The biggest question facing the Spurs

by

Chanel recently launched an ad campaign with plus-sized model Crystal Renn. The promise of the fashion house, or so it would seem, was to capture the outer charm of Christina Hendricks in a tasteful still frame or two. But when the campaign launched, there wasn’t much of anything plus-sized about it. Renn was captured from the shoulders up, and any suggestion of plus-sizes was  left in the public relations office.

This is how I felt about the San Antonio Spurs’ last season. During training camp 2009, Gregg Popovich vowed a return to defensive form, wanting his team to get back to the top of the NBA’s defensive rankings. But the Spurs never got there. The Spurs weren’t plus-sized; they weren’t even fat-faced.  The promise of a defensive return to form fell flat from Day 1.

Now, of course, Gregg Popovich is not Karl Lagerfeld. There is no doubt that Popovich preached defense as ardently and sincerely as ever before–his intentions were true. The Spurs’ defensive failures were not bound up in a disingenuous promise. The Spurs failed because they didn’t have the right personnel to meet Popovich’s defensive demands. And this was true across the roster–it wasn’t simply a problem of Richard Jefferson’s inability to recreate Bruce Bowen.

The Spurs’ signing of Tiago Splitter will help their front court. Splitter’s ability to defend the pick and roll is well-documented.  But what else have the Spurs done to upgrade their defensive personnel?

This is me pleading ignorance, not protesting the team’s offseason. Neither James Anderson nor Gary Neal nor Matt Bonner nor Richard Jefferson nor Alonzo Gee are defensive specialists, at least they’re not billed that way. Tim Duncan is a year older. DeJuan Blair is still short. Tony Parker and Manu Ginobili give great effort, but are, generally put, offensive players. Garrett Temple was a good defender in limited minutes last season, and he is the one “new” face on the perimeter whose defensive abilities put a little pollyanna in this blogger.

In addition to the absence of capable defensive personnel, the Spurs lacked quality perimeter shooters last season. The front office seems to have addressed the issue of shooting this offseason, but left their die hard faithful with questions about their the team’s overall defensive ability. So, in short, the big question facing the Spurs this season is whether Popovich can make good on his ambition to return the Spurs to the top of the league’s defensive rankings, a year later than he had originally planned. And if so, who will emerge as San Antonio’s go-to defensive specialist(s)?

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  • spursfanbayarea

    @Jim
    “And going after a guy like Amundson would have been a big step in the right direction. Instead, all we got is former draft pick Splitter coming over.” Direct quote from your post. You need to remember what you post before you start accusing people of making stuff up. Just because you don’t recall your posts doesn’t mean people are making things up. Based on player development and potential you can assume what a player can and cant do. Its done all the time in the draft. John wall hasnt played a single game in the nba. Yet he is projected to be a top ten point guard in the future. You have no idea of basketball talent if you think an overseas player cant make an impact. The last time we got the MVP of an oversea team. He played pretty well. Manu Ginobilli came over and made an immediate impact and was a rotation player in a championship team. Splitter is lottery level talent that has had time to work on his game. His ceiling is definitly higher than a limited role player. Pau Gasol played in the Spanish league and he hasnt done so bad. The talent in other leagues gets closer to NBA level everyday. Just look at the previous world championships. U.S. hasnt been a champion since early 90′s. And as far as evaluating Amudson, you are way off. Projecting players on 48minutes averages makes no sense. He plays nowhere close to that, and never will. He got eaten alive by any front line that has size. He averaged 11min against the lakers, 0.5 block and 4 rebounds. We can get that production from blair against the lakers. Getting through the WCF will mean having to go through the lakers. Amudson wouldn’t help us in series with big players.

  • rj

    too bad we signed theo ratliff last year and not this year. he would have fit on our roster this year in terms of being able to provide some low post d off the bench at a price we can afford now, but couldnt last year. we are still soft up front. amundson would be a good acquisition. i dont think this team will struggle with rebounding, but tenacity and front court mobility is a necesity. amundson can provide the lateral quickness to keep guards out of the paint on a switch and cover althletic bigs. blair duncan and dyess will provide toughness in the trenches. we still need an athletic defensive minded sf…….and crystal renn is gorgeous. i like me a girl with some curves

  • GitErDun

    It’s confusing to me why IF a player is on the Spurs roster he is somehow a liability and if they are available (i.e. Amundson) they are somehow the Savior of our season. If Amundson were so gosh darned valuable as a defender, shooter, or whatever, then WHY is he still available at this time prior to the season. Doesn’t it figure that if he were SO VALUABLE, he would have been snapped up a long time ago by some other team needing a Defender/shooter/???? If he was so valuable, why would the Suns be looking to let him go???

    I say, let’s give our young guys a chance to excel, and stop looking to find one year wonders this late in the pre-season. Of course, you do realize that whomever is brought in isn’t going to get any playing time in the SPURS SYSTEM anyway.

  • GitErDun

    It would be interesting to find some archival footage of Splitter playing against either Pau or Marc Gasol, or even against Nowiczki. Would be fun to see how he did. I suspect however IF Splitter were going to play for the Lakers or Boston or Orlando, he would be being hailed as the next best thing to LeBron. On the Spurs, he is lucky to get playing time. I’ll bet he eats most of the PF and Centers in the league up by the All Star break. The talking heads will wonder where the Spurs found him and how they managed to ace out the league and adding one more piece to the pie.

    I’d still like the Spurs to add the Greek guy Bourosis to the roster if they added anyone. There also has to be a SF in Europe somewhere that is flying under the radar.

