San Antonio Spurs 84, New Jersey Nets 90
In the roller coaster ride that is fans’ emotions, this one night will undo all the goodwill the San Antonio Spurs have built the past two games and transform the Spurs from potential world beaters into first round playoff fodder.
A loss to a New Jersey Nets team that, just a week ago, was in serious contention for the worst team in NBA history will do that. But objectively, shouldn’t this have been expected?
Tonight was a perfect case study of the impact one player can make. The catalyst for everything the San Antonio Spurs have become this past month has been Manu Ginobili, who sat out with back spasms. Ten wins or not, without Ginobili or Tony Parker–and on the wrong end of a back-to-back away from the AT&T Center–the talent gap between the two teams is not as drastic as you think.
Just look at the top two players on tonight’s teams. Improved as he is, and I believe George Hill merits serious consideration for the Most Improved Player award, Devin Harris is a better point guard. Likewise, tough as it is to say, Brook Lopez is a better player on two healthy wheels than Tim Duncan is on none.
That’s an advantage at the two most important spots, and looking down the rest of the rosters, the talent is almost a wash.
The New Jersey Nets shot 38% from the field and were out rebounded by ten, this was not a case of the Spurs lacking for effort or heart. Sans Manu Ginobili or Tony Parker, the Spurs simply lack the ability to create shots.
In years, or even months, past Tim Duncan would be the first candidate to pick up that slack. But Duncan is laboring once again with knee problems after loading up on heavy minutes the past week and it has noticeably effected his play on the court.
His defensive and rebounding presence is vital, but it’s becoming harder and harder to count on brilliant offensive performances on the second end of back-to-backs.
George Hill? He had 19 points and three assists, but on an inefficient 8-19 shots (only two free throws). Hill is vastly improved, but you have to watch how he scores his points to understand why he cannot fully replace Parker and Ginobili, even against a lowly Nets team.
In transition, off of curls, dribble handoffs and cuts, Hill can put the ball in the basket. But ask him to direct a pick and roll offense for an entire game? The Spurs have 16 turnovers and score 84 points.
This is not an attack on Hill, but rather an honest look at what his skill set is and isn’t at this point in his career. A player like Flip Murray  might not be able to crack this Spurs rotation, but on a night like tonight his ability to create NBA shots would have been very valuable for a team that gave quality minutes to Malik Hairston, Garrett Temple and Keith Bogans (a combined 3 for 10).
So on the list of things to take away from this game, perhaps the most important lesson is that the Spurs are not a very good team without both Manu Ginobili and Tony Parker.
It doesn’t take away from what the Spurs did with Ginobili and it didn’t take a loss to the Nets to confirm what the Spurs are without Ginobili.
@Jesse
“The only way that this game has any ramifications on anything moving forward is if Manu Ginobili is out for any extended period of time.”
I call BS. I’ve waited for you guys to come around, but this blog in general is really in denial. This wasn’t just one game, it glaringly brings out the biggest story of the last month or so for the Spurs. Tim Duncan has been in decline since the All Star break and in the last few weeks it’s reached the point that he’s an offensive non-factor. This game just brought that out. His FG% has been terrible for a long stretch now, his rebounding is down overall, and he can’t create his own shot. This is basically exactly what happened last year and we know how that turned out. Two wins over Cleveland and Boston (the latter being a mere .500 team since the all star break) brought out that the rest of the team was playing better, but they didn’t change the fact that teams don’t go anywhere without a strong frontcourt. Especially in our case where our PF/C is supposed to be our franchise player.
The writers on this blog have mentioned it in passing here and there, but come one. We talk about the “Tim Duncan window”. Tim Duncan’s health is not a minor issue that takes a backseat to Manu’s greatness or RJ doing better. Tim Duncan’s excellence makes or breaks this team (and yes, he needs to be excellent, not just good, for the Spurs to go anywhere). This blog really dropped the ball in reporting these worries early on. You can be positive and optimistic and still face reality.
