Report: Spurs Shopping McDyess (Updated)
According to Adrian Wojnarowski of Yahoo! Sports, the Spurs are looking to trade Antonio McDyess in anticipation of trading for Tyrus Thomas:
The Spurs have been searching for expiring deals to move McDyess, who will make $4.9 million next season and is guaranteed about $2.6 million in 2011-12. Trading McDyess would free minutes and give them greater flexibility to re-sign Thomas this summer if they want. Thomas would give the Spurs a younger, more athletic complement to Tim Duncan, and could be part of a future frontline with former first-round pick Tiago Splitter and rookie DeJuan Blair.
Woj’s analysis seems to hit the nail on the head. If were to trade for (and re-sign) Thomas, as well as sign Splitter, the frontcourt might not have enough minutes to go around. Although McDyess has had his critics amongst Spurs fans this season, I’m a defender of his, and Tim Varner may present some evidence over the next day or two suggesting the Spurs have been at their best when he and Duncan are on the floor together.
Nonetheless, a de facto replacement of McDyess by Thomas would reflect the long term, youth-oriented thinking I’ve been a proponent of recently. Depending on whom McDyess is traded for, it also gives the Spurs more financial flexibility headed into this summer, as the team would no longer be responsible for the $7.5 million McDyess is guaranteed for the remainder of his contract.
Woj throws out the Denver Nuggets as a team with which McDyess would fit smoothly, but names no other potential trade partners.
N.B. Our last two posts have cited reports by Adrian Wojnarowski. The NBA is always ridden with unsubstantiated rumors in the days leading up to the trade deadline, but we do not believe either of these reports are exemplary of that journalistically irresponsible atmosphere. Woj is a good reporter and both Tim and I believe there are good reasons to take these reports seriously.
Update: The Express-News is reporting that multiple league sources have said the Spurs are not shopping McDyess but “they are in a listening mode in advance of Thursday’s deadline.”
Such a move is almost indicative of giving up on this season in favor of the future. Whether you like Thomas or not, it’s safe to say that having him as the 2nd -3rd best big man on this team is not going to result in a deep playoff run this season (not that it’s a given with the current roster anyway, but at least McDyess is a veteran and was in training camp this year). No matter Thomas’ upside, he can’t reach in a few short months while trying to learn a new system. But long term, it may be the way to go…
I like McDyess, but I like moving his contract better.
If we don’t look desperate now, then we never have. This is horrible. What happend? This was going to be the team we all hoped for and they have struggled. But i like McDyess and Mason Jr alot a think they are a better team with them. Dyess cause he can get boards and hustles {although old}. Mason has come and gone but he is still good. We need to get rid of Finely, Ian, and maybe bogans. We need young bigs down low. We need to get younger and faster and more aggressive. Attack and defend. More of both. But i like to keep some of our good players like these two and get rid of the fading star’s.
Actually this trade would not necessarily indicate giving up on this season. The defensive rotation scheme wouldn’t really affect Thomas – he would be free to just switch and try to block shots. The complicated part of the Spurs defense is all the rest of the players rotating (in sync) to cover the man Thomas is going to leave when he contests the shot. This is why Nazr Mohammed could be added mid-year without too much trouble – he was free to follow his instincts, it was the rest of the Spurs who were having to know how to make their rotations.
This is also why I’m not really that concerned about integrating Thomas into the Spurs defensive concepts – Thomas’ only job, really, is to react to what’s going on and protect the rim.
The problematic part is going to be offense, but since he’s not going to be the focal point of the offensive flow anyway, it might work out.
I completely disagree with the notion that the spurs are giving up the season by acquiring Thomas, and trading out McD. This is definitely a youth-infusion movement, but this also helps add more athleticism in depth up in the middle that they’ve been seriously lacking in the season. They obviously must feel comfortable about the players they’ve got up front, in order to make a deal like this happen–as this opens the door more minutes to other players in an area that was previously crowded (I’m still high on Mahinmi—who knows, maybe getting McD out could be the best thing for him). Now, McDyess hasn’t been setting off fireworks with consistent play throughout the season. Thomas is young, has a good defensive presence, and can still make an impact on the team, if placed in a role he can commit to. The team doesn’t expect him to grasp the complete system, only areas in which he feels confident with him excelling in—just as confident the spurs must feel in dealing for the young man. Overall, i like the feel of this deal (if and when it happens).