  • Jim Henderson

    spursfanbayarea
    August 29th, 2010 at 9:18 am

    ““And going after a guy like Amundson would have been a big step in the right direction. Instead, all we got is former draft pick Splitter coming over.” Direct quote from your post. You need to remember what you post before you start accusing people of making stuff up….Just because you don’t recall your posts doesn’t mean people are making things up.”

    Your quote of me DOES NOT SAY THAT I WANTED TO GET AMUNDSON “IN PLACE OF SPLITTER!!!” It CLEARLY implies that all we got was Splitter “instead of getting more”, such as an Amundson pick-up IN ADDITION to Splitter! Thus, again, you clearly misrepresented my position & point on this matter.

    In other words, Splitter is not ENOUGH for us to get back to the WCF’s. That is my point. Do you get it now! And by the way, I recall all my posts, and I re-post excerpts on occasion for people when they misinterpret them, like yourself.

    “John wall hasnt played a single game in the nba. Yet he is projected to be a top ten point guard in the future.”

    John Wall is the NUMBER ONE pick in the entire draft, and even he is far from guaranteed to become a perennial all-star. Splitter was a NUMBER TWENTY-EIGHT pick. The odds of a 28th pick becoming even a regular, solid rotation player is not high (this is not to say that Splitter won’t be one of them, or better – he could be, but it’s far from guaranteed). Go back through the drafts over the past 15 years. Educate yourself.

    “You have no idea of basketball talent if you think an overseas player cant make an impact.”

    Did I say that Splitter, or an overseas player “can’t” make an impact? NO, I DIDN’T. Again, you’re misrepresenting my position on the matter.

    “Manu Ginobilli came over and made an immediate impact and was a rotation player in a championship team.”

    Ginobli is ultra special, and we were smart and lucky to get him. He’s turned out to be one of the best players to ever come out of Europe. You can’t possibly compare Splitter to Ginobli at this point.

    “Splitter is lottery level talent that has had time to work on his game.”

    He was picked at #28 a few years back. We don’t know that he’s a lottery-level talent, even at this point, given his success in Europe. And even a late lottery pick is far from a guarantee to become an impact player.

    “Pau Gasol played in the Spanish league and he hasnt done so bad.”

    Probably the 2nd best player to EVER come over from Europe. Can we stop now with the silly comparisons.

    “And as far as evaluating Amundson, you are way off.”

    No, you have NO idea of what you’re talking about. Amundson is a one-of-a-kind scrappy, high-energy ROLE player that does a lot of things well on the court, and would be a GREAT fit on our front line with TD, Blair, & Splitter. And let’s get real, using 36 & 48 minute production projections is simply a method of comparing productivity per minute for role players versus guys that get more minutes. There’s nothing wrong with it, and contrary to your view, it makes a lot of “sense”. A 15 mpg. player may not maintain his rate of production if he doubled or tripled his minutes, but it would not be that far off, and it does give one an indication of how productive a role player is per minute compared to those players that get more minutes of playing time, and put up higher numbers as a result.

    “The talent in other leagues gets closer to NBA level everyday. Just look at the previous world championships. U.S. hasnt been a champion since early 90′s.”

    Closer, but nowhere near there. Plus, it’s just a different style of play over there. Some players just have some difficulty fully adapting to the NBA style, and it’s not always easy to predict who will, and who won’t adapt well. The main reason the U.S. has had some struggles to win in the world championships is that we often have different players come in and out all the time, and they simply don’t play together as much as do the teams in other countries. The priorities are different.

    “He averaged 11min against the lakers, 0.5 block and 4 rebounds. We can get that production from blair against the lakers.”

    Yeah, that’s good, let’s just look at one series in which the Suns overall front line was over-matched by the two-time defending Lakers to come up with an assessment that Amundson’s not that good. Talk about cherry-picking a situation to fit your case. Please! And Blair is nowhere near the defender that Amundson is, and NEVER will be. But they could and would be an excellent fit together in the rotation because they do different things well. But of course, I’m sure you don’t quite understand that.

    “Getting through the WCF will mean having to go through the lakers. Amudson wouldn’t help us in series with big players.”

    Number one, lets worry about getting “to the WCF’s”, let alone “through them”. And even so, Amundson would give us a better chance at upsetting the Lakers. There’s no question about that.

  • Jim Henderson

    GitErDun
    August 29th, 2010 at 12:50 pm

    “It’s confusing to me why IF a player is on the Spurs roster he is somehow a liability and if they are available (i.e. Amundson) they are somehow the Savior of our season.”

    Here we go again. Did anyone say that Amundson could be the “savior of our season”? No. What has been said is that he’s a valuable front line role player that could help our team.

    “If Amundson were so gosh darned valuable as a defender, shooter, or whatever, then WHY is he still available at this time prior to the season.”

    Amundson is not a “star” player. He has an overall limited game from an offensive standpoint. In addition, he’s the best big man role player left in free agency. There’s no reason for him to rush into a deal. His agent obviously has him holding out for the best possible deal before he commits to a contact.

    “Doesn’t it figure that if he were SO VALUABLE, he would have been snapped up a long time ago by some other team needing a Defender/shooter/????