And I’m sorry, but can we cut the crap about sitting Duncan for a game? I mean, I’m not against it, but let’s not kid ourselves and act like 30 minutes less of basketball in the course of the week likely to get him back to where we need him. His problem isn’t back-to-backs. Are we going to give him nights off in the playoffs too? At some point he has to play. If he can’t do it, he can’t do it. He’s had the lowest minutes of his career all season. Some problems can’t be fixed by a night off and it’s pretty obvious this is one of those cases.
Obviously I hope he gets better, but I’m not going to labor under the delusion that fewer minutes at this point in the season are going to pay off in the playoffs.
This is becoming a broken record. Personally, I am tired of hearing of Duncan’s health and “rest” every spring for the past three years. At the beginning of the year we hear about what Duncan did or ‘did not do’ to stay fresh and healthy for the playoffs. There is much hype around why Duncan will be a force for the year ahead. Then as the year progresses we start to hear about nagging injuries and how to rest him on back to back etc etc. It is about time we recognize that he is not the force he used to be and start to find a plan B.
To me TD was a liability in yesterday’s game and I could not understand why Pop played him at all…he should have had the night off. Mahinmi had a decent game last time around against the nets and should have gotten minutes. Blair did a good job but he was ‘rested’ instead. After all the hard work by Manu and the team for more than a month yesterday was very deflating.
And…this is not “just another loss”. The loss was a serious dent to our momentum and puts a lot more pressure on the team to win upcoming games.
We have the number one bench in the NBA and the number one bench in the NBA could have won this game for us if given the opportunity.
@ pastryP
Accurate posts. Duncan is on the decline. He is declining because he isnt strong enough to get his spot on the low block and it has forced him to become a perimeter player. Not his strong suit by far.
As for resting him, agreed as well. Wont help him as much as it would have helped Mahinmi. This team has no front court and it will hurt hem in the playoffs, as will the coach’s choices in who plays and who sits.
It makes the loss of Haislip and Ratliff even more glaring. Anyone that knows basketball, knows that those players could have bolstered our front court quite a bit.
Mcdyess at center? Backed up by Blair at 6’7? WOW is all I can say.
Coach Pop could simply have the team to back its defense more toward the paint. Defenders are too far out, which just opens the lane for lay up drills. We arent being beat on the perimeter most nights, we are being beat in the paint.
As for offense, Man oh Man…We could really use much more movement without the ball in this offense. Too many guys standing on the perimeter waiting and watching, instead of cutting and slashing.
It is the reason Pastry, that I couldnt join the cheering section just yet. Our roster is just not well thought out and is absolutely insufficient.
Though many try to remain optimistic, which is OK, lets not get too far from the obvious.
@Pastry–Tim Duncan’s problems aren’t back-to-backs, they are his knees, which are exacerbated by….back-to-backs.
You’re absolutely correct, the knee thing will not be fixed with a night off, it’s a degenerative condition that he will have to deal with for the rest of his career and probably his life. What a night off does is help at least manage it a little better. And yes, during the playoffs we will give him nights off…in fact, the Spurs will give their entire team nights off (there are no back-to-backs in the playoffs).
If you’d like us to scream from the rooftops that Tim Duncan is struggling with his knees, then: TIM DUNCAN IS STRUGGLING WITH HIS KNEE.
But over the past month Ginobili has been able to run the offense in a way that has removed Duncan’s neccessity to be an offensive focal point. Which is fine.
I’m not sure how saying the Spurs are not a good team without Manu Ginobili or Tony Parker is being in denial. I tend to believe this blog has always (and well before I got here) done a reasonable job of keeping things in perspective. And in the grand scheme of things I’m not sure that a loss to the Nets without two of your three best players (and the only ones that can create shots) changes things.
This never would have happened if TIM DUNCAN was still alive…
Guys, don’t get me wrong, I’m disappointed in this loss. But when I say it’s not relevant it’s because the Spurs will not play in the playoffs without Tony Parker and Manu Ginobili. And if they do, it wouldn’t matter because you couldn’t expect the Spurs to win without them anyways.
Does anyone have a scouting report of Ian Mahinmi’s game?