I just thought I should add that I actually think McDyess has played pretty well (especially lately, when he’s been great) – so I’m sort of ambivalent about moving him.
I know the RC/Pop tandem is supposedly the best front office in the league, but how did they completely strike out this off season? They made FIVE acquisitions that have really, really disappointed (Jefferson, Dice, Bogans, Ratliff, Haislip). The only move to be applauded now is drafting Blair. But really, 1 out of 6 is horrible. 1 out of 6 just plain sucks.
Blazers just traded for Camby, a trade which make it look like the Spurs could have had him in exchange for Bonner and Mason and maybe Mahinmi, which I think we all would have LOVED for this season, gaining a shot blocker and one of the best help defenders in the game today. Camby probably has 2-3 productive seasons following this one… Oh, well.
Can Ty Thomas become a GREAT help defender? If so I say go for it, although McD isn’t a piece I’m dying to move. We need to build for the future, Dallas and, now, Portland (on paper at least) have 2 of the 4 best rosters in the NBA (not counting Cleveland, Denver, or any of the teams that may yet might upgrade talent this week, such as Houston trading Tracy for Iggy and Dalembert. The Spurs need to shake things up to compete with the elite in the West.
I don’t think these moves (if they should happen) would mean the spurs are giving up. The timing to me says it’s a response to the Mavs and the Blazers, both of whom just completed deals that brought size and defense in hopes of getting somewhere in the West.
We only see bits and pieces of the front office’s plan, and we don’t know what’s true and what’s not. I do expect the Spurs are trying to get something together and it will likely involve acquiring a big man. But since we only have to wait until Thursday at the latest to find out looking at this too closely is a waste of brainpower.
Whatever happens with Thomas, it will at worst be a 3 month test drive.
AP,
I don’t think RC and POP have gone 1 for 6 on offseason acquisitions. If McDyess, Ratliff, or Bogans were “really disappointing,” than I think your expectations were way too inflated. I think all three have played about as well as reasonably could have been expected. It took McDyess longer to warm up than I had hoped, that’s about my only gripe with any of the three of them. And Haislip was always a gamble: Great if he worked out, cost almost nothing if he didn’t.
Jefferson is the real disappointment.
Why why why why?
McDyess has been playing much better lately and can stretch things for Timmy.
Tyrus has been a malingering horror for the bulls and CANNOT shoot to save himself.
I watched him go 1 for 18 or something crazy like that vs Boston last year and he had no compunction in bricking it up and up and up.
Hopefully the Spurs are just throwing up smokescreens to disguise the brilliant move they’re actually cooking up in the back room.
People always use the word potential to describe Tyrus Thomas. I think he mostly has the potential to make Spurs fans realize trading for Richard Jefferson is not the worst mistake you can make.
As a coda I think this trade makes immediate sense if there’s the addition of another big man (somebody like boozer) or if the details are wrong and we’re trying to get Thomas and KEEP Dice.
The theme of the West this year is more, more, and bigger, bigger. Dice is doing great on both ends of the floor but can’t give us more than 20-25 minutes a night. We need somebody who can spell Duncan as the big man, not somebody who runs out of gas first and sits till the third. If Dice were coming off the bench and there were some THIRD player who could soak up minutes as a true big man, then the spurs could play the kind of basketball I expect to see out of Dallas LA and Denver from here out.
McDyess: 35 years old. Thomas: 23 years old.
If Spurs want a late season push, I think more youth is necessary, as we have a lot of experience. Sad to see Dice go (if it’s true), especially since he has stepped up lately.
I really can’t see Mason getting more playing time anywhere in the league. He would have to go to a bad team but he won’t get the shots. He needs to have other offensive weapons around him to make him stick out.
I just saw a headline: Bulls want Jefferson for Luol Deng. Sadly it was for Al Jefferon.