    No, it doesn’t. Because of Amundson’s lack of shooting ability, he is the prototypical niche role player, whose benefit is maximized commensurate with the “fit” he represents for the team in question. For the Spurs, unlike many other teams, he fits very well because he does the very things that this team needs (shot-blocking, energy, scrappy defender, solid rebounder). Most other teams need and/or value a more polished offensive performer in the low post, with a decent mid-range shot. However, with the addition of Splitter, we don’t need another scorer on the front line. We have plenty of them with TD, Blair, Bonner, etc. WE NEED A DEFENSE & SHOT-BLOCKING role player for 12-18 mpg., and Amundson fits that bill to a “T”.

    If he was so valuable, why would the Suns be looking to let him go???

    I can’t speak for why other FO’s make dumb mistakes, and who knows want the hell Phoenix is thinking after letting Amare go, or what they plan to do with that SMALL, short front line. If anything, they’re a team that needs another guy 6’11″ – 7′, and 250 lbs. plus guy. I assume that that’s still in the plans for them, unless they just really want to go small ball, which in my view is DUMB.

    “I say, let’s give our young guys a chance to excel, and stop looking to find one year wonders this late in the pre-season.”

    Yeah, let’s just resign ourselves to another 1st or 2nd round playoff exit. That might be good for you, but I like trying to improve our chances for a title any way I can. And standing pat at this point with the status quo does not do that.

    “Of course, you do realize that whomever is brought in isn’t going to get any playing time in the SPURS SYSTEM anyway.”

    Not true. Amundson should earn 12-18 mpg. in the 4/5 rotation.

    GitErDun
    August 29th, 2010 at 12:56 pm

    “I’ll bet he eats most of the PF and Centers in the league up by the All Star break. The talking heads will wonder where the Spurs found him and how they managed to ace out the league and adding one more piece to the pie.”

    That’s a nice dream. Lets hope it comes true.

  • Jim Henderson

    JustMe
    August 28th, 2010 at 5:39 am

    “To be honest, seems to me no other person posting here has a chance to be remotely right when going against a “glass is always half empty” type of person.”

    I’d rather see the glass as it is, filled with water to the mid-point. And everyone has an equal opportunity to recognize that simple fact, if they want to.

    “Long posts are also a drag, specially the pessimistic type of long posts.”

    I know, reading something with substance must be boring for you. And by the way, my posts are more objective about the Spurs current situation. They are not pessimistic, they are “realistic”. In the future, just scroll past my posts if you find them too long. Besides, your one-line cliches are not very useful.

  • rj

    jim……..you are a dick. its just a blog. lay off the patrol. i think you make great points, but when u start saying crap like “educate yourself” and “keep dreaming”, no one is going to listen to you. you are at times just as a nuisance as ball hog. im sorry your college degree hasnt landed you a profession in journalism and you find your professional outlet on this silly blog. no one likes a big headed , condescending know-it-all

  • Bushka

    McDyess brings spacing as well as rebounding and solid crafty D. I can’t give that up for someone that would grow into minutes in the future, but who might possibly not fit as well with the personnel.

    The thing is I don’t know if you guys agree, but I really hate having two front line players that can’t hit jumpshots on the court at once. It kills offensive spacing.

    For me that means you can’t play Lou & Blair together at the same time, it puts too much of a burden on the rest of the perimeter.

    The suns could get away with giving Lou a roaming commission because he was on a team that was loaded with shooting and gunned from the three point line like no other.

    On the spurs if you play Dejaun + Lou they can leave them wide open and not have to pay.

  • GitErDun

    Damn, I have once again forgotten to ask permission to have an opinion on 48 Minutes of Hell. Just seems to me that the following quote about says it all – “he’s the best big man role player left in free agency.” Yup Fersure that will win another title, Yup- SHO enuf.

  • Jim Henderson

    rj
    August 29th, 2010 at 2:11 pm

    “jim……..you are a dick. its just a blog. lay off the patrol.”

    Hey, quit with the personal attacks! I don’t call people “dicks” and “spur-haters”, like you and your buddy “spursfanbayarea”. If someone’s going imply that a 28th pick in the draft (Splitter) is somehow “very likely” to be an impact player in his first year in the NBA, then he needs to “educate” himself of the facts by looking at the history of late-round picks. The fact that “spursfanbayarea” was coming at me repetitively with unfounded assertions, means that he needs to “educate” himself of the facts. That’s the way it is. And I’m not on here to be “political”, or “make friends and influence people”, so I really don’t care if people “listen to me” or not on this blog. Everyone can make their own decision on that. And if you guys don’t stop with the personal attacks, I’ll be forced to return the favor in kind, and then we can proceed to degrade the culture and usefulness of this blog. Would that make you happy?! Knock off the punk-ass BS!

    “im sorry your college degree hasnt landed you a profession in journalism and you find your professional outlet on this silly blog. no one likes a big headed , condescending know-it-all.”

    You have no idea what I’ve done, and do in my personal/professional life, so cut it out with the unsubstantiated and derogatory innuendos. I look for the truth, learn the facts, analyze them, and report them. I may employ sarcasm from time to time to make a point when someone makes completely unfounded assertions, but no, I’m not a “big-headed, condescending know-it-all”, and again, I don’t care if people on here like me for what I say. And I’m also not puerile name-caller, like some people on here I know. Look, we can be nasty to each other all we want, but I’d give it a rest if I were you. I don’t get intimidated very easily.

  • Jim Henderson

    Bushka
    August 29th, 2010 at 2:32 pm

    “The thing is I don’t know if you guys agree, but I really hate having two front line players that can’t hit jumpshots on the court at once. It kills offensive spacing……..for me that means you can’t play Lou & Blair together at the same time, it puts too much of a burden on the rest of the perimeter.”