Pastrypride is right. Despite a summer of non-impact swimming and weight loss and a career low in minutes Tim is as bad off now as at the end of last season. I had hoped he’d sit out last night, even after I heard about Manu, but let’s not pretend one night of rest cures tendonosis. It’s a degenerative condition which cannot be treated by surgery and is unlikely to improve while he’s still playing.
Also, as much as it pains me to agree with BallHog on anything, he’s mostly correct about Bogans. Keith lacks the lateral quickness of a defensive stopper and makes too many mental errors. He has better offensive skills than Bowen but his corner 3 is not as reliable so in the Spurs’ system he’s actually a less effective scorer. He can provide value in certain situations but should not be part of the regular rotation.
@Jesse, DraftExpress has a decent summary from last fall. Ian’s problem is he needs minutes to develop but is no longer eligible for the D-League. He’d probably be better off overseas or on a lottery team that can afford to lose 50 games during his “on-the-job training” period.
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Ian-Mahinmi-207/
@BALLHOG,
So, when Hairston doesn’t play, you complain that he needs minutes. When he plays a huge chunk of minutes and sucks, you still blame it on Pop, claiming that he sucks because Pop has ruined his confidence. If that is truly the case, he needs to be cut, because apparently he can’t play if his confidence is gone. Hairston seems to play plenty loose when he picks up minutes in garbage time. More likely is that his tightness is due to the fact that he can’t dribble or pass, and that makes it scary to play when a game is still on the line.
I pretty much agree with your other points, but I think you have to lay off Pop on the Hairston issue, since he did exactly what you have been begging him to do for ages.
On a side note, I actually really like what I have seen from Temple. He seems to have a game similar to Hill’s only with dribbling ability. I would like to see how he comes out of camp next year, because I think he could be a viable backup.
Jesse,
I’m sorry if my original post come off a little strong. It was a tough loss. But I still think you’re denying the obvious.
The “night off thing” is a red herring and silly. I’m pretty sure you knew I meant not having to go in to a scheduled work day.
As for “screaming things from the rooftops”, it should be obvious that’s not what I’m talking about. Expecting media to cover important issues in a timely manner is not asking them to shout things emotionally. Manu’s play is a great story, but if you guys are going to speculate about the team’s chances in the playoffs, as has been happening lately, Manu isn’t the only consideration on which to base speculations. The story of TD’s health is as big a story.
This post at least gestures towards the problem. But look at how it’s formulated:
“His defensive and rebounding presence is vital, but it’s becoming harder and harder to count on brilliant offensive performances on the second end of back-to-backs.”
I’m sorry to go back to stating things too forcefully, but is this a joke, a hyperbolic understatement? How long has it been since you could “count on” “brilliant offensive performances”, whether on the second half of a back-to-back or not? We’re lucky if we get a decent offensive performance after a day or more of rest.
Jesse- Its not just a loss. Thinking that way is the same ignorance as pop.
We blew another 4th to one of the worst teams ever.
We saw TD fail in the fourth again.
We saw Lopez manhandle Tim and McD.
We didnt rest Tim.
So not only did we lose, but we also lost confidence.
This is the most ignorant coach of all time: “We just didn’t have anybody who could score. If you are not scoring, you need to make free throws, which we didn’t, or at least you have to take care of the ball, which we didn’t,” Spurs coach Gregg Popovich said. “So bad from the free throw line, bad handling the ball and found nobody who could score
Well we all know who the culprits are McD, Bonner, Bogans. Take away those losers and we’re shooting 30/67 = 45% 3/6 =50% 10/15= 67%.
WHO PLAYS THE PLAYERS?
Might I mention Blair was shooting over 50% but he wasnt in long enough.
Play the effective players .No Bogans, No Bonner, No McDyess. More Blair.
Ian even got a DNP? This would have been a great game for him since Pop didnt give a shit. Its funny the games we win Pop did a great job, but the games we lose = he didnt care.
And by the way, I think this is an excellent blog. That’s why I read it and post on it. Overall, you guys did a great job this season. But you can’t get everything right!