@AP
I agree with you, alot of people around the country overhyped the Dice and Jefferson acquisitions this summer, but I was NEVER excited about either, considering what LA had, and even thought Marion was a better gamble. As for Blair, we got lucky that he fell all the way to us at 37! I mean that was just a gift.
And our front office has made dozens of blunders, trading away our good draft choices (Barbosa, Scola, Goran Dragic, to name a few) and keeping poor ones. Not to mention, since we apparently didn’t value Dragic that highly anyway, couldn’t we have taken Nicolas Batum with our first round pick, and the unknown George Hill with the 45th pick?
Let’s hope the front office gets smarter going forward!
Hold on, There’s a lot of moving parts here. Be patient all will be revealed in about 72 hrs.
hopefully, some deal may come into fruition.
dice has had some solid games as of late, but creating cap space and moving towards the future seems to be much more important than limping into the playoffs with dashed hopes of a championship. tyrus thomas is an excellent defender. i think we would rather have his shot contention on the floor than an occasional 12ft jumper.
rmj’s minutes were so influx this year. he is a great shooter, but only a shooter, which means he will only be productive as long as he can keep a streak going. mason would be ideal playing with another dominant big who can give him some quality shots. nice to have you, roger. made some good memories.
we should include finley, and perhaps, bonner to sweeten the deal. no one wants mahinmi unless he proves he is worth acquiring (although his contract maybe be worth it enough). maybe with dice and bonner gone, we could see what he can/can’t do. worst case scenario? mahinmi’s contract expires
Surely we can do better than Tyrus Thomas. If this is true I read this as a desperation move at best, I’d rank it akin to the Shaq to Phoenix trade.
I think the front office has been very smart with their moves. We get to judge the acquisition of Jefferson now as a failure after having seen half a season of play. At the time of that trade, most everyone (but not everyone) thought it was a great move. The failure of a front office move to yield results does not mean the logic or reasoning behind it were wrong.
One other thing to keep in mind when judging the front office is that they operate in one of the smallest sports markets in all U.S. sports, if not the smallest. Just keeping the Spurs competitive for as long as they have, let alone winning 4 championships, is a tremendous feet. I’m not saying every move has been great, but there have been legit reasons for every move, with some of those reasons having been financial in nature. Financial moves, while not popular, let you live to fight, and possibly win, another day.
@td4life – I would not call those set of moves blunders. One of the innovations of our front office was to draft players they could stash overseas or pawn off on other teams in order to stay financially stable while fielding championship caliber teams. Each of those moves was made during the glory years of the Spurs championship runs. As for Batum, he was not available when the Spurs drafted Hill. Portland swooped in and traded with Houston to take him one pick before Hill. I remember seeing reports that the Spurs were going to take Batum, but Portland jumped ahead of them in a trade.
Lastly, I’d like to share one idea I have had for a while – that the front office had a set of long term plans years ago which were thrown off the rails when Splitter decided not to come to the NBA. Just think if Splitter had been gaining NBA experience that past few years with his skill level. That last Splitter theory is more of a gut feeling for me, but I think my Splitter idea, combined with the Gasol trade really left them scrambling to come up with a new long-term plan to not only stay competitive, but win more championships.
Td4Life, i have to take umbrage with your criticising the spurs draft decisions.
Our record in the draft is excellent. If you can hit on about 50% of your choices your amongst the leagues elite.
Splitter, Blair, Hill, Manu, TP, even Hairston are excellent or beyond excellent draft picks.
Manu alone is the biggest draft steal in the last 20 years.
It’s an inexact science, but one we have a prestigious track record in.
Batum was nobodies fault. As mentioned above he went one pick to early, and he has been injury plagued thus far.
Giving up Dice and acquiring TT is a suicidal move to say the least. I thought R.C. and Pop are better than this… I really hope this indeed is a mere smokescreen to hide the genious move like dogg is suggesting.
Thank you @jezav for a well thought out comment that defends the front office. These guys gave us 4 championships in 10 years (the last 1 just 3 years ago), so I think that buys them another 10 before we should start whining. I have full faith that these guys know that they’re doing and will probably get the job done. Show a little loyalty y’all… I’m just sayin….
