look at the current schedule. Don’t rag on the MAVS because they are currently better at this point. All what matters is who is performing best at the end of the year.
December 24th, 2010 at 4:32 pm
We were not going to win every game from here on out. Let’s get that out of the way. So far ALL of our nationally televised games have been the BACK END of back to backs. They want the Spurs to look old. Half of our losses were in these nationally televised games, hence people not taking us for real. The refs decided they weren’t going to call another foul on Dwight after the 1st quarter. Tim got hacked by him 3 consecutive possessions but no whistle. Those of you talking that schedule BS I pose this question: has Boston played the Lakers or Spurs? It is being suggested that since we haven’t played Boston or LA we can’t be as good as our record indicates. They haven’t played us or each other yet either! Dallas gave us a legitimate loss which I say gives them a slight edge in terms of playing and beating the best, but no one else has done so. We will avenge our loss on Thursday (our 3rd straight TNT game) after having kicked the Lakers ass and even then we will get no respect until we beat Boston. Funny how things work out.
December 24th, 2010 at 4:37 pm
I dislike how the refs didnt call the foul on Dwight when he hacked Tim. Wtf. Seriously the nba refs sometimes can be so inconsistent…
December 24th, 2010 at 5:39 pm
@ rob
I don’t care what his peers said - I remember what the scouts said about him - and that was a GREAT scorer that needed to work on his individual and help D…… So its obvious that you are a box score fan who knows nothing about Basketball other than a few headlines or something……..
@ Daniel T - I was saying that players don’t improve all that much during the season…… but the off season……
And again to everyone - Its not just me saying we need to add another piece - Have you been to nba.com or espn.com or any other basketaball website……. Why do all the analysts and scouts say the same thing - ARE THEY ALL WRONG and YOU’RE RIGHT…. highly unlikely…… They are paid very well to break down talent and teams and they all have us 1 piece short.
Also Tony Dungy once said that he would much rather be the FAVORITE rather than the UNDERDOG. Stating that this usually mean you are the better team in the eyes of the scouts and analysts. Who are usually right - or at least better informed that the fans
December 24th, 2010 at 6:59 pm
@TD = Best Ever
I think J.A.’s D can improve, but his D was definitely better - from watching the few games he played and from reading - that most people expected.
I’m one of those that think that we’re one or two pieces short from being the favorites i.e. A big, and a sf defender. I’m also one of those who’s bigger than on the Spurs than most i.e. the experts and general consensus before the season started because of rest and health for Manu and Parker, practice time during the offseason for Parker, Hill, Blair, and Rj, and year 2 for Blair, RJ, and Dyess. I think with the current construction of the team that our championship aspirations will be determined by how much we improve defensively and offensively from now till the playoffs. Namely defense, Blair, Splitter, J.A., and everyone’s improvement. If everyone from 1-13 all improve 5% individually, our team improves by 65% by this twisted logic math
December 24th, 2010 at 7:02 pm
@ TD = Best Ever.
I normally don’t reply on boards but your arguments are laughable at best. You take the opinions of OVER paid “experts”. The same “experts” that make bold predictions such as “The New Orleans Hornets are the team of the future” (Yeah… Maybe if the year was 2008), “The Dallas Cowboys are going to the Super Bowl this year and win it” (How did that turn out…), and “The NBA better watch out for the Thunder this year.” “Experts” are no different from fans. They watch games, look at stats and make predictions based on the information they gathered.
One last thing… You still haven’t mentioned who, how or when you would trade for your magical, 7 foot shot blocker with night vision, dual super charger and photon torpedoes.
December 24th, 2010 at 7:07 pm
TD=B.E.
Is your opinion on Anderson’s defense based on what scouts said going into the draft versus watching him play yourself? Which of his games as a Spur did you feel he did a bad job on defense?
What deals are the scouts and analysts suggesting the Spurs should make to acquire a big? I expect they might be saying that the Heat need a better center and point guard, Orlando needs a backup center, etc. etc. Everybody could potentially be better, the question is whether it is possible to make a deal to improve at one spot without getting worse at another. Scouts and analysts don’t have to worry about making deals, and you don’t seem too concerned about how you’d make such a deal yourself. Great to have you aboard as a scout, but what could you do as a GM?
December 24th, 2010 at 7:09 pm
TD = Best Ever
“So its obvious that you are a box score fan who knows nothing about Basketball other than a few headlines or something……..”