The loss to the Nets was very predictable. The loss isn’t going to change things much. What I’m worried about is Ginobli’s health. Back spasm and the like don’t disappear quickly. He only has about two weeks to completely recover so I don’t expect Pop to be in a hurry to put him back on the floor. If he comes back to soon and reinjures himself you can kiss he playoffs goodbye. I’m really upset with Popovich for not playing Mahinmi more during the regular season. The Net game would have been perfect for him had he played more often during the regular season. TD needed the rest and his performance versus Lopez showed it. I think that next year may be Duncan’s last. When he leaves Popovich will probably give it up as well. I’m a big Pop fan, but he has made a lot of poor decisions this year. There is no way the Spurs can beat Los
Angeles or Dallas in the playoffs. Too weak on the front line. If Mahinmi had been utilized more and developed his game, then the Spurs would be in much better shape now. Pop has a tendency to go with experience more than developing upcoming talent like Oklahoma has. The Spurs roster just isn’t good enough to compete against Dallas or LAL. On the remaining schedule I see losses to LAL, Phoenix, Orlando, Denver and Dallas. Just hope Memphis doesn’t get hot at the same time.
Maybe I’m just drinking the Kool-Aid here, but there’s not as much a talent gap between teams as one would think. Any NBA team is capable of beating another on any given night. It’s going to happen. Down both Parker and Ginobili, and they still had a chance to win had they hit their free throws? Doesn’t make me happy, necessarily, but it’s not the end of the world.
Miller- My sentiments fall in with development as well. Pop never developed anyone. You will hear the casual douche say TP or Manu, but TP relies on speed only, and Manu was an MVP before getting here.
Hog- I agree with your idea about the analysis of abandoning the power positions. We need D and rebounding so what do we do? We try to beat a dead horse with the “stretch 4″
Jesse- This blog is in denial from day one. People on here just mimick what POP says and any deviation is considered witch-craft. I might not be an NBA coach or ever coach anything beyond high school, but then again I will never have lost to one of the worst teams ever and be baffled why.
Appreciate the kind words pastry.
So far as my post, to say not to expect brilliant offensive performances…I’m just trying to say it’s time to temper your expectations of Tim Duncan on a night-to-night bases.
The Atlanta game was not too long ago, so he’s certainly capable of putting up good numbers when the conditions are right. And while not a monster performance, TD absolutely owned Cleveland in the third quarter, which set the stage for Manu in the fourth.
The decline of Tim Duncan is a big story, but I’m not certain it’s a new story. We’ve seen it coming for a long time, and for the rest of Duncan’s career it is survivor mode–as in, can Duncan survive enough to raise his game in the playoffs. He has a good track record of it, so I’ll go with it until he proves otherwise. And then if he doesn’t, it becomes a much bigger story in the offseason.
So long as Duncan can provide an anchor for our defense (which was great last night–again), he is a championship piece.
But really, if you didn’t get swept up in the euphoria of our last two wins you would have expected last night to be rough. The Spurs go through major droughts when Manu Ginobili is not on the floor. Our entire offense clicks around him, as it will Tony Parker when he returns.
Good teams have bad games. Sure it makes things difficult trying to find a good position for the playoffs, but we just have to move on.
Credit has to be given to picking up Hill from little oo-ee-poo-ee (IUPUI). If he stays under control and his success doesn’t lead to lack of self discipline, he can have a long-term career in this program.
Advice for the team, forget about the Nets. Concentrate on winning the next game and hopefully getting Manu back.
@TP…couple things. To say that Tony Parker relies purely on speed is incorrect. There are a lot of speedsters in the NBA, many of them faster than Parker (Leandro Barbosa, for example). What sets Parker apart as the best of them all is his ability to change speeds fluidly, play fast but not reckless and to finish in the paint. Not all of those things were in Parker his rookie year, they were developed over time.
George Hill should be the MIP this season, that’s the coaching staff developing a player.
And so far as beating a dead horse, we did not lose last night on defense or rebounding.
@Jesse,
One of the problems with TD’s game has been his knees (obviously) which make it so he has trouble catching the ball so close to the basket, because the opposing big man can push him out. Do you think that a wrinkle that Pop could put in for the playoffs is having more screens underneath.