    But you don’t need to match Blair with Amundson! You match Blair with Duncan, and Amundson with Splitter, and vice versa. Duncan & Splitter can hit mid-range jumpers. We’re not going to win in the West having 34 & 36 year old’s in decline receiving dominant minutes in the rotation. In addition, the only way Blair is going to get up to speed in a reasonable period of time with his mid-range jumper that he’s been working on is to be put in the position where he needs to start taking his shot a bit more often in the game. Shooting in a game is about 90% confidence, and you don’t gain that confidence by always being paired with a 4/5 teammate that is the designated mid-range jump-shooter (or long-range shooter in the case of Bonner).

    GitErDun
    August 29th, 2010 at 3:38 pm

    “Damn, I have once again forgotten to ask permission to have an opinion on 48 Minutes of Hell. Just seems to me that the following quote about says it all – “he’s the best big man role player left in free agency.” Yup Fersure that will win another title, Yup- SHO enuf.”

    I have NO idea what you’re talking about. But maybe that was your point, to not be clear? So I’m left wondering if you even understood anything that I said? Oh well, perhaps it will remain a mystery. Keep those opinions coming.

  • http://www.48minutesofhell.com Timothy Varner

    Gents,

    Please everyone put your sabres away. A couple of quick points: we like debate, and we like intelligent dialogue. But we don’t want those things to dissolve into nastiness. In this regard, I’m with Jim. But Jim, Winston Churchill once described a fanatic as one who can’t change his mind and won’t change the subject. You sometimes come across as a fanatic, at least in the Churchhillian sense. Sometimes it’s enough to make your point once and back away.

    Having said that, embrace the disagreements, fellas. It’s half the fun. Just keep your heads about you as you do it.

  • http://www.48minutesofhell.com Timothy Varner

    GitErDun,

    Please, by all means, opine. You’re fine by me.

  • andy

    i have to say, ad hominem attacks are the refuge of the feeble minded; no one with any credulity takes you seriously once you make them.

    that said jim, you make just as many assumptions as anyone else on the board, if not always to the same degree. i’ve never taken particular exception to anything you’ve said, because i appreciate analysis and discourse, but to call yourself “objective” and then conveniently ignore or downplay other people’s just as valid assumptions (not everyone’s, because some people throw out crazy ideas) is, again, disingenuous. these are your opinions, and though based in a modicum of fact, have just as much supposition as many of our opinions.

    1. splitter was generally regarded as a lottery talent for years, but his buyout and complications with bringing him over dropped him into our laps. if his situation were simpler, we would’ve had no shot at him. credit our front office’s patience for that.

    2. his mid-range shot is not particularly an asset. it’s his post work, passing, and p&r defense that stand out, and would most be an asset to us this coming season.

    3. though i like amundson, his addition is not going to let us compete for a championship. does it give us a better shot? maybe a fraction of a chance better, and saying it pushes us over the top, or even puts us in the same conversation as frontcourts like l.a.’s, portland’s, or houston’s, is wishful conjecture. if i’m holt, i don’t shell out another million for that tiny fraction.

    look, we’re all fans here. i’m one that believes we have a microscopic shot at the title, even as presently constructed. sure, i’m going to be upset when we lose, joyous when we win, but i’m not going to get bent out of shape when pop pulls blair for blowing a rotation, or buford for not signing amundson. learn perspective, people.

  • Bushka

    I like Lou in those situational minutes. If he could be had cheap without giving up McDyess i’d be all over it.

    Anytime you get to add a legitimate tough defending shot blocking role player kind of guy at a good price it works for me.

  • Jim Henderson

    Timothy Varner
    August 29th, 2010 at 6:20 pm

    “But Jim, Winston Churchill once described a fanatic as one who can’t change his mind and won’t change the subject. You sometimes come across as a fanatic, at least in the Churchhillian sense. Sometimes it’s enough to make your point once and back away.”

    I’m an aggressive debater that comes to the table armed with logic, common sense, and statistical facts. If people want to keep coming after me with unsubstantiated assertions about a previous point I made, than I’m going to engage them. If people are going to keep talking about how great our front line is, and I see an opening during the thread to mention going after Lou Amundson, a FA that’s still available, that could further improve our front line, and that in my view is a perfect fit for this team, I’m likely to bring it up on occasion, as I have at several points over this past month. Most of my comments about Amundson have been in “response” to others expressing unsubstantiated disagreements from many on here that he could help, not from me “initiating” a long-winded conversation about him repetitively. And so I’m certainly not a fanatic in the sense of being “close-minded”, or being overly stubborn by incessantly proselytizing a particular cause for primarily ideological reasons, as in the Churchillian sense. This blog is not that serious. I engage about the Spurs for fun more than anything else. I guess some fans just take my well-intentioned Spurs critique too seriously. That said, it is true I can be a zealous advocate for just a plain good old idea, and I certainly don’t like the notion of recoiling into a status quo mind-set simply to avoid change. That can be insidiously stultifying, and ultimately unsatisfying for most people, as well as for professional organizations. And so I guess if that’s fanatical, then I’m proud to be a fanatic!

    Good job though, Tim, injecting yourself into the conversation at this point. Things were starting to get a little dicey. Thanks for that, and keep up the good work.

  • Jim Henderson

    andy
    August 29th, 2010 at 6:38 pm

    “…that said jim, you make just as many assumptions as anyone else on the board..”

    Sorry, Andy, but that’s not true.