Again…LOL at your response. You are the one that doesn’t know jack squat about BB. I’ll admit I’m no scholar about basketball. But at least I TRY to make acqusations based on reality instead of fly by night…off the top of my head…irrational decisions.
And I’ve been proven wrong several times…and have admitted to those instances because I want the truth to be formulated. But you don’t want to accept truth for what it is. You just want to be a ranting maniac. Only open to your negative perspective about a quality, superior driven team that strives to be the best it can be. And when a loss occurs (as it will with any team) you decide that this team doesn’t have the ability to overcome a situation.
Would it not be best that you base your fandom on the Kings? At least they wouldn’t disapoint your negative cognitations.
December 24th, 2010 at 7:44 pm
@ TD = B.E.
Your tone is a bit Jim Hendersonish. Last night we got lit up on the perimeter. Not so much the paint. We actually out rebounded the Magic. This trade you suggest for another big is not a good idea. Let’s just allow POP some latitude in suring up the rotations. I mean we are 25-4 he hasn’t done a bad job so far.
December 24th, 2010 at 8:10 pm
Sorry Rob been A SPURS fan since Jordan retired the 1st time…..And yes I have admitted to be wrong about several things if you read my posts….. Most of them have been about trades that I thought could work only to find out that they CANT…..but whatever…..
@ Daniel T
Yes I have watched him play D this year and I never said he was BAD - just not good enough to really shut down or limit a scores effectiveness….. Right now I would put him on par or just a little lower than RJ……
Wing defenders in the League by tiers
A’s - Artest-when his head is in right, Prince when motivated.
B’s - James Posey, Shane Battier, Matt Barnes, Tony Allen, Manu and Indy G….. If George were 2 inches taller he would be an A
C’s = Average - Kobe, Wade, LBJ etc - this is also where I would put Parker and RJ below them……
There are a ton of people that I left out but W/O an A somewhere on your team - you needs either all B’s or what the Celtics have - ALL BIGS to cover up for it - how else do you think a team with Ray Allen and Paul Pierce can be ranked in the TOP 3 in D for so long……. It’s way to hard to get an A list wing defender these days - and I don’t think our C’s will ever become B’s this year…… A BIG can solve our problems
Ask yourselves - IF we play Denver 10 times - Both teams at full strength - How many times would we win…….. And then ask yourselves do you think Denver is a title contender this year??
Remember The 1st Denver game they were w/o Martin, Billups and Anderson and 2nd game W/O Melo and they still gave us fits…… So lets pretend both teams are 100% healthy and we might win 6 out of 10 right now and maybe 4 out of 7 in a series
December 24th, 2010 at 8:17 pm
@ Bankshot21
just joined the board recently and have no idea who Jim is…… Although I did read a post where someone talked about him being banned because he killed the mood or something - what ever that means……And if you have been following the chat the last month or two you would notice I have been on the SPURS need another BIG bandwagon for a while. So If Jim got kicked out for suggesting trades then I guess I too will be gone soon.
December 24th, 2010 at 9:36 pm
Hi,
The Magic game exposed the issue an “undersized” Spurs squad will keep facing. With defensive intensity blunted, shots need to be made at a fairly high rate of efficiency to eke out the wins. Good defensive teams are able to win with a scoring efficiency of 43-45%, if they have a good defensive system in place. Alowing, Magic close to 59%, just leads to the thrashing which Spurs received last night.
Given the luxury tax constratints and the need to know the know the “system” this is the squad we have for the season. Let’s pray that the shots keep going in. Merry x’mas to 48 MoHers. Hope 2011 brings Spur fans more joy than 2010.