I know, as a high school coach, that off ball screens down low help get open players. I just don’t know about NBA or not. The problem is that TD still has the talent, but he can’t punish people with his physicality anymore, he has to be a finesse player on offense.
Also, I must say that I was half-expecting to lose when I heard Ginobili was out. We can’t expect to beat most teams with 2 all-stars on the bench, and our third struggling with age.
Things are never as good as they seem or as bad as they seem.
We beat Cleveland and Boston. Good wins? Yes, but that didn’t mean we were immediately a contender.
We lose to NJ. Bad loss? Yes, but that doesn’t mean our season is doomed.
Let’s be realistic – we are what our record says we are: a decent team struggling to make it to the playoffs.
If I had to define our season thus far with one word, I’d go with “inconsistent.” We’ve shown flashes of greatness, followed by giving games away. Last night is just another example. And as much as I hate to say it, this kind of play is what we should expect. Good games here, bad games there. This last 4 games, at least in my mind, has been a microcosm of the entire season. It might be tough to handle, but I think thats the reality unfortunately.
Lots of people here complaining about Blair’s limited minutes. Seems like coming from college with suspect knees… that is why his minutes are down. His season would have been long over if he was still in college. There is a rookie wall to think about. Could he play a few more minutes? Probably, but you do need to take care of his knees and not kill them too much considering this is foreign territory for him. He’s a rook and hitting the rookie wall. It is what it is…
I agree with most of the comments about Duncan. His signs of wear and tear are rather large now at the end of the season. It’s a shame but his play is really being affected on the low block, too many jump shots outside his comfort zone and he shows a lack of elevation. I don’t think Haislip was the answer and he looked very unpolished when he was actually given some burn. AN athlete no doubt, but there’s a reason that he was a lottery pick and no longer plays in the NBA. Mahimi has his flashes of brilliance and usually 3-4 fouls in 10 minutes to go along with them. Against NJ it seems like he could have spelled Duncan a bit more. But we didn’t lose the game because Mahimi didn’t play more. Ratliff… that’s another story. He could have made a difference and helped Tim’s game (Larry Brown seemed to have no issue giving his old body minutes), but that is another story for another time.
When you shoot a higher % than your opponent from the floor including 3′s there has to be something that is your undoing. As much as we want to overlook it… 16 TO’s and shooting barley above 50% at the line??? That is the nail in the coffin. If you have two less turnovers and make even as little as 70% of your free throws, you win the game. The Spurs have been horrible in protecting the ball even in their two marquee wins with 15 or more TO’s. But they’ve been able to force turnovers as well. Spurs didn’t force as many turnovers and shooting only 50% at the charity stripe will not get you W’s on most any night. As yes in the Duncan era we’ve had absolute flops against horrible teams. This is not the worst loss in Spurs history. It’s a loss, and realistically the Spurs will do no better than 6th for a playoff spot. I’m not sure if we’d want to be 4th or 5th in any respect, so it’s not the end of the world; 7th or 6th will be just fine.
@Jordan,
It’s a good idea, and if I remember correctly the Spurs ran some of that action against Cleveland. But other than a quick-hitting basket here or there I’m not sure it’s a cure though.
The problem is that in the NBA, there’s not much difference between 4′s and 5′s, so running the screen action, players can generally switch or hold off Duncan in time for the defense to recover.
The easiest answer would be for Tim Duncan to run the floor and establish position early, but that sort of require his knees to be okay too.
I’ve said it before and I’ll mention it now, people tend to think of aging as robbing a player of his jumping or speed, so we assume Duncan would age well. But Duncan did rely on fluid movements in the post, a lot of which has dwindled on most nights.
Guys, I’m really worried that Manu ill in fact leave the Spurs this summer. We know that Manu will wait for the free agency to make a decision about where he will finally go and some teams are probably going to put together the team of the new decade.
After seeing what kind of team the Spurs are without him and if he really desires to win, he may decide to pack and go.
Crazy to think but also very possible!!!
Manu may indeed leave. His exact words in today’s Express News article:
“I know I’m going to get a job. It doesn’t matter where or how.”
It doesn’t matter where? Can’t get much plainer than that.