    “..splitter was generally regarded as a lottery talent for years…”

    Well, he wasn’t drafted that high, so ultimately the lottery speculation is just that, speculation. And even if there’s some truth to it, he was considered at late lottery pick at best, and most late lottery picks don’t become “very good” NBA players. Again, look at the draft history.

    “his mid-range shot is not particularly an asset.”

    He has an acceptable mid-range game that could probably continue to improve with better coaching from the Spurs staff.

    “saying it pushes us over the top, or even puts us in the same conversation as frontcourts like l.a.’s, portland’s, or houston’s, is wishful conjecture.”

    If you’re implying that I said this, you’re wrong. It does make us more competitive with these front courts than we are now, and thus gives us a better chance of getting to the WCF’s, which should be our goal this year. If we get there, let’s be as confident as we can that we can get an upset. But we won’t even have a chance if we don’t get there. As far as Holt being worried about salary, as I said, I would do McDyess in a sign & trade with the Suns. Dice is making a bit more than Amundson will get for next season.

    Bushka
    August 29th, 2010 at 7:22 pm

    “If he could be had cheap without giving up McDyess i’d be all over it.”

    He’s too good to be had “cheap”, and so because we don’t have the money, it would be difficult to get him without McDyess in the deal. After all, we’re probably not the only team that is thinking a sign & trade for Lou. We need to beat them out, and McDyess could help do that. And as I said, with Timmy, Dice now makes our front line too old anyways to compete with the younger front lines in the West. If we need another big for insurance, pick a guy up for the vet min., like Mbenga, Boone, or perhaps Singleton.

  • Sam

    This is just a spurs blog, calm down a little. Calling people dicks is really immature and whats sad is that i’m a 13 year old. I don’t care if you take my comments seriously or not but we’re all spurs fans. The posts lately make me feel like i’m at a cavs blog.

  • Hobson13

    Jim Henderson
    August 29th, 2010 at 6:15 pm
    “If someone’s going imply that a 28th pick in the draft (Splitter) is somehow “very likely” to be an impact player in his first year in the NBA, then he needs to “educate” himself…”

    Wait a second, Jim. This guy is not some 19 year old kid who jumped into the draft after a decent year in college. In short, he is not your run-of-the-mill 28 pick. This man has proven himself for several years in a league that while a step lower than NBA is also a step higher than the Division I college ball.

    I’ve heard numerous “experts” opine that he is similar in both skill and ability to the Cavs Anderson Varejao who was recently ranked #15 center in the league by Yahoo (BTW McDyess wasn’t ranked at all so Splitter is an immediate upgrade). If you truly doubt his ability to be an impact player on the Spurs you are in the vast minority of not only average Spur fans, but also of people who closely follow the league. And please don’t give me that nonsense that “We can’t be 100% SURE about anything.” Of course we can’t. We don’t have 100% assurances of ANYTHING outside of death and taxes, but we can reasonably assume that Splitter, based on his years of basketball, will be an impact player on the Spurs. In fact, it’s unreasonable to assume otherwise.

    “John Wall is the NUMBER ONE pick in the entire draft, and even he is far from guaranteed to become a perennial all-star. Splitter was a NUMBER TWENTY-EIGHT pick. The odds of a 28th pick becoming even a regular, solid rotation player is not high…”

    You must know that this comparison is highly flawed. We have much more data and information on a 25 year old Splitter who has played professional ball for years than we do on a 19 year old Wall who played 1 year of college ball. Again, you are acting as if we have NO idea what Splitter can bring to the table. The Spurs FO has years of history to draw upon when analyzing Splitter. We should know what we are getting with Splitter with only minor degrees of variance.

    andy
    August 29th, 2010 at 6:38 pm

    I agree with all 3 of your points especially the point regarding Splitter.

  • JustinFL

    Wow! I wish I had a dollar for everytime Mr. Henderson had to defend his Amundson pickup. It would be an excellent pickup. Not great excellent. I got the valid point like 2 weeks ago. No one ever said he would be a starter or get a significant amount of minutes. No one ever said he would be a saviour of any sort. He would be a situational big just like Bonner and Mcdyess.
    We need more depth especially in the frontcourt coming off the bench. What a guy like Amundson brings is contagious. There are certain players on this team that need to catch his fire and spirit. It’s not measured so much in stats. Think how awful Phoenix is defensively and how he was able to make an impact. Imagine him on an already top 10 defensive team. (Assuming we make the top 10 next season).
    As many have stated before on this blog, our offense is fine. We’ll find ways to score. Defense fuels the offense. All this fuss over him and we’re probably not going to get him. So that just adds more frustration. With that said, what are our options for getting him? Do we have enough money left to sign him outright? Or would we have to settle for a sign and trade?

  • Jim Henderson

    Hobson13
    August 29th, 2010 at 8:35 pm

    “This man has proven himself for several years in a league that while a step lower than NBA is also a step higher than the Division I college ball.”

    The fact is he has not proven himself in the NBA. There is a distinction. Granted, at this point, you like your chances with him more than you would with a 20-22 year old #28 pick coming straight out of college. But the point is, it is nowhere near a lock that Splitter will be a consistent impact player for us this year, and that he could catapult this team to a WCF appearance, and yet that is how he’s often talked about on this blog.

    “And please don’t give me that nonsense that “We can’t be 100% SURE about anything.” Of course we can’t. We don’t have 100% assurances of ANYTHING outside of death and taxes, but we can reasonably assume that Splitter, based on his years of basketball, will be an impact player on the Spurs. In fact, it’s unreasonable to assume otherwise.”