@td4life
It’s pretty easy to say the FO has made “dozens of blunders” when you know how each player has turned out. Hindsight is always 20/20.
Lest we all forget, this FO has managed to win 4 championships with one lottery pick and no marquee free agent signings. The last 45 picks of the draft are a crapshoot anyways, so it’s a testament to the genius of the FO that we have drafted 2 All-Stars and many, many rotation players.
Nothing we say here will influence what happens, so let’s all sit back and enjoy the ride. I’m stoked about what the best FO in the league can accomplish in the next 2.5 days.
I’m with you BigGuy,
I don’t want Thomas but if the spurs grab him i’ll trust that they know more about the state of things than I.
http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/spurs
It appears to be another baseless rumor involving the Spurs. Adrian Wojnarowski’s reputation is taking a severe beating. 1st amare and now dice. I am guessing that he will stop commenting on Spur’s rumors henceforth.
Wrong link…
http://blogs.mysanantonio.com/weblogs/courtside/2010/02/sources-spurs-h.html
Sorry!
how about the fact that thomas comes with john salmons? salmons is a guy who can surely help this team. he is athletic, can hit open shots, rebounds some, gets to the line, and has some heart. he would be included in the deal for thomas. both can defend which is the key, thomas would provide the interior defense that dice, bonner, blair are not. he is a decent rebounder but his shot blocking is something sorely missed (shot blocking has been pointed out on this very site).
all in all i have no problem with it. would rather keep dice and let bonner go though. sure we lose his 3 ball but then we are not the suns, the spurs play defense and that has surely been a lost art ever since they got bonner.
I BLAME THE RED ROCKET!
splitter news.
http://www.marca.com/charlas/splitter/15022010.html
its in spanish, but the only thing you need to know its this.
when asked about the nba 3 times? he ignored the question twice and the one time he mentioned it…he said: “about the NBA, we will see”.
so the future is not as bright as we wish.
Something is seriously wrong in San Antonio. Now Spurs want to trade Mcdyess? I would get more into this one, but I see no need. This is ridiculous. We need a fresh perspective in San Antonio…Pop has bottomed out…Better get his @#$%$% outta here before we have no team left!
Lets get real. We have our big three along with Mcdyess, Blair, Hill, Mason, and Jefferson. The rest of the guys on that bench are questionable at best. No decent player is going to come here and play behind Bonner and Bogans. We ran our playoff hopes out of town already and Im sure that more will follow. Bring on Avery Johnson or give Shaun Elliott a shot. We need a new coach and a new philosophy. The ship is sinking fast!
@Nadeem, you can’t be serious. Mike Monroe is really an impartial writer, oh wait he isn’t. The Spurs probably would have denied the Mason scoop that Yahoo had but Mason’s agent made a statement.
It makes perfect sense to move Mcdyess if we decide to bring in Thomas. By no means has Mcdyess proven to be a game changer and while Thomas wouldn’t be either the 13 year age difference that someone mentioned earlier def makes it worth the gamble. Combined with Splitter, and Blair the Spurs would have a variety of different strenghts on front line.
So the answer now is Thomas? ROFLMAO!
Thomas cant hold a candle to Dice. If we didnt have a coach that has to be able to control his players minds, we might attract some high caliber guys. This seasons shortcommings are not player induced and we all know that. Stop trying to powder this coach’s nose and put it out there like it is. But, you might get yelled at…
Spurs shopping Jefferson:
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/basketball/nba/02/16/jefferson.rumors/index.html?eref=sihp
@BALLHOG
I will respectfully disagree with your assertion that the “seasons [sic] shortcommings [sic] are not player induced and we all know that.” Parker, Manu, and Jefferson are all falling short of expectations for various reasons, and it is because of this that we are falling behind as an elite team. How can you possibly ignore 12 seasons of coaching excellence?
Your nomination of Avery for coach is a very odd choice seeing as he’s known around the league as Pop 2.0. Have you forgotten about his heavy handed ways in Dallas that got him fired?
@cory clay – i did not say anything abt partiality. Regardless, i actually like adrian and never miss any of his articles. He just has a bad streak (even counting roger) going on the Spurs trade rumors front.