I think Ginobili could have played but Pop thought he could get away with not playing him. They need to take care of the games they are suppposed to win first and then worry about the tough ones because they might lose the tough ones anyway.
I think Ginobili could have played but Pop thought he could get away with not playing him. They need to take care of the games they are suppposed to win first and then worry about the tough ones because they might lose the tough ones anyway.
Regarding the turnovers, let’s consider that Manu is effectively our best back-up/2nd unit facilitator for the offense in addition to being an elite 2 guard. When we chose not to use a roster spot on a Jacque Vaughan/Brevin Knight/Anthony Carter kind of player (i.e. a vet with very limited skills but who simply knows how to run an offense competently), we took a gamble that Hill’s inexperience and Mason’s lack of true PG skills wouldn’t expose our lack of depth in pure-point skills. For one game, it bit us in the butt.
Panic if you must, but if you choose to do so, please panic for the right reasons — our health, not our play in any one game, is our biggest limiting factor moving forward.
Joe –
I agree. We really don’t have a true PG outside of TP. George, for as much as he has improved and as much potential as he has, is still learning the position.
Also, as Jesse touched on, last night really exposed our lack of playmakers outside of Manu and TP. Our offense effectively ground to a halt in the final 3 quarters, which is the side of the ball in which we lost the game.
– The decline & inconsistency in TD’s performance over the past 2 months indicates that his playoff performance is also going to be somewhat inconsistent. The idea that somehow Duncan is going to be this “rock” of a performer throughout the playoffs, because he’s done that in the past, is delusional.
– Losing to the 2nd worst team in the NBA because we’re missing Manu & TP is the type of excuse given by teams that are unlikely to compete effectively in a playoff series. We have enough talent and experience on the rest of the team to have won that Net game by 8-10 points or more. Our other guys simply did not “cover” for Manu. To me, that shows a lack of solidarity within the team. The rest of the team should have stood up and told Manu, look, “we got your back”; you rest and we’ll promise you a “W” tonight. That didn’t happen. Unfortunately, we as a TEAM, simply lacked the will, determination, mental focus, & confidence to ensure the win — a win that in the final analysis we may have indeed NEEDED to avoid LA in the first round (the only opponent where we’re just about guaranteed a first round exit).
No team in our position should have conceded a game against the Nets. We NEEDED that win. In reality, this was in effect a “statement” game, and not a very good one at that.
@ JimJim
Exactly…Nothing more can be added.
I have a Question :
STILL WANT L.A. IN THE FIRST ROUND ?
If you thought that was a letdown…………………..
@ Joe and Tyler,
Look again… this is not a panic from one game. This current version of the Spurs turns the ball over. It’s not just one game, it’s a season long disease. Some of it can be attributed to the Spurs using Manu/Mason/Hill as points but even when Tony was playing, the Spurs turn the ball over. This is the first season where there is a clear difference between how many turnovers are committed by the Spurs and how many are forced. This hasn’t happen since God knows when. Past incarnations of the Spurs caused more turnovers than they committed. It was part of their tenacious defense and ability to execute their half court game to an almost boring perfection. I for one like boring, but those days are gone. I think as Jim pointed out, a lot of this has to do with a lack of “mental focus.” That is one of the reasons we have trouble closing out tight games, that is one of the reasons the Spurs commit so many turnovers. It is not a panic because we had one game with a lot of turnovers. It is a panic because we’ve had a season full of games with a lot of turnovers. The anomaly this game was the poor free throw percentage. That is not a reason for panic, that is the anomaly. The lack of execution, a sense of urgency and mental focus… those are the causes for concern. One has to wonder when Manu gets back, how long he will be able to carry the team. The lack of execution of this team is very “un Spur” like.
As an aside, execution of such a complicated system does take time. It’s almost April. Has anyone else notice that having such a complicated system to learn has been the downfall of some of the new pieces, however Mike Brown (Pop disciple) employs a similar system in Cleveland and Antawn Jamison has picked up said system since the All-Star break like he’s been playing there all season. And to a lesser degree our own Theo Ratliff has gelled rather nicely (although nowhere near as impressive numbers as Jamison’s) in Larry Brown’s (Pop’s mentor) system. Something doesn’t fit with the logic.