    The idea is at what level of confidence should one have right now, based on all that we now know, that Splitter will provide the impact this team needs to get to the WCF’s, which would represent an improvement over last years accomplishment? Nobody is talking about 100% sure of anything. Where did you get that from? It’s what level of confidence does one have that Splitter will be able to deliver what we need this year to advance to the WCF’s. At best I say the confidence level is 50%, and while that’s not bad, I’d like to improve on that. And I think adding a guy like Amundson would improve on that, perhaps making the confidence level jump to 65-70%. And I would like that. He gets our front line younger, and would improve our overall team “D”, which we must do to have a chance. I don’t think most of these so-called sports pundits you’re referring to would disagree with what I’ve just said.

    “You must know that this comparison is highly flawed. We have much more data and information on a 25 year old Splitter who has played professional ball for years than we do on a 19 year old Wall who played 1 year of college ball. Again, you are acting as if we have NO idea what Splitter can bring to the table. The Spurs FO has years of history to draw upon when analyzing Splitter. We should know what we are getting with Splitter with only minor degrees of variance.”

    The fact is, Splitter was a #28 pick in the draft. We know now that he’s better than your average #28 pick, but we still don’t know how much better, because a player going from Europe to the NBA doesn’t translate the same way as NBA to NBA, and even that is not always easy to predict. So we had his rights. We either waste the 1st round draft pick by not signing him, or we sign him and hope for the best. Obviously the FO thinks he has a good chance at playing a role in helping this team improve or they wouldn’t have agreed to pay him 3.4 mil per year (I believe around there). But it really doesn’t say that much about how highly the FO values him, or how confident they are that his addition will be sufficient to get us to the next level. It was the safest move available in a cost/benefit ratio way to try and improve this year. Is it enough to get us to the WCF’s this year? In my view, the chances are not very high.

  • Bushka

    Justin it all depends on what you give up to get it.

    Hence the debate.

    We can’t sign him outright so it must be a sign and trade and the suns would want someone like a McDyess in return. They can’t have Blair / Splitter and they already have Matt Bonner in Channing Frye so it’s got to be Dyess.

    Plus he only has a partially guaranteed final year so he can be waived or used as a wonderfully delightful expiring trade chip.

    I think we’d be better off holding onto McDyess because he fills a role. He can shoot/rebound/play nasty D.

    Lou can add something to that conversation, although i’ve always thought of him as a much better weak side shotblocker than a standup guy that could anchor the defence.

    Either way it’s not going to happen. It’s the kind of idle fancy we indulge ourselves in because it is so quiet at this point in time.

    The roster looks set for next season and although many on this forum in particular don’t think we have enough i’m very keen on our chances.

    I believe our D will be better as a team and that this will make a world of difference, I really think Tiago is going to have a huge impact for us in the win/loss column.

  • Jim Henderson

    JustinFL
    August 29th, 2010 at 8:58 pm

    “What a guy like Amundson brings is contagious. There are certain players on this team that need to catch his fire and spirit. It’s not measured so much in stats. Think how awful Phoenix is defensively and how he was able to make an impact. Imagine him on an already top 10 defensive team. (Assuming we make the top 10 next season).”

    A guy that gets it! Thanks, Justin. Now, I think I’m about to faint.

    “With that said, what are our options for getting him? Do we have enough money left to sign him outright? Or would we have to settle for a sign and trade?”

    We would have to do a sign & trade, which I would do in a heartbeat.

  • Jim Henderson

    Bushka
    August 29th, 2010 at 9:27 pm

    I disagree, but a sensible post.

    All I have the energy to say at this point is that I hope you’re right!

  • Bushka

    Just a final word on Splitters .

    He was a 28th pick because of his Euro Heritage and the fact that he had a contract to play out in Spain. He was one of the best euro prospects at the time, however he was also playing professionally with a large buyout clause and was under 22 so he wasn’t an automatic draft inclusion.

    There was very little chance he came to the NBA due to the rookie cap restrictions. That meant he was going to have to give up huge steaming wads of cash unless he waited till the Salary Scale was no longer applicable and the spurs could pick him up at a negotiated price. Which is exactly what he did when he signed his new contract with Saski complete with the perfectly timed opt out window to allow a fresh NBA opportunity.

    Hence the buy out in his contract with Saski Balonia this year

    That he was picked up at all in the first round shows in my opinion just how highly the front office valued him.

    That they waited all this time without using his rights in some minor transaction is a testament to the patience and the long view that this franchises front office implements.

  • Jim Henderson

    Bushka
    August 29th, 2010 at 9:40 pm

    “That he was picked up at all in the first round shows in my opinion just how highly the front office valued him.”

    The Spurs FO at the time obviously thought high enough about him as a “prospect” to draft him late in the 1st round, even though they knew they would have to wait for a significant time to bring him over. Whether one always agrees with them or not, this FO does have more foresight than your average FO. And I basically agree with your synopsis of the last three years of Splitter & the Spurs.

  • Hurm66

    I’m curious to see how Splitter plays today against NBA talent in the Worlds. We should have a better idea of what we’re getting.

    Jim gets on my nerves sometimes, but he’s intelligent and usually knows what he’s talking about. It’s not what you say, it’s how you say it sometimes. Shrug.

    I’d add Amundson if possible. Nothing wrong with having another big, a young one, on the roster. We do need a someone with some bite and nastiness a la Bowen, Ferry, Horry etc.