December 24th, 2010 at 10:17 pm
Alrighty Spurs fans, I don’t know about you, but I don’t anticipate seeing any trades this season. Pop mentioned in an article that I read recently, that he & the FO had decided that this wasn’t going to happen this season, & so far, thay have pretty much stuck to their guns on that. I’m factoring this in due to money & the salary cap crap. Also, team chemistry. Adding Splitter, Anderson, Neal & Quinn to the mix has REALLY helped to give us a bit deeper bench. Personally, I would have loved to have had Temple to work out . Oh well. Any who, here’s a senario that MIGHT work, but I don’t think it will get pulled off, & that’s to have Marcus Cousins come down from Austin, perhaps around Rodeo time, althouth, sooner would be better. Right now, he’s giving the Torros, double/doubles. He should be getting used to the Spurs system & COULD contribute right away, PERHAPS. And IF it did happen, come playoff time, put Ime Udoka in a suit, as insurance. This would be nice if this would work out, because we would have another big for cheap, but I don’t see it happening either. Ladies & Germs, I truly believe, “what cha see is what cha get!” The bottom line is, there is MUCH room for improvement, especially on the defensive side, but moreso on the front court end. Cousins may be able to help a bit. At least you have another big out there, although his EXPERIENCE is lacking for playing in the NBA, according to Pop’s standards. Once Hill & Anderson return, this may help solidify our defense a bit better. I wonder if Pop will go to the zone defense more since he has had sucess so far with it. Hmmm! Well, as we can see, back-to-backs are just not in the cards for the Spurs, so perhaps we may anticipate a “L,” especially when it comes to playing against a mediocre to high level team, perhaps on either end, if not at both ends. Granted, the season is long, & I believe that the Spurs are going to pick their battles in order to savor Tim & the rest of the Big Three for the playoffs, but at the same time, should one be concerned about standings & homecourt advantage? It’s like damned if you do & damned if you don’t. Oh well, GO SPURS GO & GIT ONE 4 THA THUMB!!!
December 24th, 2010 at 11:04 pm
TD = Best Ever
Your assertions are really not based in reality, and your arguments follow no logic.
You called somebody a “box score fan” who knows nothing beyond headlines in the same sentence where you base your entire argument on the mere fact that you read a scouting report. Are you for real?
“I don’t care what his peers said – I remember what the scouts said about him…… So its obvious that you are a box score fan who knows nothing about Basketball other than a few headlines or something……..”
You said that. You actually said that. How you can hold two wildly incongruous thoughts at the same time and not be troubled the least by the break in logic is just beyond me. You truly embody the parable in Luke 6:41: “Why do you see the speck in your neighbor’s eye, but do not notice the log in your own eye?”
You say that the analysts and scouts are surely better informed than the average fan. Yet it doesn’t seem to even occur to you that the coaches and other personnel that work with the players day in and day out, seeing all that takes place behind closed doors where analysts and scouts have no access, must be even better informed than any scout, tv analyst, or column writer. Maybe their decisions and actions, or judicious inaction, are the result of this better information to which others are not privy. Maybe if the analysts knew what the FO knows, they would change their analyses.
You think it’s the FO’s job to find your trade. Have you considered that maybe the FO has looked long and hard and found none that work? If you can’t offer a plausible trade scenario, what has you convinced that there is one to be had?
And who says that the FO sees things the way you do? For all I know, the FO doesn’t believe shot blocking is the biggest issue with this team. Maybe they do, and maybe they don’t. I don’t pretend to know what they believe. But I’m pretty sure they know what they believe and are acting accordingly. If they haven’t sought out a trade, then it’s probably because they don’t believe it is their best course of action.
“Have you been to nba.com or espn.com or any other basketaball website……. Why do all the analysts and scouts say the same thing – ARE THEY ALL WRONG and YOU’RE RIGHT…. highly unlikely…… They are paid very well to break down talent and teams and they all have us 1 piece short.”
As Daniel T asked, Tell me what trades have these same analysts and scouts proposed for the Spurs? They haven’t. The analysts and scouts know that there is no feasible trade in the works for San Antonio. They are simply pointing out a weakness they see in this team. None of them have proposed any trades.
Which is more likely: that the Spurs organization with its pedigree of good decision making and successful championship building has suddenly decided to not do its job of exploring all possible trade scenarios and putting out the best team possible, or that one armchair fanatic is wrong and stubbornly pulverizing a dead horse beyond all recognition?
This does not need to be said, but I’ll say it anyway for the sake of everyone else here who is thinking the same thing: I’ll put my money on the Spurs management. I think they know something about basketball. Call me crazy.
December 24th, 2010 at 11:15 pm
Chitown
Now this I’m willing to listen to. Signing Marcus Cousins is actually within the realm of possibility.
Tell us why you think he would be a good fit for this year’s team? Was he present in training camp? I don’t remember. Wasn’t he cut after last season’s training camp? Has he improved enough since then to warrant another look a third of the way into the season? What problems could he fix for this year’s roster? I mean, obviously he would be another big body, but what does he bring to the table that fits our current needs?
December 25th, 2010 at 1:13 am
Owned.
BTW no way that’s Jim. Different logic.