The news abt spurs shopping Jefferson is not new and so is the news abt them not finding a suitable trade for him.
ok how about this
word is that chris kaman is up for grabs, and the clips have made it known they want to let thornton go as well. so….
kaman/thornton for bonner/dice/mason
LOL!! I love the trade deadline. First Mason, then Mcdyess, and now Jefferson. @ Rangerjohn, I would take Chris Kaman in an instant and the trade you suggested would be GREAT for the Spurs. I believe LA wants to go after a big name free agent this summer and are trying to clear some cap space. Kaman would be a HUGE upgrade on our frontline. Don’t know whats going down in the next two days, but its gonna be fun! I got a feeling the FO has some little trick up their sleeve.
@Hobson13
I like it if they got Kaiman.
Otherwise I hate this idea of trading Mcdeezy. He’s really been coming along lately. He’s a veteran, its safe to say he’s been pacing himself for the playoffs. I think he’s going to be huge in the playoffs.
I hope its just a rumor, but if they got Kaiman then sign me up.
hobson
the trade can be made to match without dice and only exp contracts also like adding finley and mahinmi, maybe some cash. the only problem would be minutes. although the rotation would not be to bad, duncan and kaman start, dice and blair off the bench. then you have thornton and RJ at the SF spot maybe move one over the 2 guard. (ok thats a stretch)
@Nadeem, you wrote that his reputation had been damaged b/c a S.A. writer wrote a denial, I just pointed out that an S.A. writer who’s livelyhood is based on the amount of access that the home team gives him is going to write whatever they tell him to write.
I think that Pop is far from perfect, but overall I stand behind keeping him in charge at least until after our roster has been overhauled…
I am pleased to see guys defending the FO, but I think the statement “league’s best FO” is arguable… though they are certainly in the conversation… still it hurt to get so little back for Scola, and Barbosa (we could have made that trade AFTER JKidd signed/didn’t sign)…. and, the bottom line is that it’s at least 55% luck… Splitter may haunt us yet, pray not.
I agree with jezav that Splitter’s decision combined with the Gasol trade scrambled the spurs strategy to contend… but that doesn’t dismiss this last summer, where I just plain got depressed about throwing all that money at McD and RJ, and I never understood pundits claiming that we could now topple LA, lol, while totally writing off Chauncey&Co, or Dallas after their upgrade… but I could see we thought that IF each of our so-called “Big 3″ had one of their best seasons yet, we would be in the mix (still, a big “if” though)… I could also live with losing Bowen and Thomas, cuz we needed to change, but I knew Bowen’s absence was gonna cost us.
Finally, I’m generally in favor of keeping a squad together (wheras most teams do a Mark Cuban, or a post 2000 season Blazers and break it up to early, or assume that firing the coach will fix things, lol), but:
- Bonner hurts us, even playing him like Danny Ferry won’t but us over (thank you Stephan Jackson)
- Tony is an inferior defender, is not an smart playmaker, and is a mediocore shooter… and he’s losing his greatest physical gift (quickness) going forward. Anybody who says otherwise is starstruck. An upgrade at point is a game-changer. Can I hear an “Amen!” Anybody?
- To contend we need a stellar defensive squad.
Our best chance to contend is in the Duncan/Popovich era. If we can ship RJ (who can be a better fit on certain teams, and is a short contract; if packaged with the right pieces, he’s not untradable) and/or TP, can we get back size, defense, and/or a true PG, or at least be built for the future.
I’m grateful for what the Spurs accomplished leading up to and in the Duncan/Popovich era, but I also A) despise Kobe, and B) believe the Spurs will someday win back-to-back championships… because of our small market, we will do so in large part because of Spurs Defense.
It’s hilarious that Spurs fans think that Kaman, or Speights for that matter, and the like can be had. Hilarious!
I would trade Mcdyess, Bonner and Finley for Kaman in a heart beat! (financially makes since too)! Huge upgrade to our frontline as mentioned! but if the spurs are looking for a Ty thomas type player, I say go for A. jamison from the wizards!