@TheRealBarackObama:
If health is a precursor for us having any hopes at all, and if the goal is winning a championship (even if that seems unlikely), then for my part, yes, I’d like the Lakers in the first round.
My rationale: there is a short lay-off between the end of the season and the start of the playoffs. The start of the playoffs is the most well-rested we can hope to be. If we have any chance of beating LA at all, I think our chances are better early in the playoffs than later. Let me turn it around and ask you this: if we somehow magically put together a string of gutty performances and make a deep run, who would you rather face in the conference finals when we’re exhausted and limping through injuries, LA or Dallas?
A second rationale favoring playing LA early even if you don’t think we stand any chance of doing well in the playoffs: Management has a huge decision looming this summer about resigning Manu and giving this core one last season together. Since LA has been our measuring stick throughout the decade, don’t we want one last look at how we match up against them in a full series before we decide whether we really need to blow up the team and go into full rebuilding mode? If we get blown out in 4 or 5 games, isn’t that a sign that our ship has sailed? Or conversely, if we play 6 or 7 tough games, is that an indication that the guys deserve one last run together?
Dear Chicken Little & Numerous Spurs fans,
Contrary to popular opinion, the sky is currently not falling.
Please desist from public hysteria.
The end
@Dr.Who:
Your point is well-taken; this Spurs team is not on par with past incarnations in terms of taking care of the ball, execution, or consistency. However, I don’t think having flaws is cause to throw the team or its best players individually under the bus, and I don’t think that losing to a NJ team that has a motivation to finish strong and NOT be labeled the worst team ever when it clearly has some interesting talent (including Devin Harris, who always gives us problems, and a guy who should have been last year’s ROY) is a particularly damning case against us. Teams in similar situations to us but with less talent have made deep playoff runs in the past (Houston’s second championship year, where they started as a 6th seed, and the 1999 Knicks, where they started out as an 8 seed and went to the finals). All I’m saying is that rather than panicking, we’re at the part of the season where all we really can do is just lay back, watch how things unfold, and cheer our hearts out along the way no matter what warts we may bring with us.
Dr. Who/Jim H. –
Could our turnovers and lack of execution be not a result of mental focus, but the fact that we are simply not that great of a team? As you touched on Dr. Who, the overall trend in our turnover differential for the past few years is downward. That trend to me indicates eroding talent (or opponents’ superior talent), not anything to do with mental focus. I think it’s all finally come to a head this year. Look at a few more of the differentials from year to year and you’ll find we are getting worse in several categories. That just so happens to coincide with injuries and the increased age of our core. I don’t think that’s a coincidence. The lack of execution is essentially a byproduct of our eroding skills as a team.
If it sounds like I’m condeming this year’s team, I’m not. There’s still the chance for a playoff push. I’m speaking more to consistency.
Like I’ve posted before, the idea that this Spurs team should consistently beat good, quality teams is unrealistic. We are what our record says we are – a decent, yet inconsistent team struggling to make the playoffs. While we still show flashes at times, our overall play has been slightly above average.
Dr. Who, I agree with you: no one game should send the fanbase into panic. It’s the long term trends that I find alarming. I simply believe that this year, it should be apparent to all Spurs fans that, as presently constructed, is not a team that lends itself to any consistency.
I’m oh so down with what Joe is saying.
@ jesse
i know you aren’t a fan of mahinmi’s, but we should have at least given him some burn. yes he commits fouls, but he has shown some offensive efficiency. if our troubles last night consisted of a lack of point production (ahem, ANTONIO MCDYESS), i don’t think it is completely foolish to let ian play for a stretch considering he did blow up for 15 pts in their last meeting. yes, it was against the nets, but isn’t that another reason to burn him? no he isn’t a rotation player and no he wouldn’t help against the gasol’s and odom’s, but for a desperate game calls for desperate measures.
and what is the scouting report on his game? i’m curious. probably nothing different than what we have discussed here. athletic, foul prone
Ians scouting report is exactly that.