    This team hasn’t had a chippy player that gets under other teams skins and in their head a la Artest for too long now.

    Unless Denver blows up their roster and has a fire sale, I can’t see them trading with the Spurs. I do believe that Smith has been on the Spurs radar for some time now though. He would fill that Jax, Elie type role of dirty assassin and play good cop/bad cop with Manu on the court. He’s free after this season and the Spurs will have some flexibility next off season. He’s crazy, but this teams needs a small dose of crazy.

  • Hobson13

    “But the point is, it is nowhere near a lock that Splitter will be a consistent impact player for us this year, and that he could catapult this team to a WCF appearance, and yet that is how he’s often talked about on this blog.”

    I still believe you are acting rather coy with regards to Splitters proven abilities, but let’s just agree to disagree. BTW, I’ve never said that Splitter would get us to the WCF. Maybe he will and maybe he won’t. There are simply too many variables and too much basketball to be played between now and May to even consider how far the Spurs might go in next year’s postseason.

    “At best I say the confidence level is 50%, and while that’s not bad, I’d like to improve on that. And I think adding a guy like Amundson would improve on that, perhaps making the confidence level jump to 65-70%.”

    Amundson is simply not good enough to improve our chances by 15-20%. He would have to be a David Lee or Carlos Boozer caliber PF to improve our chances that much. He may be able to improve our chances by 5%. Don’t get me wrong, I’m all for getting Amundson (even though it’s a lost cause at this point) and have certainly supported the idea in previous blogs. However, I suggest that you’ve become too enamoured with a role player who’s been on 4 teams in the past 5 years.

  • rj

    @ tim sorry about the negativity. we all like the spurs and that’s all that really matters

  • rob

    Josh Boone would basically provide the same as Amundson without involving a sign and trade.

    That said…it appears the Spurs’ roster is set for at least the first half of the season. And they probably will want to give a good hard look at Splitter’s play before (if) they were to look to get another post player this season.

    My belief is that the Spurs…if Splitter pans out to be a significant contributor…they keep McDyess…still get positive contribution…and have a better front line than they’ve had in the past 3 years.

    We all know Bonner’s strengths and weaknesses. And again…that’s where Spitter’s play will make an impact as well. If Bonner can be relegated to doing what he does best in limited minutes…that alone will strengthen the Spurs front court compared to the last two seasons.

    I also think the Spurs let Blair play quite a few minutes more the first half of the season to see what transpires in his growth.

    Again..a developmental process that will take until at least the trade deadline to see if the Spurs will be in need of additional front court help.

    The experience of Duncan, McDyess, (and yes even Bonner), can all be used succesfully for this team if Splitter and Blair prove to be significant off the bench. And though the per 36 looks great on paper with regards to a player like Amundson…there’s no gaurantee if he would ever be good on this team just as much as we don’t have an idea regarding Splitter and the development of Blair.

    In that respect…I can see why the Spurs wouldn’t make a move at this time to bring in somebody like Amundson or Boone until they get a better feel and contention of how well Splitter and Blair will perform. There simply wouldn’t be enough minutes to go around to fairly and safely evaluate the talent.

  • Tyler

    In regards to J.R. Smith, he scares the hell out of me. And not in a good, Stephen Jackson way, but in a bad, Ron Artest way. And as opposed to both Ron Artest and Stephen Jackson, I strongly question Smith’s basketball IQ. The guy just seems to do dumb stuff on the court, not to mention his terrible (and that’s putting it lightly) shot selection.

    And if you need a reminder of Artest’s craziness, just watch:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jBx8LSwqRpE

  • zainn

    Do you know who melo’s best friend is on the nuggets? JR smith. He will most likely go wherever melo is going, and obtaining him is highly doubtful. he likes the spotlight. I have very high hopes for splitter, because of the way he has been playing at fiba and in europe. Their basketball is so much rougher than nba basketball in the way fouls are called, and with him having dominance in a league like that shows that he is definitely ready to enter the realms of the nba. Splitter is the answer we have been looking for for the past few seasons, and it will show on opening night against the pacers (I think). Also, I am pretty sure tony will stay in town because of Chris Paul(even though they are good friends). Also, i believe amundson would be great for our roster 10 minutes a night with blair. The spurs have also expressed interest in Thomas Gardner according to hoopshype.com’s frontpage. fyi

  • Bentley

    Amundson would be a nice piece in a Spurs jersey, and I’m all for getting him. I just wonder..if its taken this long for teams to show interest in him, he could probably be had for cheap under the right situation. Or maybe thats just wishful thinking.

    Our team as currently constructed would be a stretch to make it to the WCF’s. Although if you look at it by last year’s playoff performances, the Spurs were top 4 in the west, and unlike the rest of the west, have not gone through any radical changes, and have added Splitter. We are underlooked in this regard, and could be a very good team this year, better than what some are expecting.

    But painfully as it is for us bloggers, all we can do is speculate and wait till the 2010 season tips off. Better yet, wait till about 30 games into the season to know which teams are doing how well?

    Sidebar: Hopefully Splitter plays very well in the Brazilian game against the US

  • spursfanbayarea

    @rob
    Good point on mentioning Boone’s availability. I agree that he would be a serviceable back up big at a low cost. Even if we could use him to eat up some fouls against bigger opponents it would be worth the low cost investment.

    Open question to all.
    What would everyone think about a trade of Mcdyess and Jerrells for JR Smith? Denver needs a big man due to injury to most of their front line. Spurs could use an athletic small forward who can score in bunches. Just a thought for some open discussion.