@td4life: I doubt we could get Kaman, but there’ve been a lot of rumors around him since last summer. I truly believe LA wants to make a run at Lebron and they have good young talent that MAY cause him to think about it. I’m with you when you said an RJ or TP package might be able to net us something good. We aren’t 1 player away from contending (unless you count Wade, Lebron, etc.). And theres no way we can get an impact player for spare parts and expiring contracts. We need to look at serious changes in the next few days and probably a move over the summer also. The only pieces I would consider untouchable would be Duncan, Blair, and maybe Hill. Everyone else would be up for discussion if I were GM. I still maintain that TP would be a HUGE trading chip and could be our ticket to the future if traded.
It’s also funny when fans think a mike miller, or a jamison puts us over. Not even the mavs last 3 acquisitions into their starting lineup are that frightening to the true contenders.
For those whiners about Coach Pop, give it a rest, please. The guy’s one of the 5-10 best coaches of ALL-TIME; nothing’s changed. Fact is we have an aging, more injury prone core from our championship years, and even though things haven’t work out thus far this year to meet our hopes and dreams (in some cases, inflated) for a title challenge as a result of the big trades we made in the off-season, using Pop as a scapegoat is silly. Believe me, there’s nothing wrong with Pop. He knows way more than anyone on this blog how to win with the players he has at any given time. And remember, at some point you have to put sub-par performance on the player, particularly with a veteran, mature squad like ours. Every veteran on this team has thus far under-performed, regardless of coaching. This starts with Jefferson, of course, but all of the other veterans are not playing up to their ability: Parker, Manu, Dice, Mace, Bonner, & even Duncan is not as dominant or consistent as he used to be. We can always second-guess coaches on player minutes, or their substitution system, but this really reflects on our own frustration with the PLAYERS for not playing smart, lacking consistent hustle & determination, and just for their basic failure of not MAKING THINGS HAPPEN while they are on the court, and in the clutch. For example, where is the confidence & pride of these veteran, successful players, to lose so many games in the fourth quarter against competitive teams? (unlike any of our teams over the past ten years!) These were not coaching problems. Coaches can only do so much; it is the players that have to be willing to push their god-given talent to the limit, night in and night out, and execute the scheme provided them when it counts most.
One thing is for certain: Pop will never get fired. He would quit first if he felt the team wasn’t going to play for him. So, can we drop the Pop complaints?; it’s thoroughly counterproductive, and usually irrational.
thank you Hobson13! But no way the clippers ship Kaman (their all-star and the one guy that might lure them someone special) out to make room for a long shot. Sad, but true. I can see why you’d want him though.
Thatbigguy,
Parker is a gamer. He not only has the intangiables, he has the guts that it takes to win. Same goes for Duncan and Ginnobli. They are not the problem, they have always been the solution. Personnel decisions have hurt this team. Spurs have given away a lot of talent over the last decade and it has finally caught up to them.
Even the recent player decisions have been extremely questionable. First, Haislip could play. I just watched some very impressive film of him playing in Greece. This kid was young and athletic, he could score, rebound, and defend. Why the Spurs would sign him to a three year contract and suddenly release him is bizarre….As usual…No explaination offered!
Then there is Hariston. Better right now than Bogans and Finley, yet he is relegated to the Toros again.
Ratiff and Mahinmi could contribute now, but continue to pick up DNP’s.
Blair is mismanaged. He can score at will in the paint. Spurs should be posting him up and running some offense thru him.
Same goes for Dice and Jefferson. These guys arent suddenly scrubs. These are successful NBA players and have been for thier entire careers. They are accustomed to being options in thier teams offense, not garbage men!
As long as the Spurs continue to try and win with the lineups and rotations that are currently in place, it’s over. Pop is playing guys that wouldnt play 1 minute on 70% of the teams in the NBA.
Im not bashing the coach. I just think that his unusual filtering process for selecting players is no longer effective. The leauge has caught up to him and passed him and he has yet to adjust.
Adelman and Carlysle have less talented rosters, at least before this recent trade, but have done quite well. They have done well enough to make the Spurs the 3rd best team in Texas.
“the third best team in Texas”… OUCH!!