Unpolished raw and prone to make poor decisions on both ends of the floor.
I still would love to see him get picked up for a million a year for a couple more years. At some point you have to hope he gets it, and that he is wearing black and silver when he does.
Duncan should take every second game off for the rest of the season and then the Spurs should trade him. What is the point of having a franchise player who by the end of each season gets stuck in mud. He should be at his physical best by the playoffs but as history repeats itself his wheels fall off and he becomes useless. What’s the point, trade him and get something for the buck. Your best players should be at there peak by the end of the season. Ginobili has timed this season but it is sad that he needs to carry Duncan and the rest of the teams load.
@ buckets
BLASHPEMY!!!
i saw somewhere on the web the spurs almost traded TD for the rights to greg oden. *whew*
Yeah lets trade duncan.
Because that would accomplish so much towards our apparent goal of winning a title, franchise caliber all centres being so thick on the ground and all…..
We already have three quality guards in a rotation with Manu, George & Tony, maybe we can get a 4th and play in the 6’5 and under league at the local rec club.
It’s not that I’m not a fan of Mahinmi, as much as any of you I wanted (and in some ways still want) Ian to succeed with the Spurs because there are hints of talent there.
What I’m not a fan of is 30 comments talking about how much we should fire Popovich or how horrible a coach he is because Ian is not a starter or the Spurs did not develop him. Especially given that people can’t come up with a simple scouting report on the guy past being athletic and tall.
The Spurs gave him some run in the preseason, he wasn’t ready. With all the new faces it was more important to get the people who would help us in the playoffs acclimated with each other. Even if McDyess hasn’t worked out, it was absolutely the right call to make because getting the McDyess that could give you 10 and 10 a night was more important than developing Mahinmi for the simple fact that we were pursuing a championship.
Getting Roger Mason back to the Mason of last year was more important than what Hairston would’ve given us this year.
Make sense at all?
Jesse not to mention that Ian couldn’t crack the French national teams rotation ahead of such luminaries as Ronny Turiaf, Florent Piétrus, and Ali Traore.
Yeah I don’t know who the last guys are either.
Fans just love eating up potential and tall. All day long.
Jesse
Agreed.
We beat the Cavs and Celts back to back, without TD (he’s saving himself) and TP, and then we lose to the Nets, without the formers, including Manu and RMJ…yet, our role players played well, as did RJ–as good as we should expect him to contribute, as he’s ever-so, overly-mentioned ‘getting there’.
To me, the Nets game was great for us. Sure, we lost, but the players we need come playoff time came through…and of course it’s against the Nets, but they too have lots of talent, albeit young…Imagine with TD, TP, and Manu playing at least relatively well come the playoffs, and I’d say we’re not that bad afterall.
All season long I have been saying Pop has got to develop Mahinmi. He hasn’t done that. Now with a lame Duncan and no real big man to help defend the middle or protect other teams like LAL or Dallas from grabbing a ton of offensive rebounds the Spurs are in a really deep hole. In order to reach the NBA finals the Spurs are going to have to beat the Lakers and the Mavericks without home court advantage. Ain’t gonna happen. The Jefferson deal really backfired for San Antonio. Splitter will never become a Spur and sometime during the next season Duncan is going to face up to the fact that he can’t get it done anymore and call it quits. So Spur fans prepare yourselves for two or three years of hard times in which our team will not reach the playoffs. Lets face it you can’t win in the NBA without superior talent. We’ll probably lose Ginoble. As much as he loves San Antonio even he can see the Spurs don’t have the people to be a contender. He wants to have a chance for another ring.
i am not going to lie, i have been one of those “what the hell is pop doing” guys, but i completely understand and agree with his decision not to play mahinmi this year. and maybe our expectations were a little high for antonio mcdyess. the guy is nearly 37.
i also agree that roger mason’s offensive production is more important than hairston’s athleticism.
that being said, you think there is any chance we will bring mahinmi back nxt year? and if so, under what circumstances? i could imagine him being on our summerleague, but under non-guaranteed circumstances.
i also found your comments @ spurs pregame chat to trade dejuan intruiging.