  • Kevin

    Boy, that escalated quickly. I mean that really got out of hand fast!

    It jumped up a notch.

    It did, didn’t it?

    Yea, I stabbed a man in the heart.

    I saw that! Brick killed a guy.

  • Jim Henderson

    Hobson13
    August 30th, 2010 at 7:24 am

    “Amundson is simply not good enough to improve our chances by 15-20%. He would have to be a David Lee or Carlos Boozer caliber PF to improve our chances that much. He may be able to improve our chances by 5%. Don’t get me wrong, I’m all for getting Amundson (even though it’s a lost cause at this point) and have certainly supported the idea in previous blogs. However, I suggest that you’ve become too enamoured with a role player who’s been on 4 teams in the past 5 years.”

    I don’t agree. Lou’s overall scrappy “D” is contagious (just like JustinFL described him), and his shot-blocking would be a huge compliment to our front line. What’s holding us back from a WCF appearance is inadequate team “D” more than any other factor. And the addition of Lou would have a legitimate shot of being the missing piece that allows us to realistically challenge for a top-five defensive ranking.

    rob
    August 30th, 2010 at 9:00 am

    “Josh Boone would basically provide the same as Amundson without involving a sign and trade.”

    I don’t think Boone is as good as Amundson, or as good of a “fit”, but I do think he could help us on the front line, and would be cheaper, probably allowing us to keep McDyess. Of course acquiring Boone is more realistic than getting Amundson at this point. Six players at the 4/5 spot does get a little crowed though, but I would do it anyway.

    “Again..a developmental process that will take until at least the trade deadline to see if the Spurs will be in need of additional front court help.”

    I’m not in favor of making key additions/subtractions at the trade deadline, certainly not if our intentions are to effectively compete in the playoffs THIS year. Not enough time for the proper adjustments to take place.

    “In that respect…I can see why the Spurs wouldn’t make a move at this time to bring in somebody like Amundson or Boone until they get a better feel and contention of how well Splitter and Blair will perform. There simply wouldn’t be enough minutes to go around to fairly and safely evaluate the talent.”

    I think that approach is too conservative. If we want to truly challenge for a title soon we will need to be more measurably bold in our actions. That has not taken place this off-season. And there would be enough minutes for Amundson or Boone if we were willing to reduce McDyess & Bonner’s minutes accordingly, which I think would be the appropriate thing to do, especially after the new addition was around long enough (e.g., 20-30 games) to effectively get acclimated.

  • Bushka

    I worry about adding someone at the trade deadline. As we saw with RJ last year, the Spurs schemes are sometimes tough to get through.

    If the piece you pick up at the deadline can’t put it all together in half a season they are kind of wasted.

    Obviously it’s going to be different depending on what position they play. A backup big can learn from Duncan, where as RJ was front and centre in the spotlight.

  • Mark

    @Kevin

    Haha. Nice! Love the “Anchorman” quotes.

  • Mark

    @Bushka

    I agree. If the Spurs should get someone new, they should do it before the season starts rather than before the trade deadline.

  • JustinFL

    I think I’m beginning to see the dilemma. We desperately need more shotblocking(Lou), but would have to give up something in order to get it. Then the question becomes what can we afford to give up and what is Phoenix willing to take? They are certaintly not about to do us any favors. I can’t necessarily agree with giving up Mcdyess even though he gets on my nerves sometimes. He acts like an old bag of bones, but he can hit an open shot, plays decent defense, and every once in awhile surprises me with a good play.
    Lou is quicker and more commited defensively. At this point I feel it’s a gamble that we would have to wait and see how it played out. I’ll tell you this, I would much more like to see Lou and Bonner coming off the bench than Mcdyess and Bonner. Lou would get his scoring mostly off offensive rebounds and hustle plays. Besides defense our rebounding has went down drastically over the past seasons. I remember watching the playoffs last year yelling at the tv because we struggled just getting the defensive rebound.
    That is another thing Lou does better than McDyess. Rebound! So as it stands, I guess I would like to see that trade happen. Lou for Mcdyess but hopefully not for much more than that. So in a nutshell, do I want to trade a guy who is old and can hit an open shot for a younger player who blockshots, defends, rebounds, is unselfish, knows his role and takes pride in it, yes I would. Will it happen? Probably not.
    The Spurs seem to have a certain loyalty with their players. Sometimes it’s worked for us and sometimes it hasn’t. Most likely the FO would respond to whether McDyess wanted to be traded or not. I so hope I’m wrong and they make an effort to upgrade the defense and rebounding we need.

  • http://www.yahoo.com TITO

    First and foremost, I believe The Spurs have upgraded their roster in a very positive way; simply by adding james anderson and Gary Neal means alot, I’m totally amazed by the way they both play. Neal is a pure shooter who when given the chance will rack up points because he has done it before, and James Anderson was a player that averaged over 20 points a game, and he always draws several defenders because he can score at will if not double teamed. Now imagine Spurs Fans the gifts that we have now Tiago splitter and Dejauan Blair, improved manu and a hungry for a big buck contract Tony Parker, someone will remember my post because The spurs will defeat the lakers in 7 for the conference Finals. and will defeat the Heat and claim their last two championships in the Duncan Era. San Antonio is Too good and rich Talented this year Gary Neal, and James Anderson will be the x- factors throughout the season. Gary Neal is due for a break out year he deserves and will be a future all star mark my words. GOOOO Spurs GOOOO

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