December 25th, 2010 at 7:53 am
@ NYC
“Yet it doesn’t seem to even occur to you that the coaches and other personnel that work with the players day in and day out, seeing all that takes place behind closed doors where analysts and scouts have no access, must be even better informed than any scout, tv analyst, or column writer.”
When you find ONE article where POP or one of our coaches have said Differently then I will withdraw My statement…….. BUT YOU CAN’T SO I will not have to………. It seems like most people just argue for the sake of arguing……. JA is not a horrendous defender - her puts in the effort, much like RJ, but its just not his strong suit at this point. Its like you guys have been watching another team or something - When did JA become BRUCE BOWEN like….. Before or After foot surgery…….. Because I know it wasn’t before…….. Or if there’s a game that I missed and he played very well, please tell me what game it was……
“And who says that the FO sees things the way you do? For all I know, the FO doesn’t believe shot blocking is the biggest issue with this team. Maybe they do, and maybe they don’t.”
Read the entire post it will tell you that Many Objective people around the NBA say the same. And once again - the analyst are usually right when it comes to who the Best team is and what it takes to beat them….. EVEN Jesse or Tim said so in DDL Chat on Thursday - which of course no one read because you were all too busy making up the excuses as to why we lost. As oppose to trying to find and correct the real weakness of this team so that MY MAIN MAN TIMMY can get number 5………
@ Everyone
Find me ONE example of the kind of turn around in mid-season that everyone keeps speaking of…. There are only so many quirks you can do with the players you have DURING THE SEASON… Otherwise we would have done better LAST SEASON…….Remember getting swept by the SUNS!! RJ and Indy G are great examples of getting alot better during the OFF SEASON - But i can’t think of anyone getting that much better during a year, Can you?
@ ChitownSpursfan
Great points made - Hopefully the SPURS are looking into bringing him up for a 10-day contract and seeing what he can do…… Remember BIG’s don’t need to know our system all that well if they understand the basic principle of help D and they hustle…….
December 25th, 2010 at 11:36 am
Marcus Cousin was around for training camp and most of the preseason games, and more often than not got a DNP-CD or a few minutes. What time he did get was largely due to the fact that Tiago missed all of the pre-season with an injury, and games like the Cleveland game when many of the regular starters did not even travel with the team.
Marcus is not exactly tearing up the dleague. His better games have come against teams that haven’t had a true center in their lineup, and he has struggled more against the likes of Dexter Pittman, Cole Adrich and Lance Allred.
While the Spurs could add Marcus to the NBA roster, I think they’d leave him in Austin rather than have him sit around in San Antonio. Pop seems to have a hard time finding minutes for Splitter, I doubt he’d even try giving time to Cousin when he didn’t give him that much time in the preseason.
One of the “quirks” that you can do with the players you have during the season is to use them. Neither Anderson or Tiago have had a chance to play much yet due to their early injuries. Often times an injury to one player has presented an opportunity for another to show Pop what he can do, Neal likely would not have gotten as much time if it weren’t for injuries to Anderson and Hill.
Personally I feel that the Spurs often improve late in the year while using the same roster throughout. It seems almost an annual event for Pop to say what a lousy defense he has that year and then the team gels and plays better. I have a much more difficult time trying to think of when a mid-season addition helped the team much. Was Kurt Thomas much of a help in the 07-08 season, or Drew Gooden in the 08-09 season? It didn’t seem like it to me.
Express-News columnist (does that qualify him as an analyst) writes in this morning’s paper about Tiago:
“Once the Spurs figure out how to best use him, their front-line should enjoy a significant in-season boost”.
Merry Christmas all!
December 25th, 2010 at 11:42 am
@ NYC:
Cousins was in preseason, but was cut & then sent up to the Toros to keep & develop. That would be nice for the FO to call him down, even if it was for 10 days, as TD says, & let’s see what he has, & if he could fit in. Marcus seems to be athletic & has some promise as a big man. If this is not the year for him, them perhaps, we all can only hope to see him next year as a Spur, depending upon his development.
December 27th, 2010 at 8:38 am
@TD=Best Ever “Anderson id not a good Defender my any stretch on the imagination…..”
@TD=BestEver ” Yes I have watched him play D this year and I never said he was BAD – just not good enough to really shut down or limit a scores effectiveness”
Ok, I’m going to try to decipher “id” and “my” (not to mention “sure up the defense”…shudder…), but I believe you did say he was bad. Relax and breathe deep. Walk away from the computer and come back when you’ve calmed down…There, doesn’t that feel better?
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